35 replies to this topic

[Bigbacon]

one or two fast mechs can flank on thier own as long as they don't stick around and get back to the pack quickly.

If anything, doing so gets some of the enemy pack to either stop messing with your main pack and start looking at you and/or it gets them to break away from their pack to pursue.

I mostly certain do this from time to time and I do agree, it can get my in trouble and wasted but many times it can be just the annoyance your team needs to get the enemy to stop for a few seconds and think (or not think and do something stupid)

[Zeede]

Flanking is an excellent option when the enemy has a chokepoint bottled up with a vicious firing line.

I mean, what is the other option? Going into the pass, getting blown to bits by the first alpha from 4-6 enemy mechs, then die because everyone is bottled up behind you and you can't back up? Yeah, no thanks.

[TheAlphaMonster]

When flanking becomes effective in pug:



Me and this random phract I never met went to the side and (foolishly, I might add), hunted down a hunchback.

Then our entire team started to die.

Their weakened team then started to finish our base....only to meet ac40 Jager backed with a phract.



So yes, flanking can be legitimate depending on when it is used and if both the flankers have the situational awareness of knowing when to push in and the main frontline is aware a flank is incoming. Or if you got nothing to lose, like me and this phract lol. (This flank was pure luck and accidental. Sure I won this match, but I'm not saying this was due to skill. This is just when a flank works.)

Edited by TheAlphaMonster, 03 April 2014 - 01:30 PM.

[Danghen Woolf]

Flanking is definately situational. I agree with a lot of the posts above me in that a well coordinated flank can create a great opportunity. A poorly executed flank can also create an opportunity for both teams, one use is to use a poor flank to draw enemies into another field of fire, Forest Colony is good for this one, especially the tunnel. Run a couple of guys through the tunnel, pop off some shots and then run back through, that will usually get at least one guy following, having an AS7-D-DC sitting there waiting can really ruin someones day.

Recently I have had three experiences with flanking and all turned out differently.

1) Caustic Valley - COM w/ ECM: I ran the outside line through the trees and spotted for teammates, when the other team saw me and sent a couple of lights after me I drew them into my buddies, I did this a few times and removed almost all of their light forces from the game quickly. Unfortunately while this was happening the heavies were rolling my team up pretty well. In the endgame it was me and I believe an SHD vs. two battered STKs and an almost 90% CPLT. We stuck together, used the terrain and the bubble to isolate each mech and take them out, the CPLT was boating LRMs with no support weapons and couldn't target us so he took off running back towards his turrets. We hunted him down and pew-pewed him to death with medium lasers. Flanking worked well and then folded because the other team committed more to the center and we could not hold, but the guys getting beat on sure held the line for the win.

2) Alpine Peak - HBK: This one went sour from the beginning. The bad guys took the hill and had bubbles set up from at least an RVN and CDA, we were getting mauled trying to knock them off the hill. I was already critical damage and so I peeled off to find another strategy, go around the hill come up behind them. I am not sure how many people were left on my team at this point but coming to the top of the hill showed me an AS-7 and BNC sitting there looking down, not shooting, just watching a fight below them. I couldn't target them so I moved up to about 300m and alpha'ed the AS-7 in the back, took his right torso out but didn't kill him, backed off, and hit him again, dropped the AS-7 but ended up getting chased down by an LCT. A flank here got me a ninja kill but did nothing for the team.

3) Tourmaline Desert - HBK: I was ill-prepared for this map with my HBK. My lance went around the eastern side of the map to flank and intercepted a light lance doing the same thing. They hit us and faded and LRMs fell from the sky on us. I was PUGing and the lance dissolved chasing the lights, luckily they rejoined the group but I was too far off and ended up getting jumped by them again when they tried to flank again. Seeing that I was the only one I dumped off a few AC20 rounds and ran away. I dropped down a slope right in front of our heavies and assaults covered by ECM and the light lance followed me... right into 8 mechs that outweighed them 3-1... This match had a flank/counter flank that ended up getting us the win after they lost their spotters. Their good flank turned into a poor one when they overcommitted and chased down a lone HBK.

[Latorque]

Flanking requires leaving cover; and this is a bad idea atm. there aren't enough tunnels / high-walled canyons on most maps to make that work. It had been fun when it worked

[Sarlic]

Karl Streiger, on 03 April 2014 - 05:03 AM, said:

Flanking manouvers work in most cases... as long as the team react in the right way.... a cross fire situation means that several enemy mechs will be exposed to incoming fire... the important thing is not to fire at those that fire on you but to shoot at those with the exposed side..

i can remember a single game - where the team i played with was encircled...where ever you turn you got shots in the rear.... while i was circling my stalker firing in every direction and in the end i did try to break out - exposing my self to all fronts and died in seconds....

a good positioning is worth much more as any cover you can get.... because cover means there is always a angle of attack that hit you - while you are not moving.

so my advice (imo don't use cover to dig in - use cover to cloud your movement and to create kill zones)

on the other hand kill zones could be countered by one or two flanking madmen and a all in assault where every body steps into the line of fire of the enemy in the same moment....if you are engaged in combat....try not to use the "back" button...try to advance an search another position - nearer to the enemy.

last not least - when me and my freaking big Atlas are able to flank - you can do it with your Wolverine or Shadow Hawk faster and more effective (increasing the angle of crossfire)

Problem is: Most teams don't. Unfortunatly that's the sad truth.

