80 replies to this topic

[Mitzli Softpaw]

Thanks, ManaValkyrie, that answered my questions about the public aspect of it. I'm familiar with admin on TS in general, but I was unaware of the free 512 slot server for game clans and nonprofits.

I assume, then, that the free 512 slot server to be used as a public clan server is what you are talking about, then, Lukoi?

Edited by Mitzli Softpaw, 24 March 2014 - 12:10 PM.

[CoffiNail]

This does sound interesting. I say let us do it!

I have been logged on to NGNG's Outreach before NGNG was in existence, when it was MWLL Outreach. It has always been a great aspect to the community. The main reason CGB went to it's own server, aside from being able to use all the server groups, etc that we needed/wanted was so that we could not clog up the user list with a lot of members, as during practice and trials we can easily have 30+ members online.

I think the hardest part is keeping the server neutral and the Clan HUB neutral. We will need a collective group and it set so each Clan that signs up, be they a Star size, Trinary, Cluster or Galaxy has a voice within the HUB.

Establishing things is always the hard part, once we get systems in place the operating of things would be smoother.

I would like a Central HUB... I could then just have Comstar, NGNG, CGB and Clan HUB open vs the 3-5 extra Clan TS sites open like I do, PLUS NGNG, Comstar, etc.

*I also want to add, to Zeries post earlier, that I have had a HUB as a thought being developed, but as he stated unkownly, I had yet to bring this towards any other Clans yet. I had been planning on sending messages to fellow Oathmasters within the other units, but had yet to do so.*

Edited by CoffiNail, 24 March 2014 - 12:43 PM.

[Bongfu]

ManaValkyrie, on 24 March 2014 - 12:01 PM, said:

With regards to TS Servers, you can pay for server hosting which mitigates a lot of hardware/security issues, and provides technical support. However, 'game clan and non-profit organisations' can obtain a free 512 person TS server license direct from TS but you then have to have someone running said server for you, one of your players.etc.

With regards to Admin/TS maintenance, most players can manage it and once people get the hang on the user interface for setting up channels/server groups and such they are pretty self sustaining with basically minimal supervision, although some is always good.

This is a great solution, but ultimately puts power into one person's hands. Having an internet based solution means you can potentially open it up to multiple admins, meaning that power is distributed.

As I have said, I have a base for it already and I am looking for additional help. My dream was to create a clan community, one that fosters honour and integrity as well as unity within the clans. Come Community Warfare, we would be an unstoppable powerhouse which would sweep the Innersphere barbarians away.

To accomplish that though, we have to put time into it. I tried long ago, but I found the work for one man, one clan even, to be daunting. I tried to ask others on board, when they came, they did not come to help. This idea must be pushed forward by multiple clans, people, and authorities.

If anyone would like to help us by building upon the foundations already laid down, then get a hold of Mitz or I. I would gladly take on another web admin, TS admin, and someone to help generate more interest. We have space for Clan channels, even Clan forum and website space.

Lets make this work. I know there are some sour attitudes towards my clan, particularly myself, but I am willing to set aside my pride for the Clan community as a whole. I want very much for us to be the envy of the greater MWO community. I want the Devs to realize we are not to be taken lightly. I want us to be a driving force behind this game for as long as it may last.

We need your help though.

[CoffiNail]

I like this idea of a free 512 man hub. This eliminates a HUGE cost for everyone, and the growth a size like that allows. Is there more information on how this works?

512 users would be hard to right now... maybe when CW is out and some epic stuff goes down... but 512 will be WAY beyond adaquite... and if it cost is low, I say why not?

A Central HUB and TS to go with it is a great stepping stone in a grand community council.

