47 replies to this topic

[El Bandito]

With the C-Bill nerf, people are trying to find ways to maximize their earnings. Some are trying to simply suicide rush the enemy to get as much assists possible before dying. I found another way, using Savior Kills. Obviously you need to win to be able to take full advantage of this method but this is less risky since you will be using long range weapons. You can get 300,000 C-Bills and 3,000XP easily with Premium and Hero mechs such as the Dragon Slayer or Heavy Metal if you follow this method.

However, Savior Killing opportunity does not arrive as much as we like. Therefore we need to do something about that by ourselves. We gotta outsmart the system. Now correct me if I am wrong, but to get Savior Kills you or your ally need to have exposed internals/blown parts and armor value below certain threshold (50%?), and if you or your allies kill that enemy that is shooting at you in a fire fight you get a Savior Kill along with your ally.
So basically this is what I did 15 minutes ago, before joining a fight.

1. Stripped the front left torso armor from my HGN-773C (any Highlander variant is ok) and put them all in the rear armor so technically I still have full armor on that torso.

2. Removed everything of value from the entire left side of the torso. No weapons, no equipments.

3. Packed a Gauss and dual PPCs (ERPPCS are fine too) on the right side. Naturally rest of the tonnage went to Heatsinks, JJs and Std 300 engine. That way I still retain 100% of my long range offensive capabilities.



Basically I want my left torso + left arm to be blown early in the engagement so I will be able to reach the Savior Kill conditions easily. Since the left torso still technically had full armor it will shave off a lot of armor % from the mech along with the arm that goes with it.

In my game it worked. I got my empty left torso and left arm blown before the big fight and made a lot of Savior Kills before the match ended. Got 52000 C-Bills and 1200 XP just on Savior Kill alone. The enemy naturally tried to blow my left torso since my info told them it does not have armor protection. And once it blows up, others will think I am heavily wounded and try to engage me, thus making the Savior Kill condition much easier.
Unfortunately I made a team kill and that reduced my reward, but I got a lot more C-Bills and XP in this game than games in which I performed much better on KDR. Earning almost 170,000 C-Bills and 2000 XP without Premium or Hero mech is crazy good.



However, I am not 100% sure if those Savior kills happened due to my method or not. You guys can try it out if you are desperate for C-Bills. It is best to use a mech that has disproportionally huge firepower on one side (I used Highlander) to achieve this since you want the other side gone with minimum penalty to your offensive capability.

From Smurfy, I can see the following mechs good for such strategy.

1. All Centurions.
2. All Hunchbacks except the 4SP.
3. All Quickdraws.
4. Cataphract 3D.
5. Dragon Slayer (Victor Hero). Other Victors are somewhat fine if you are willing to forfeit your ballistic right side.
6. All Highlanders. Heavy Metal will need to lose the ballistic right side


Cheers.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2013 - 04:39 AM.

[GingerBang]

The most reliable way i have found is to just run in with a light and do as much damage to as many people as possible before dying. You average around 80-110k a match, and they only last two minutes tops. You just need mechs to keep switching too, so it doesn't work from square 1.

[Kernfeuer]

...not sure what to say about this...

but what i can say so far is....income is to low..and so..who blame player like him to invent some methodes to expand his income?...yeah..blame pgi for this..not that i would do the same thing ..but i get his message..hopefully pgi does too.....

[GODzillaGSPB]

PGI could compliment this idea with a new camo, one that paints a huge bulls-eye on the location you want to get hit!

But seriously, the most relyable way to get more cbills is to abuse the living daylight out of the matchmaking system. Drop with a full Atlas lance. Or an all light lance. Show them that you have no honor, but are rich! Because rich >>>> honor!

[stjobe]

I guess a thread like this was inevitable. Can't fault the OP for pointing it out, even though I think it's an incredibly cheesy thing to do, and borderline exploiting (please note the key word borderline before whipping out the flame thrower).

Hopefully it shows PGI that they either have to:
1. Increase the match rewards (either by just upping them a bit or by introducing new ones - I support the latter).
2. Adjust the Savior (and Defensive) assist mechanic (which I've always found a bit broken - it's more profitable than anything else, and has been a staple of light 'mech XP earning since its introduction).
3. Penalize 'mechs for dropping without armour like the OP shows, perhaps by
4. Re-work the damage transfer mechanic so that full damage transfers to the CT in this case.

Which of these solutions would be the best, well, I listed them in my preferred order. YMMV.

Edited by stjobe, 09 August 2013 - 03:18 AM.

[Sephlock]

GingerBang, on 09 August 2013 - 01:24 AM, said:

The most reliable way i have found is to just run in with a light and do as much damage to as many people as possible before dying. You average around 80-110k a match, and they only last two minutes tops. You just need mechs to keep switching too, so it doesn't work from square 1.

