79 replies to this topic

[Gremlich Johns]

Trothkin,

The current plan for PGI is to have the Clan mechs "balanced" against the IS tech and teams set for 12v12. PGI has alluded to starting with 12v12 THEN will consider 10v12 (probably if 12v12 proves too roflstomp against the stravag IS).

How will this impact what you do with MW:O when/after Community Warfare kicks in? For myself, two options: 1) stop playing MW:O regularly, or, 2) play 12v12 as a Clansman and do my level best to stomp the doo-doo out of the opposing IS team.

views?

[Pariah Devalis]

IMO anyone who is driven to such rage as to quit the game (with or without any sort of regularity) based entirely on the issue of 12v12 vs 12v10 probably should stop playing, if only to see a shrink about their apparent rage issues, considering that, in the overall picture of MWO as a balanced game, is a fairly minor issue. Might irk the lorehounds, but quit worthy rage seems unnecessary if 12v12 is really the only way they can balance the game.

For me? 12v12 or 12v10, I could not care less. I get to play a Mechwarrior game with Clan mechs representing Clan Nova Cat. I get to do the fun stomp stomp and pew pews either way, quiaff? The number of mechs on the field do nothing to keep me from choosing to fight honorably or uphold the Clan's integrity.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 19 February 2014 - 06:15 AM.

[Craig Steele]

Gremlich Johns, on 19 February 2014 - 05:22 AM, said:

Trothkin,

The current plan for PGI is to have the Clan mechs "balanced" against the IS tech and teams set for 12v12. PGI has alluded to starting with 12v12 THEN will consider 10v12 (probably if 12v12 proves too roflstomp against the stravag IS).

How will this impact what you do with MW:O when/after Community Warfare kicks in? For myself, two options: 1) stop playing MW:O regularly, or, 2) play 12v12 as a Clansman and do my level best to stomp the doo-doo out of the opposing IS team.

views?

For me its about the balance, I could be swayed either side.

If 12 v 12 is balanced I will prob enjoy seeing all the varied IS mechs on the field.

If 10 v 12 is balanced than I suspect IS mechs are a historical refernece point and nothing else, most battles will be 10 Clan vs 10 Clan (tech, not faction).

Personally I can switch factions and enjoy the game for what it is as long as it is balanced.

[MechB Kotare]

Pariah Devalis, on 19 February 2014 - 06:09 AM, said:

IMO anyone who is driven to such rage as to quit the game (with or without any sort of regularity) based entirely on the issue of 12v12 vs 12v10 probably should stop playing, if only to see a shrink about their apparent rage issues, considering that, in the overall picture of MWO as a balanced game, is a fairly minor issue. Might irk the lorehounds, but quit worthy rage seems unnecessary if 12v12 is really the only way they can balance the game.

For me? 12v12 or 12v10, I could not care less. I get to play a Mechwarrior game with Clan mechs representing Clan Nova Cat. I get to do the fun stomp stomp and pew pews either way, quiaff? The number of mechs on the field do nothing to keep me from choosing to fight honorably or uphold the Clan's integrity.

This.

Despite on how OP clan mech should be comparing to IS via TT rules, i'm glad that Pgi wants to implement our tech the way they intent.

Balanced. After all, if they were OP, who would we fight againt?

I'd really love to see Stars implemented, but not if it messes up the balance in general.

[Craig Steele]

MechB Kotare, on 19 February 2014 - 06:32 AM, said:

This.

Despite on how OP clan mech should be comparing to IS via TT rules, i'm glad that Pgi wants to implement our tech the way they intent.

Balanced. After all, if they were OP, who would we fight againt?

I'd really love to see Stars implemented, but not if it messes up the balance in general.

Alot of people seem to be supporting 10 v 12 which I can understand the empathy behind, but I just cannot support myself.

Its basically saying lets balance clan tech to IS. Which to me is not ideal.

We should be saying lets balance IS tech to Clan imo.

Star vs 2 lances (5 vs 8) sounds right to me, gives Omni's a sense of that 2 v 1 'power' canon supports and still holds true to the lore behind the Clans.

OFC, IS team with 3 mech advantage is significant so hence the "OP' of Clan mechs, but you know thats what its about rgiht?

