134 replies to this topic

[ShinVector]

vectorpirate, on 25 March 2014 - 11:51 AM, said:

I agree. The patch did not change damage at all, it just reduced the time you have to get under cover. I'm not saying that's necessarily a good thing, there should be a significantly longer delay for missiles compared to instantaneous lasers or very short delay ballistics, but it's not a huge change. They are meant to be used with different tactics. Pilots will adjust and the game will even out again without more messing about by PGI.

Hmmmm... I am pretty sure higher LRM speeds means faster Hit Confirm for the LRM boater and faster re-fire rate and overall increase in effective DPS. The LRM boats is capable of dealing more damage in a shorter amount of time.

[Kitty Bacon]

ShinVector, on 01 April 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

Hmmmm... I am pretty sure higher LRM speeds means faster Hit Confirm for the LRM boater and faster re-fire rate and overall increase in effective DPS. The LRM boats is capable of dealing more damage in a shorter amount of time.

Did they up the cycle time for LRMs or something? I don't remember LRMs having a faster re-fire rate... Did we miss some patch that up'd the reload of LRMs so they fire faster?... Or is the A1 Catapult still up in popularity because no one runs AMS to stop LRM5s?

[StalaggtIKE]

I have yet to die to these godly LRM that everyone keeps whining about.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 01 April 2014 - 12:27 PM.

[Kitty Bacon]

StalaggtIKE, on 01 April 2014 - 12:26 PM, said:

I have yet to die to these godly LRM that everyone keeps whining about.

I have once or twice. Mainly from being caught in the open, having the team of said LRMs flank, tear me to pieces with the LRMs supporting them and dieing that way or because some random person was carrying one LRM 15 on their mech for kicks. LRMs only ONLY work with a good team to get locks. Other than that, good luck doing a 1v1 in a LRM boat against someone who knows how to kill you.

[Guardian00]

Thats very true.

Gas Guzzler, on 25 March 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

LRMs have not ruined the game, they just force you to think before you move your Mech out into the open. Assaults no longer viable? I don't thinks so. Assaults just require careful positioning on the battlefield, and are not forgiving if you smurf up. If you play smart though, they are still very rewarding. The problem is a lot of times teams of mediums and lights just decide to move as a group and forget that they are abandoning their teammates in slow moving assaults. This seems to happen every few games that I drop in a Banshee/Atlas, but that's a teamwork issue not a mech issue.

[z00med]

Heeeey, another LRM whine from the metaninjas.

Now whenever I see someone related to House Liao, I will hear this tune in the back of my mind:


(mimi- pretty much sums up the whole situation)

ShinVector, on 01 April 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

Hmmmm... I am pretty sure higher LRM speeds means faster Hit Confirm for the LRM boater and faster re-fire rate and overall increase in effective DPS. The LRM boats is capable of dealing more damage in a shorter amount of time.

let me think of something polite... nooooohrhrhrhrhrhrhrhr. ehm, no. refire rate depends on the weapon. DPS increased a bit per salvo, simply because the chance to hit increased a bit. Which was badly needed... LRMs were simply dead, leaving a few dedicated support players (including me, but I stopped with the patch - really dont want to be responsible for these rivers of tears), dodging ACs and PPCs to get a lock...

Edited by z00med, 01 April 2014 - 01:05 PM.

[Ngamok]

Like I've told people before, I used to kill just fine with LRMs at 120 m/s because I shoot people from 300-600m with 700m being my max I'd consider. There'd be matches I would rack up 600 to 1000 damage and 2-6 kills before the patch. Now, I consider going to 800m max. Also hitting lights is easier whereas before you'd land a couple of missiles on their legs or arms but it took more salvos.

Edit: Of course ECM heavy teams always killed me.

Edited by Ngamok, 01 April 2014 - 01:02 PM.

[Zvolimir the Blackhand]

Today's patch has returned things to a tolerable level. I'll give it a few days and talk with some folk before I post anything else, but for myself they might have found the sweet spot.

That, and a lot of folks have jumped off the LRM train, so there aren't as many deployed as there was the first week of the patch.

Bored, maybe?

[Kjudoon]

ShinVector, on 01 April 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

Hmmmm... I am pretty sure higher LRM speeds means faster Hit Confirm for the LRM boater and faster re-fire rate and overall increase in effective DPS. The LRM boats is capable of dealing more damage in a shorter amount of time.