This never, ever works for me, because when I pug I consistently end up on the same team as 11 of these guys:



And we lose to either basecap or roflstomp, resulting in me getting no assists >_<.

[El Bandito]

stjobe, on 09 August 2013 - 03:15 AM, said:

I guess a thread like this was inevitable. Can't fault the OP for pointing it out, even though I think it's an incredibly cheesy thing to do, and borderline exploiting (please note the key word borderline before whipping out the flame thrower). Hopefully it shows PGI that they either have to: 1. Increase the match rewards (either by just upping them a bit or by introducing new ones - I support the latter). 2. Adjust the Savior (and Defensive) assist mechanic (which I've always found a bit broken - it's more profitable than anything else, and has been a staple of light 'mech XP earning since its introduction). 3. Penalize 'mechs for dropping without armour like the OP shows, perhaps by 4. Re-work the damage transfer mechanic so that full damage transfers to the CT in this case. Which of these solutions would be the best, well, I listed them in my preferred order. YMMV.

As long as it forces PGI to up their rewards again, I will choose any method to help fellow players to earn back their C-Bills. Besides, I did drop with full armor on my left torso--it is just all in the rear.

Personally I prefer option 1, but option 3 will also be beneficial by getting rid of zombies.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2013 - 03:43 AM.

[Chemie]

Back with R&R, the rewards were such that it invited exploits. Purpleflufybunny had the suicide rush as the best method. I think this will comeback now. If PGI does do not pay enough, or people lose money per game (after cool shot), they will be forced into suicide rushing. Run in, laser every enemy to get assists and hope your team wins 11v12. Dumb but I bet you will start to see it.

BTW, even new players can do since they have those trial mechs too.

As pointed out in another thread, pure scout now makes ~30k but suicide light makes double that and can get 4x the number of drops. That means suicide rush pays out ~8x times as much. That is a strong incentive to exploit. (Also, the rewards are heavily favoring assault mechs vs light but who suicides in an assault?)

Also, if people are targeting the left side of an HGN, ELO MM needs help too cuz dude you are not going up against the right pool of players. Just saying.

Edited by Chemie, 09 August 2013 - 03:45 AM.

[El Bandito]

Chemie, on 09 August 2013 - 03:37 AM, said:

Back with R&R, the rewards were such that it invited exploits. Purpleflufybunny had the suicide rush as the best method. I think this will comeback now. If PGI does do not pay enough, or people lose money per game (after cool shot), they will be forced into suicide rushing. Run in, laser every enemy to get assists and hope your team wins 11v12. Dumb but I bet you will start to see it. BTW, even new players can do since they have those trial mechs too. As pointed out in another thread, pure scout now makes ~30k but suicide light makes double that and can get 4x the number of drops. That means suicide rush pays out ~8x times as much. That is a strong incentive to exploit. (Also, the rewards are heavily favoring assault mechs vs light but who suicides in an assault?) Also, if people are targeting the left side of an HGN, ELO MM needs help too cuz dude you are not going up against the right pool of players. Just saying.

Dude, my method is definitely NOT suicide rush. I still retain all my offensive capabilities and still helping my team and is still hard to kill and it has much less risk of dying. My method is actually even more profitable than suicide rush since PPCs/ERPPCs + Gauss will let you engage the enemy from comfortable distance while racking up those Savior Kills.

170000 C-Bills and 1950 XP for mere 1 kill and 8 assists is crazy good. Also, if you are playingin the Elo range where people target the right side of HGN, you should be good enough to cover your right side when not Alphaing your Gauss+PPCs.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2013 - 04:43 AM.

[stjobe]

Just rushing in and tagging everything for assists won't net you all that much, you need to make sure you get the Savior or Defensive assists - especially if you're also after XP and not just CB.

Compare (please excuse the pre-patch numbers, haven't had time to adjust them yet):
Assist: 7,500 CB
Kill: 50 XP + 5,000 CB
Kill/assist bonus: 150XP divided proportionally between damage dealers

Saviour/defensive kills: 150 XP + 7500 CB in addition to the above.
Saviour/defensive assists: 150 XP + 7500 CB in addition to the above.

A single Saviour assist grants you fully double the amount of CB a regular assist would, and three times the XP of a kill.

[MustrumRidcully]

El Bandito, on 09 August 2013 - 03:49 AM, said:

Dude, my method is definitely NOT suicide rush. I still retain all my offensive capabilities and still helping my team and is still hard to kill. My method is actually even more profitable than suicide rush since PPCs/ERPPCs + Gauss will let you engage the enemy from comfortable distance while racking up those Savior Kills.

170000 C-Bills and 1950 XP for mere 1 kill and 8 assists is crazy good.

And it's more likely to result in your team winning, which is the problem with suicide rushing - a suicider doesn't help much for winning a match, so if there are too many suiciders, the "tactic" doesn't work anymore. Though there will never be a large number of players that would suicide rus, so it mostly works out for those doing it, but of course, suck for everyone else.