[Gremlich Johns]

Pariah Devalis, on 19 February 2014 - 06:09 AM, said:

IMO anyone who is driven to such rage as to quit the game (with or without any sort of regularity) based entirely on the issue of 12v12 vs 12v10 probably should stop playing, if only to see a shrink about their apparent rage issues, considering that, in the overall picture of MWO as a balanced game, is a fairly minor issue.

A tad harsh and you presume much - there is no rage on my part, however you may perceive my post. I would actually drop the game if I didn't think that ultimately CW might just work, I just find the game not particularly any more different or challenging to play than it was when Closed Beta began. I do appreciate that they need to not discourage new players from continuing to play this game, but there are as many Clan-centric players as IS-centric players and to not balance things with an even hand could degrade future gameplay when CW lands. Forced 10v12 play with Clan tech close to canon would contribute much "realism" to the lore and fiction. I allot 2-3 hours twice a week to play MW:O with a few of the guys I have been gaming with for more than 15 years. It is just something to do while we catch up. MW:O needs to be more than something in the background. It has yet to achieve that and evening everything out diminishes the IP.

[Uncle Totty]

10 vs 12. I want the Clans to feel like the Clans.

[Featherwood]

Balance is paramount for sessional shooter, so no wonder ClanTech will be altered to suit MWO reality, I have no problems with it. I am eager to accept challenge of 2 Clan stars versus 3 IS lances combat. If you chose Clans you must be ready for tough competition. I see 10vs12/10vs10 setup from three perspectives:

• Immersion theme, I want to play as clansman and have no interest in IS strifes. Period.
  
• Challenge and diversion from IS themed gameplay
  
• Balance can be assymetrical, read weight/skill(ELO?) limits

I hope PGI will create something like Gaijins' did in War Thunder: different leagues, so we could choose common 12vs12 queue or CW queue with 12ISvs12IS/12ISvs10C/10Cvs10C setup. I do not like idea of compulsory 12vs12 teams (mixed Tech) without opportunity to play as Clan/IS player only, but I think it is most probable nearest future developments

As for your question, I have stopped playing only in case of terrific in-game balance issues, the same rule will apply for my future breaks, it is the only valid non-real-life break condition, in my opinion.

Edit: typos

Edited by Featherwood, 19 February 2014 - 07:15 AM.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

What about IS pilots using ' salvaged ' clan chassis?

/tinfoil hat

I can see the groups of IS pilots sync dropping their clan chassis to overpower clan factions.

/remove hat

I hope players are able to choose between a Great House or Merc Unit and also a Clan, and that clan chassis will only fight IS chassis. (erhrm, for the time being)

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 19 February 2014 - 07:29 AM.

[Lukoi Banacek]

PGI decided tbis issue when they offered open sales to all of the playerbase regarding Clan packs.

It will cause more people to leave if suddenly IS players who bought Clanpacks can not play with their friends due to 10v12 balancing. All of the arguments about separate cues end the same way. Keeping the vast number of casual players is more important to PGI than keeping lore-hounds. The latter will either suck it up or they will dribble away in smaller numbers and have even less of a voice in this game.

Balance trumps lore in this case, right or wrong, and PGIs decision to go the route they have gone will seal that imo.

My prediction is 12v12 is here to stay. It offers the largest pool of players to play together as opposed to splitting queues by tech. Secondly....they can barely balance tech as it is. Do we honestly believe they will try to gauge the value of two mechs worth of tech in order to be balanced for 10v12 while at the same time cutting up the queues even more?

Oh you want to drop in a VTR but I want to play my Adder? Guess we cannot drop together.

[wanderer]

10v10 for Clan vs Clan, 12v12 IS vs. IS, 10v12 Clan vs. IS.

Because for 12v12, it means you had to nerf Clan 'Mechs so hard as to make them no longer "technically superior" in any sense- you're just another Successor House with funny-looking 'Mechs everyone else can use anyway.

Clan forces are supposed to be numerically inferior but technologically superior. Anything else means they've failed to implement Clan 'Mechs properly and took a steaming dump on the entire thing to grab cash from unsuspecting noobs.