[Mitzli Softpaw]

Two things:

First, is there framework in place right now that we can utilize? I'm asking because I know we have one in the form of the TS we use at the moment, but we're aware that the community ultimately has to be a community of equals. We are willing to give full access to the framework we do have to any and everyone who genuinely has the time and interest to be a driving force in a HUB TS. This would include any admin privileges, adding or moving units, remodeling the look, EVERYTHING. If there are other TS HUB projects underway that have made further progress, then it may be easier to build off of one of those. I simply don't know about them so I can't form an educated opinion on the best starting place. It may be easier yet to start from scratch simply so that everyone is sure of being on equal footing. Whatever will work best for the community. We are offering because we have framework and you are welcome to take it over for the community if it will help facilitate things.

Second, what I had been typing before the previous replies popped up was as follows. Let's assume the clans support a community TS. As far as making a HUB teamspeak work, we would need some community standards. Is there a base list of standards we could borrow from (say NGNG or one of the other public servers)? Or perhaps some people could suggest standards to be included? Here are three off the top of my head:

Respect - When dropping publicly, you represent the clan community at large above and beyond your individual unit. Therefore, when in the public server you are called to treat all clan warriors with respect, regardless of rank and unit.

Neutrality - Public channels will be available and accessible to all. There will be no exclusion of warriors for any reason in the public channels (unless that warrior has violated the community standards). If a group feels the need for privacy, they must use their own channels.

Unit Channels - Each unit is responsible for their own channels. Each unit also has the authority to moderate their channels as they deem appropriate.

Any other suggestions or additions? Comments on the above standards?

(Do note, we have a website framework in place as well and we are willing to share it in its entirety, too. But as this thread is focused on the HUB TS, I am trying to keep the discussion to that one matter for now.)

Edited by Mitzli Softpaw, 24 March 2014 - 01:27 PM.

[Mitzli Softpaw]

CoffiNail, on 24 March 2014 - 12:59 PM, said:

I like this idea of a free 512 man hub. This eliminates a HUGE cost for everyone, and the growth a size like that allows. Is there more information on how this works?

512 users would be hard to right now... maybe when CW is out and some epic stuff goes down... but 512 will be WAY beyond adaquite... and if it cost is low, I say why not?

A Central HUB and TS to go with it is a great stepping stone in a grand community council.

For the free one, I like the idea, too, because then no one will be burdened with crazy costs. And 512 is a lot of space for expansion which is great. It's also a fresh server where everyone can come in at once. My questions about the 512 are would it have to be registered under an individual or run by an individual ultimately? Are there ways to make sure no one person / unit ends up holding the key to the server? If not, I wouldn't think it's something a meeting can't agree upon.

[CoffiNail]

Mitzli Softpaw, on 24 March 2014 - 01:26 PM, said:

Second, what I had been typing before the previous replies popped up was as follows. Let's assume the clans support a community TS. As far as making a HUB teamspeak work, we would need some community standards. Is there a base list of standards we could borrow from (say NGNG or one of the other public servers)? Or perhaps some people could suggest standards to be included? Here are three off the top of my head:

Respect - When dropping publicly, you represent the clan community at large above and beyond your individual unit. Therefore, when in the public server you are called to treat all clan warriors with respect, regardless of rank and unit.

Neutrality - Public channels will be available and accessible to all. There will be no exclusion of warriors for any reason in the public channels (unless that warrior has violated the community standards). If a group feels the need for privacy, they must use their own channels.

Unit Channels - Each unit is responsible for their own channels. Each unit also has the authority to moderate their channels as they deem appropriate.

Any other suggestions or additions? Comments on the above standards?

Agreed with the above standards. This is a good base framework. I am not sure if NGNG has a base list of standards, if so, I am sure they would have little issue with us borrowing and working off theirs as a base.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Mitzli Softpaw, on 24 March 2014 - 11:48 AM, said:

If that's the case then I don't see a drawback really. I wasn't aware that hosting and superadmin were already worked out somewhere - it was my assumption that a server had to have someone paying for it and someone doing admin for it, or am I incorrect?

Good catch Mitzli. I obviously was not clear enough in the OP so I will fix that upstairs! Thanks.