Nope. None of it true. the faster speeds does not equate to faster reload times, NOR faster locks. And after the stealth nerf done back in December, (how else does my damage drop by 50% overnight with no explanation and nothing changed?) I'm now nearing what I used to do before that.

[ShinVector]

Kjudoon, on 01 April 2014 - 02:12 PM, said:

Nope. None of it true. the faster speeds does not equate to faster reload times, NOR faster locks. And after the stealth nerf done back in December, (how else does my damage drop by 50% overnight with no explanation and nothing changed?) I'm now nearing what I used to do before that.

Geee... Did I say... Cool down ? Nope.. Re-fire rate referring to when you want to launch your next salvo to hit a target.

What do you guys do here ? Just Spam your LRMs without checking to see if it hits the Target ???
Do you realise how the faster LRM helps in this area ?

[Kjudoon]

ShinVector, on 01 April 2014 - 09:14 PM, said:

Geee... Did I say... Cool down ? Nope.. Re-fire rate referring to when you want to launch your next salvo to hit a target.

What do you guys do here ? Just Spam your LRMs without checking to see if it hits the Target ???
Do you realise how the faster LRM helps in this area ?

Then I misunderstood you and I apologize.

And yes, I do have multiple salvos in the air when I am confident I can get 2-4 to target and watch to see the results.

[General Solo]

Bring back the days when you could Alpha strike 3 times and kill anything in an A1 Splat Capapult.
That would stir up the meta,

Cause now brawling is broken, especially with srms and nerfed ac10/20 in their curret state

No options but to sniper, pop sniper or LRM (OK scouts as well)

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 02 April 2014 - 12:15 AM.

[ShinVector]

OZHomerOZ, on 02 April 2014 - 12:14 AM, said:

Bring back the days when you could Alpha strike 3 times and kill anything in an A1 Splat Capapult.
That would stir up the meta,

Cause now brawling is broken, especially with srms and nerfed ac10/20 in their curret state

No options but to sniper, pop sniper or LRM (OK scouts as well)

Next patch might bring back a little bit of that...
I did some testing..



Edit: Hey you were in that match with me.

Edited by ShinVector, 02 April 2014 - 12:24 AM.

[Zvolimir the Blackhand]

It's been a week since they slowed it back...by 15m/s.

Patch Review - Huginn

by House Liao Gatekeepers.

[Jon Gotham]

Zvolimir, I read the review on your page and can only agree. I tried a Blackjack today, on River City on upper near the ship a Victor and I just rounded the ship and ran into 3 enemy. In the time it took me to turn and try to get to cover I had been hit with THREE lrm volleys. I only had to run about 50m.....the result? My mech was nigh on obliterated by a few mechs who didn't have to take any risk at all to do that damage.
I used the cover there to evade the 3 direct fire guys nicely, but the giga volley? Nope.
Result of that? I promptly sold that mech. Pointless using something that can be smashed to nothing in 5 secs flat when crossing a 100m patch of open ground to get to next cover. How can I have any fun engaging enemy pilots in mech to mech brawls when the lrm clouds can rain on me anytime they wish?

If people want to play indirect fire that's cool. But there has to be a downside besides 180m min range. Because currently, they can utterly devastate teams whilst being utterly safe-no other weapon can do this.

Guess I'll be a light-exclusive pilot from now on. You HAVE to be able to leave cover for a few seconds before the swarm descends on you or this will turn out World of Tanks style-spend nearly 99% of ever game cowering behind rocks...

[ShinVector]

kamiko kross, on 08 April 2014 - 02:20 PM, said:

Zvolimir, I read the review on your page and can only agree. I tried a Blackjack today, on River City on upper near the ship a Victor and I just rounded the ship and ran into 3 enemy. In the time it took me to turn and try to get to cover I had been hit with THREE lrm volleys. I only had to run about 50m.....the result? My mech was nigh on obliterated by a few mechs who didn't have to take any risk at all to do that damage.
I used the cover there to evade the 3 direct fire guys nicely, but the giga volley? Nope.
Result of that? I promptly sold that mech. Pointless using something that can be smashed to nothing in 5 secs flat when crossing a 100m patch of open ground to get to next cover. How can I have any fun engaging enemy pilots in mech to mech brawls when the lrm clouds can rain on me anytime they wish?

If people want to play indirect fire that's cool. But there has to be a downside besides 180m min range. Because currently, they can utterly devastate teams whilst being utterly safe-no other weapon can do this.

