25 replies to this topic

[Suko]

I try to put at least one or two LRM-10's on most of my mechs with missile hardpoints. I usually don't put more than 30 total LRMs on a mech unless it is a specialized missile boat. With that said, I've used Art IV and I can't say I notice a huge difference in damage delivered to target than without. And when I factor in the cost of the Art IV upgrade + the cost of 1 extra ton and crit per launcher, the benefit just doesn't seem to be there for me. I'd much rather have a few extra heatsinks, more ammo, or even BAP or TAG instead.

What are your thoughts on Artemis IV? When is it good to take it and when is it not?

Edited by ShadowVFX, 20 February 2014 - 02:52 PM.

[Varent]

Run SRM + Artemis.

Prosper.

[Sephlock]

Not on lone LRM5 launchers, especially not on light mechs .

As far as LRM10s go... with only one or two, I'd say... borderline, probably no.

It isn't so much the damage as the accuracy (the tightness of the spread) that gets changed. They sort of overlap, but not really (and not with so few missiles per volley).

[Sandpit]

in most cases YES!

I rarely run any missiles without it unless I'm just running a single launcher of some kind in a mixed loadout type build but anytime I'm running multiple launchers I use it. I was on the fence about it for a long time and took the advice from a few teammates, tried it out, and haven't looked back

[Goose]

Artemis is rather nice … But can get heavy quickly.

I can never remember if it helps with indirect fire, so you might have to rethink your play-style …

[Craig Steele]

ShadowVFX, on 20 February 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

I try to put at least one or two LRM-10's on most of my mechs with missile hardpoints. I usually don't put more than 30 total LRMs on a mech unless it is a specialized missile boat. With that said, I've used Art IV and I can't say I notice a huge difference in damage delivered to target than without. And when I factor in the cost of the Art IV upgrade + the cost of 1 extra ton and crit per launcher, the benefit just doesn't seem to be there for me. I'd much rather have a few extra heatsinks, more ammo, or even BAP or TAG instead.

What are your thoughts on Artemis IV? When is it good to take it and when is it not?

I endorse it for LRM15's and 20's, especially in pairs. Not for 10's and 5's though.

I have a mate who swears by it on SRM 6's but I think AMS wipes out any advantage of Artemis on these weapons. If you're boating them maybe?

[xMEPHISTOx]

Quote

Is Artemis Worth Taking Or Not?

Short answer...Yes.

It increases the accuracy of your missiles (srm/lrm/mml) by up to 35% (<<per sarna, not sure how much for mwo). It is worth finding the extra tonnage to accommodate it.

http://www.sarna.net.../Artemis_IV_FCS

ShadowVFX, on 20 February 2014 - 02:51 PM, said:

I'd much rather have a few extra heatsinks, more ammo, or even BAP or TAG instead.

When possible I will run all 3 of them, BAP for decreased lock time and ECM counter, Artemis for improved accuracy, and TAG for precision aiming with LOS firing.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d17b89f8b864e7c <<< Mech utilizing all three with vid below.



If having tonnage issues will at least try to use Artemis as w/HBK4SP build (no video of this atm) http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9e2824dd9dc8d6d

Edited by xMEPHISTOx, 20 February 2014 - 04:01 PM.

[Sandpit]

http://mwomercs.com/...0089-breakdown/

That contains all the maths for Artemis for ya

Artemis needs LoS for the bonuses as far as I can tell

[Katus]

If you are boating Lurms than ya, Artimes is the way to go. Add in TAG to get those pesky D-DCs with ECM out side of 180m and a BAP to counter an ECM unit close range and then you have a nasty Fire Support Mech.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Taking one or two LRM launchers is really never good to begin with.

Right now LRM 15's and 20's aren't very good due to missile spread and ghost heat penalties.

And LRM 5's and 10's don't really take advantage of Artemis as much.

Best bet if you want to run LRMs is run 2 LRM 5's and 2 LRM 10's (no Artemis), and then a PPC/AC/ERLLas.

It's really messy right now.

[LauLiao]

Craig Steele, on 20 February 2014 - 03:39 PM, said:

I endorse it for LRM15's and 20's, especially in pairs. Not for 10's and 5's though.

Pretty much this with the caveat that LRMs only really seem worthwhile when boated.

With LRM 5s you're essentially increasing the weight of the weapon by 33% and doubling the crit requirement. With 10s it works out to 17% weight and 33% crit. By the time you get to 15s you're only adding about 12.5% weight and 25% crit space. For me it's all about relative expedature.