[Lukoi Banacek]

On a further note...guys I think you're overdoing it a bit. Things do not need to be so formal.

Yes, I think we can all agree on standards involving respect for others etc but this does not require a release form, a magna carta or anything too formal (that's tongue in cheek folks, not being a jerk here ).

Several Clan units use Comstar TS (for example), Mercstars, NGNG and on none of them have I been given any sort of formal break down on how to behave, how the channels are to be utilized etc. It's all fairly benign and self-explanatory. On the very off chance someone was being disruptive, I'm sure it could be handled in house. I get the vibe we're just about all adults here and frankly, when chatting "in person" over VOIP to debate something, people tend to be alot less snarky and adversarial unlike on forum arguments where many feel they have carte blanche to act like complete antisocial bullies without consequences.

Needless to say, we just started this thread to see IF enough units would be interested in either riding along with their own set of rooms and some public rooms, or in maintaining a nominal presence there, to make it worth our superadmin's time to set up, run and manage.

We have the asset already lined up, but don't want it to be too under-utilized. I daresay many units will maintain their own private comms simply out of habit, vanity, ego or convenience regardless so it's unlikely we get crushed with bodies, but we do want to test out the 4TB limit on badwidth etc (which I'm told is quite a lot still for VOIP) and test performance before anyone feels forced to commit.

This option might save some folks a few bucks, bring some community members together etc.

Regardless, we're not looking to tie it to any sort of website for the time being. Of the twenty plus english speaking Clan-lore units we are aware of, most are well under 40 actives on any given evening so we feel we're not going to push ourselves past the limits of the service capacity anytime soon IF we go this route.

[CoffiNail]

It would reduce the amount of server channels I need to keep open for diplomatic relations. It would be good for building relationships among all the Clans of Kerensky so we may crush the barbaric sphereoids dogs excuse for armed forces and bring the light that is the way of the Clans and the vision of Kerensky to the rest of the misguided people of the Star League.

[Mitzli Softpaw]

Sorry, wasn't trying to write a law book or anything. But we are the clans after all, so a little formality or ritual should be excused, I think. =P That said, I wasn't going for a governing document so much as jotting down some overarching guidelines in the landing pad channel for guests and units. If nothing else, admin can point back to it and say "Hey, this is why you were removed from the channel (or server)," if the need arises. Unfortunately, there are always a few who will be disruptive and there's less chance for arguments or misunderstandings if a few guidelines are made clear from the start. I don't think those three are over the top, honestly, and they give both individuals and units a strong sense of what to expect. Probably don't need much more than "Respect everyone, public channels are public, and each unit admins its own channels," if you want less formal.

I do feel strongly that all three of those things are important for a community TS, however, spoken or not.

Long story short, from a preliminary standpoint, Clan Diamond Shark would be happy to participate and advocate so long as it's a true community TS that stays neutral and isn't tied to any particular unit. Otherwise, it's yet another unit's TS with guest rooms and we have tons of those already.

[Pariah Devalis]

From a participatory standpoint, Clan Nova Cat (Alpha Galaxy) has, from the get go, had an ideal stance of neutrality between the various Clans. Any particular endeavour to allow all clans equal rights and participation, with no overstepping of bounds by any one clan unit on one or more other clan units is something we can absolutely get behind. As long as respect can be maintained among all its constituents, I cannot imagine a reason why we could not back it.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 24 March 2014 - 03:24 PM.

[Lukoi Banacek]

I agree with Mitzli and all of our speakers thus far regarding respect and neutrality. We are of an accord on this then, at the basic level.

I'll ask my admin to suit up and see if he is still interested in moving forward

[Groundpound Devalis]

This type of thing comes up a lot. It comes up a lot in every makeover of a mechwarrior title. I wish you all great luck with success this time around. In my experience it never works out, drama erupts, and each clan goes back to its individual server. My Clan Nova Cat will remain isolated, while honestly and truly wishing this attempt is an amazing success. We really do hope you surpass your countless predecessors.