[stjobe]

A simple "fix" for this "exploit" (again, please note the scare quotes before grabbing the torches and pitchforks) would be to just disallow Savior assists if the 'mech that triggers the Savior assist is your own.

The patch notes for the patch that introduced Savior and Defensive bonuses (March 5th patch) states:

Quote

Savior Kills: Upon killing an enemy Mech. If that enemy had been attacking a teammate who has a critical component that is 50% health or lower within the last 10 seconds you will be awarded 7500CBills, and 150XP.

Please note the word "teammate"; the bonus isn't really supposed to trigger if it's your own 'mech the target is firing on, although it has been doing that since it was introduced.

[El Bandito]

stjobe, on 09 August 2013 - 04:05 AM, said:

A simple "fix" for this "exploit" (again, please note the scare quotes before grabbing the torches and pitchforks) would be to just disallow Savior assists if the 'mech that triggers the Savior assist is your own. The patch notes for the patch that introduced Savior and Defensive bonuses (March 5th patch) states: Please note the word "teammate"; the bonus isn't really supposed to trigger if it's your own 'mech the target is firing on, although it has been doing that since it was introduced.

Since PGI hadn't taken any action against it, it must be working as intended. I agree that it is an exploit, albeit a very minor one. However, as long as PGI nerfs C-Bill gain, I would not begrudge players for earning extra currency using the back door. Without blatantly suiciding of course.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2013 - 04:37 AM.

[Elizander]

I will certainly try this. I have enough zombie mechs.

Can you drop with a friend and have them blow off your side torso?

Edited by Elizander, 09 August 2013 - 04:17 AM.

[El Bandito]

Elizander, on 09 August 2013 - 04:16 AM, said:

I will certainly try this. I have enough zombie mechs. Can you drop with a friend and have them blow off your side torso?

I am sure you can. But don't take my word for it.

[stjobe]

El Bandito, on 09 August 2013 - 04:12 AM, said:

Since PGI hadn't taken any action against it, it must be working as intended. I agree that it is an exploit, albeit a very minor one. However, as long as PGI nerfs C-Bill gain, I would not begrudge players for earning extra currency using the back door. Without blatantly suiciding of course.

Oh I agree, hence the very careful wording of my posts. The tactic you describe, while incredibly cheesy, is infinitely preferable to Suicide Running.

I'm pretty sure though that this state of lowered CB income is only in preparation for the CW House/Corp/LW rewards to come - although why they had to adjust the rewards before those are in I cannot fathom. Would have made more sense to adjust all of it at once.

Then again, I don't presume to know what PGI are thinking; they move in mysterious ways

[Ph30nix]

this is what happens when they increase the grind (by lowering cbills) people find ways to tweak the system

[Alistair Winter]

El Bandito, what do you need all this money for? You've been a member since closed beta, you should have at least two of every mech variant in your mech bay by now

While I do think the lower C-bill reward is ridiculous, it doesn't really affect me personally. I've bought all my favourite mechs a long time ago, as seen in my sig. Sometimes I get something extra, like a Victor, but when you have every variant of 4-6 mechs, I think you've pretty much covered the whole MW:O experience. Playing a Victor isn't that different from playing a Highlander.

I do understand the collect 'em all mentality, but every time I force myself to grind to afford and master new mechs, I inevitably end up feeling like I wasted time, and then I just go back to playing my favourite mechs. Raven, Centurion, Catapult, Cataphract, Awesome... the cream of the crop.

[El Bandito]

Ph30nix, on 09 August 2013 - 05:10 AM, said:

this is what happens when they increase the grind (by lowering cbills) people find ways to tweak the system

Alistair Winter, on 09 August 2013 - 05:33 AM, said:

El Bandito, what do you need all this money for? You've been a member since closed beta, you should have at least two of every mech variant in your mech bay by now

This is not for me. I had stopped playing MWO since July 30th patch to silently protest the direction MWO is taking. I only log into MWO to test stuff or gather materials for my videos now.

This is for other players, who are in need of C-Bills and XP to purchase 3 mechs just to ride one in full capacity. Who want modules that are out of their immediate reach. Whose earnings have been reduced through illogical thought.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 August 2013 - 05:44 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

El Bandito, on 09 August 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

This is not for me. I had stopped playing MWO since July 30th patch. I only log into MWO to test stuff now.

This is for other players, who are in need of C-Bills and XP.

Though this might work. Is gaming the system really playing MechWarrior El? If you like playing the game and have fun, killing 1 and assisting on 3, should be good enough.

Have you tried an Alt account to see how fast a New player can earn the scratch for a personal Mech? That is the true better test on how borked the economy is.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 09 August 2013 - 05:45 AM.