[DONTOR]

When to take Artemis:
LRM 10s and up (grouping lock on time)
SSRMs (lock on time)
SRM6s (if its your primary weapon)

When not to take Artemis:
LRM5 (already has tight group, TAG weighs 1 ton and can get you that quicker lock)
SSRM/SRM (mix when you dont have much extra tonnage for the SRM portion)
SRM2 (simply rediculous if you do, unless you have to because of a SRM6 mix)
SRM4 (because a SRM6 is its equal, albiet less ammo efficient and slower)

[xMEPHISTOx]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 20 February 2014 - 03:51 PM, said:

Best bet if you want to run LRMs is run 2 LRM 5's and 2 LRM 10's (no Artemis), and then a PPC/AC/ERLLas.

Made something similar to what your speaking of above...but still like Artemis on it.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e97ed00d18af64a
vid of it in action below...

[Varent]

DONTOR, on 20 February 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

When to take Artemis:
LRM 10s and up (grouping lock on time)
SSRMs (lock on time)
SRM6s (if its your primary weapon)

When not to take Artemis:
LRM5 (already has tight group, TAG weighs 1 ton and can get you that quicker lock)
SSRM/SRM (mix when you dont have much extra tonnage for the SRM portion)
SRM2 (simply rediculous if you do, unless you have to because of a SRM6 mix)
SRM4 (because a SRM6 is its equal, albiet less ammo efficient and slower)

agree on everything except srm 4. I regularly use artemis while using srm 4. There is no reason not to if thats what you can fit on your mech. That said I also would not use an srm 4 without artemis. Your begging for dissapointment.

[SirLANsalot]

Artmis is good when you have more then 2 missiles (LRM) on a mech.

In your case OP, its not. Just a pair of LRM 10's is something even I do on most of my mechs with paired launchers (and are not going to be pure brawler). Its nice to take a 2 10's and 3-4 tons of ammo just to be an annoyance to those without AMS, and even when they have an AMS. Your not looking to be doing damage with these, just something to poke at someone at longish range while you move from cover to cover firing your other guns.

Like for an Atlas-D. Twin LRM10, AC20, twin LPL (arms). Great all around mech, works better in brawls but can do the long range annoyance for most of the game.

I do this on Orions too since they basically are mini Attali.




Oh and as a tidbit for any Atlas pilot....NEVER ever use Endo Steel, its 14 crits that you cannot afford to lose, your an 100 ton mech, you have the tonnage for anything. It takes up valuable space for DHS.

Varent, on 20 February 2014 - 04:10 PM, said:

agree on everything except srm 4. I regularly use artemis while using srm 4. There is no reason not to if thats what you can fit on your mech. That said I also would not use an srm 4 without artemis. Your begging for dissapointment.

So very true.

SRM4's benefit a lot from the tigher grouping of Artemis, ya its one more crit and ton for a small weapon....but landing those SRMs in a tight bunch right into a CT....theres just nothing better.

[Sandpit]

LauLiao, on 20 February 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

Pretty much this with the caveat that LRMs only really seem worthwhile when boated.

With LRM 5s you're essentially increasing the weight of the weapon by 33% and doubling the crit requirement. With 10s it works out to 17% weight and 33% crit. By the time you get to 15s you're only adding about 12.5% weight and 25% crit space. For me it's all about relative expedature.

yes and no, you're discounting the lock on speed of 25% so you can figure in the trade-off for a NARC or TAG to get that

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

ALRMs only benefit if you have the target in LoS. If you do a lot of indirect fire, save the weight for more ammo or better secondary weapons or something. Also, as a general rule, Artemis IV is always most efficient when used with larger launchers as far as relative cost increase (for LRMs it's not entirely true for 5s and 15s relative to 10s and 20s, given the weight savings offered by the 5/15 iterations).

ASRMs are generally best if you are taking 6-packs and have the weight and space to spare. It really does help with damage concentration. Smaller launchers seem to spread a bit less, though, and you usually only take them if you are in a smaller mech and can't afford 6s anyway, so Artemis IV isn't a great idea then.

[Suko]

Goose, on 20 February 2014 - 03:32 PM, said:

Artemis is rather nice … But can get heavy quickly.

I can never remember if it helps with indirect fire, so you might have to rethink your play-style …

Good point. IIRC, it does NOT. This is probably a big reason why it isn't working well for me. I'd say 60% of my LRM fire is indirect.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

ShadowVFX, on 21 February 2014 - 10:09 AM, said:

Good point. IIRC, it does NOT. This is probably a big reason why it isn't working well for me. I'd say 60% of my LRM fire is indirect.

Yeah this is a big deal.

[Mechteric]

ShadowVFX, on 21 February 2014 - 10:09 AM, said:

Good point. IIRC, it does NOT. This is probably a big reason why it isn't working well for me. I'd say 60% of my LRM fire is indirect.

Try more direct fire then, you really get more damage in where it hurts and makes your ammo worth more (which means better for you and your team)!

TAG it, BAP it, Art it, and MAKE IT RAIN!!!

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 21 February 2014 - 10:35 AM.