[ManaValkyrie]

Well i can say that I run 2 private TS servers presently, hosted off two different companies, more because they are used for 2 different community groups. They are both 50 person servers, it took me a minimal couple of hours to set up the basic requirments and channels.

The one TS used by a Game Clan that i am involved with, has a group of community managers for different groups that create and adjust the TS server channels as they are required, i barely do any work on there at all. The other I spend a lot more time on because I generally play off that one with my unit, but enough members have admin rights to deal with issues when i am not around.

@Mitzi, yes you can get a 512 person TS license as a game clan, the major stipulation is that 1. you have to have an associated Website from the person/group applying for the license and that 2. There can be no advertising, no support the website.etc by donation stuff up.

-With regards to the commentry about Drama-
As i said I have seen a community hub collapse because of Drama issues, however the Majority of the issues stemmed from over control by the 'hoster' for the TS, rather than let lodger units and groups have a fairly free rain with there rooms, people and such, he liked way to much control and upset a lot of people from different units.

We actually fixed that by creating a set of admins who could and would give him a figurative kick in the pants to get his head back into being a better person, even kicked him off the TS server a couple of times when his mouth engaged before brain.

-With regards to the Super-User/Admin Control-
Unfortunately no matter how you set up a TS, whether you pay for hosting, or get a free license and host the server, someone ultimately controls it, either the person paying for it or the person running the actual hardware server, its finding people who are willing to do so, and are trustworthy/reliable or a generally good person who doesnt Drama-Llama over everything.

-For anyone with TS server Issues/Help Requirements-
Presently I own and run the 3rd Takata Lancers TS, 1st Ghost Gaming Clan Server, help admin and monitor the HK Hub Server, I helped 2nd Arkab build there server up and am presently helping Clan Coyote's Omega Galaxy with theres. If you have an issue, need some help, give me a poke and as soon as i get time i can hop on/in and try and help out.

[Bongfu]

ManaValkyrie, on 25 March 2014 - 03:58 AM, said:

@Mitzi, yes you can get a 512 person TS license as a game clan, the major stipulation is that 1. you have to have an associated Website from the person/group applying for the license and that 2. There can be no advertising, no support the website.etc by donation stuff up.

Presently the only requirement for me would be to take the donation button off of Strana-mechty.net

Still though, we already have a TS server so I don't see a need to start a new one. I also see no problem is asking that members donate something like a $1 if they can. If everyone donated a dollar to the server it could remain running for a very long time.

It would not be difficult to build a little meter indicating the amount of money vs the amount spent on the server is remaining in the account.

[Gyrok]

The Delta Galaxy of Clan Wolf would endorse this 100% and be willing to offer any assistance possibly needed on our end...anyone with questions or wanting to coordinate is welcome to PM me, or visit me on our current TS server...info can be found on our home page: http://www.cwdg.us

[Dark DeLaurel]

I like the idea but there is a few problems or really just one. Even with the NPL (Non-profit license) we require the hardware to run the server. Shared hosting will not work as they state if the IP has been used before in a NPL application it will be denied.

I guess the other issue is it needs to be a proper domain website and the person requesting needs to have an email off that domain.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Dark DeLaurel, on 25 March 2014 - 07:17 PM, said:

I like the idea but there is a few problems or really just one. Even with the NPL (Non-profit license) we require the hardware to run the server. Shared hosting will not work as they state if the IP has been used before in a NPL application it will be denied.

I guess the other issue is it needs to be a proper domain website and the person requesting needs to have an email off that domain.

All non-issues in this case. We have that covered. The only real potential friction point is the 4TB limit we have and apparently that's probably a non-issue as well. We just need an opportunity to stress test it.

[CoffiNail]

This weekend sometime? Get as many Clan players on for 12 mans, Zell or none, should be fun.