Guess I'll be a light-exclusive pilot from now on. You HAVE to be able to leave cover for a few seconds before the swarm descends on you or this will turn out World of Tanks style-spend nearly 99% of ever game cowering behind rocks...

Hey... But the LRM boaters especially the Super Boat are having lots of fun and think very effective guided lockon weapons is nice an fair ! *(/sarcasm)

You think you are safe in a light mech ?
Look at this from last night..

And this who be from just one LRM Super boat...

Accordingly to the LRM lovers in the LRM feedback thread.. 'It is NOT OP since it didn't actually leg me."
That why I get for trying to flank and spot out of cover for 6 SECONDS ??!

[Jon Gotham]

Ugh Shin-that was nasty. I feel safer in lights though:P I just wish ams was more effective.....even my twin ams on my FS-S feels useless......
Your vid does highlight a mjor issue with giga salvos though-one salvo makes you match in effective with very little input from aggressor player. Different if that was a carefully lead shot from a twin gauss for example, their skill input requirement is much higher than the equivalent lrm user.
So I'd be happier about getting nailed like that, because the gausser has to lead and compensate for distance and charge time. An lrm user has to roughly put reticle near my triangle-worlds apart right there.

[ShinVector]

kamiko kross, on 08 April 2014 - 05:57 PM, said:

Ugh Shin-that was nasty. I feel safer in lights though:P I just wish ams was more effective.....even my twin ams on my FS-S feels useless......
Your vid does highlight a mjor issue with giga salvos though-one salvo makes you match in effective with very little input from aggressor player. Different if that was a carefully lead shot from a twin gauss for example, their skill input requirement is much higher than the equivalent lrm user.
So I'd be happier about getting nailed like that, because the gausser has to lead and compensate for distance and charge time. An lrm user has to roughly put reticle near my triangle-worlds apart right there.

The strangely LRM boats will often defend getting a lock and left click, while maintained lockon as long as possible by keeping crosshair in big red square.. As 'Skill'.

The double AMS might plus all the upgrades and tons of ammo might save you...
But not your team mates...
Hate seeing matches when your team cowers behind rocks until the LRMs finally get them.

Edited by ShinVector, 08 April 2014 - 07:19 PM.

[Kyxe]

ShinVector, on 08 April 2014 - 07:06 PM, said:

The strangely LRM boats will often defend getting a lock and left click, while maintained lockon as long as possible by keeping crosshair in big red square.. As 'Skill'.

The double AMS might plus all the upgrades and tons of ammo might save you...
But not your team mates...
Hate seeing matches when your team cowers behind rocks until the LRMs finally get them.

I generally play brawlers or snipers. (Actually to be fair 7/10 matches I play brawling mechs because it's the play style I enjoy the most, and I seem to be masochistically addicted to large pulse lasers lately.) However, I dabble in LRMS occasionally running goofy lrm builds on my Griffin or a lighter mech. I don't agree with the belief that LRMs require no skill. Playing a slow **** with no way to defend itself in an up close fight in a game where you get laser boats that can still outrun your missiles and get in your face requires a lot more work than people who ***** about LRMs give them credit for.

[Ravnis]

I think missiles are much better now after the nerf patch but they are still very strong. I don't know if they need another speed nerf at this point though. I would like to see the cone of effect increased a bit more even if this means fast mechs like my favorite light mechs will get hit by more missiles because of said cone of effect.

Case and point. I run a Raven 3L a lot, I find myself having to peek and shoot a lot during a match at 500 meters with medium lasers to keep my team under ECM cover if the opposing force has a few boats. Yesterday, I broke off from my team on Canyon network when we were up 6 kills to 5 in an assault game. Literally a minute after i left them we were losing 6 kills to 10 because I left my team open to the boats for only 60 seconds. If I had stayed, in all likelihood we would have still been almost if not even in kill numbers, but I wouldn't really have been effective myself in the game at all. So the only option i have most maps is to stay back with my group and fire outside of my true effective range most of every map.

This wasn't completely my fault, I know my team should have been aware that the ECM cover was gone and should have dodged the LRM's but it doesn't happen very often in PuG drops.

Edit: Maybe i should join the masses of Ravens that are dropping their knife fight weapons and start using two ER Larges instead.

Edited by Rex Antilles, 08 April 2014 - 09:13 PM.