[Pariah Devalis]

Gremlich Johns, on 19 February 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

A tad harsh and you presume much - there is no rage on my part, however you may perceive my post. I would actually drop the game if I didn't think that ultimately CW might just work, I just find the game not particularly any more different or challenging to play than it was when Closed Beta began. I do appreciate that they need to not discourage new players from continuing to play this game, but there are as many Clan-centric players as IS-centric players and to not balance things with an even hand could degrade future gameplay when CW lands. Forced 10v12 play with Clan tech close to canon would contribute much "realism" to the lore and fiction. I allot 2-3 hours twice a week to play MW:O with a few of the guys I have been gaming with for more than 15 years. It is just something to do while we catch up. MW:O needs to be more than something in the background. It has yet to achieve that and evening everything out diminishes the IP.

I actually was not suggesting you were mad, GJ. I have, however, seen more than a fair share of people in the forums and on reddit throwing a temper tantrum every time lore is sacrificed in the name of making a game that is balanced and fun for everyone to play. Anyone who throws themselves into such a tizzy that they rage to the point of quitting when 12v12 clans/is are released probably have deeper seated issues they really aught to work out if the 12v12 is done specifically to keep the game balanced and playable, without causing a mass player migration to Clan tech.

Having said that, I would easily support a lore friendly 10v12 setup if it could be proven to be balanced in the context of not only mech on mech combat but of the various game modes with their capture mechanics. The name of the game here is, again, balance.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 19 February 2014 - 09:13 AM.

[Sharptooth]

I will play MWO no matter what becasue I love the game and battle tech. With that said I would gladly drop against much higher number of IS mech pilots just to have the chance to pilot a overpowered Clan mech. It seem to me the best way to have a playable game environment and still represent clan tech closer to the way it is in battletech.

[Uncl Munkeh]

If I'm not mistaken, lore states that at this time the clans were down-bidding for the honor of facing the IS. If you think 10v12 is the correct balance for that, great.

But be aware, I'm a Merc and I WILL be fielding Clan Tech if I'm allowed to purchase it. Otherwise, what's the point of the game without the new toys.

[PhoenixFire55]

Gremlich Johns, on 19 February 2014 - 05:22 AM, said:

views?

If Clan mechs are gonna be implemented as they plan so far we'll need 18 clanners vs 12 IS for balance.

[Will9761]

I've had matches to where I have dropped with 10 or less people against another group outnumbered. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if we had 10 vs 12 happening with Clan mechs in the future. But I'd be happy to see either 12 vs 12 or 10 v 12 as long as we're facing clan omnimechs.

Edited by Will9761, 19 February 2014 - 09:56 AM.

[Daneiel]

The only way to make everyone happy is PGI to take the road of War Thunder -> different mods - example -> you want to play with your friends without restrictions of the mechs - arena mod - in that mod you gain c-bills and xp x1 rate . If you whant to play something close to the lore , cick on BT mod -> again 12 vs12 with ballanced weapons , but faction based separation - no clan mechs in IS group and the other way too - xp and c-bills x3. 3th mode hardcore - not only the mechs are restricted by the IS vs Clans , but the weapon are with their original stats and limited to non customisation and 10vs12 - xp and c-bills x6 . That is the only way you will have everyone happy , also these mods will give clear perespective what the players wants more and in what mod will work best CW. Sadly will not see anything done in that way .

Edited by daneiel varna, 19 February 2014 - 10:16 AM.

[Uncle Totty]

Here are some ideas on how to help 10 Clan vs 12 IS work.

IS:

1. IS players using Clan tech should run a risk of a malfunction. (It is new to them and they should not know quite how it works.)

2. When they buy "new" Clan mechs, they should be incomplete. (It is salvage after all.)

3. IS tech can be fitted on Clan mechs. (Again, at the risk of malfunction.)

Clans:

1. Clan players can fit SOME Clan tech on their IS mechs.

Thoughts?

[Mazzyplz]

i think 10v12 would be ideal, but being realistic about pgi - we have to rethink the implementation a little bit.

maybe overpowered guns with weaker armor on clanners will win the day in 12v12

[wanderer]

Mazzyplz, on 19 February 2014 - 10:28 AM, said:

i think 10v12 would be ideal, but being realistic about pgi - we have to rethink the implementation a little bit.

maybe overpowered guns with weaker armor on clanners will win the day in 12v12

Clanners have the same armor as everyone else. Read the stuff on MWO's Omnimech construction rules? While you won't be able to change types, they'll be able to max armor like anyone else would.