Edited by Sarlic, 09 April 2014 - 11:58 AM.

[Vanguard319]

Flanking maneuvers do work, especially when your opponent is not expecting it. It certainly is a good strategy for lights, particularly if they are spotting for LRMs. I think the reason most players do not use them is because they require some degree of coordination to be successful, and if the opponent anticipates the move, it will be ripped apart before friendlies can react. Still, victory favors the bold, and it is worth considering the rewards as well as the risks.

[Enigmos]

I'm with the school that fighting together is more effective than dying apart, but there are times when flanking simply makes sense. Sometimes someone has to break up the battle or the less experienced team will lose by attrition... and I generally drop PUG, hence we are almost always less experienced.

That said, there have been some ridiculous moments along the 'fight together or die alone" path. The most recent was 'the Leader of Mechs', surely the advisor to both Napoleon and Alexander, counseling us with words of great wisdom that we should stick together and avoid running off alone.

Then, in his high-speed shadowhawk, he ran off leaving a banshee and an Atlas plodding along the way assaults generally do with the rest of the team.

We lost that skirmish, Great Leader did get kills and pronounced his judgment that we should take our lesson from this loss as a result of our failure to stay together.

I asked him where he had run off to, since he was no where near our slowest teammates. I got my share of kills, but if someone is going to give advice they should be willing to actively demonstrate it themselves.

Edited by OriginalTibs, 16 April 2014 - 08:11 AM.

[Harathan]

Anyone in a PUG game typing "Everyone stick together" at the start of the round should get auto-kicked from the game as far as I'm concerned. Tactics win battles. Standing in a blob at Coward's Ridge or Caustic Crater or wherever, without any thought, is just going to lose you the match.

[RiotHero]

Funny topic is funny.


I only pug so i'm not sure if you play premades but, we might be playing a different game. I've dropped thousands of times and have tried to flank more times than I'd like to admit. I've even tried to join a few. Bottom line is, people do not and will not leave the death ball. That's it. From what i've seen in nearly every single game I've played, you can be in the death ball or quickly die outside it.

This game is about being the last person, if you can maneuver into the back of the pack and be teh very last person in line to see action, you will always do the best. If you try to lead any sort of advanced tactic, your team will fail.

[Bilbo]

RiotHero, on 17 April 2014 - 01:02 AM, said:

Funny topic is funny.


I only pug so i'm not sure if you play premades but, we might be playing a different game. I've dropped thousands of times and have tried to flank more times than I'd like to admit. I've even tried to join a few. Bottom line is, people do not and will not leave the death ball. That's it. From what i've seen in nearly every single game I've played, you can be in the death ball or quickly die outside it.

This game is about being the last person, if you can maneuver into the back of the pack and be teh very last person in line to see action, you will always do the best. If you try to lead any sort of advanced tactic, your team will fail.

This is not at all correct. Of course, if you aren't willing to occasionally die a horrible but glorious death, the death ball is probably the best place for you anyway.

[Danghen Woolf]

Bilbo, on 17 April 2014 - 07:02 AM, said:

This is not at all correct. Of course, if you aren't willing to occasionally die a horrible but glorious death, the death ball is probably the best place for you anyway.

I had a good flank the other night in my LCT...

Was running the tapeline on Caustic and was spotted by an JR7 and FS9, they took off running after me and tied me up long enough for a COM to join in, somehow I managed to survive long enough running around the rocks for some of my mediums and heavies to chase them off. I did die a horrible death as they ran away... IDF LRMs. One of them must have had the 360 targetting module.

Edited by Danghen Woolf, 17 April 2014 - 07:39 AM.

[William Slayer]

BLOOD WOLF, on 03 April 2014 - 10:36 AM, said:

So many Variables in the battle makes never a certain plan. It comes down to being able to analyze the battle.This is why we need lance leaders as well as effective commanders.

Absolutely. The CO can set overall tactics (Charlie lance flank left) but a lance leader calls the shots (Focus on B's left leg, lets come at them from grid C3, etc). This is only accomplished when typing through sheer wizardry. It becomes possible for the rest of us humans when Team Speak is used. :-)

[LiGhtningFF13]

Flanking tactics, yea but please in time so that even Lances of Atlas/Banshee variants can keep up with the main part. Just had a round where the support/flanking position came about one hour too late.

[William Slayer]

Coordination. It was said before and I second that.

Dropped solo in Tourmaline desert and saw a premade Marik lance on my side. Tried to help them. They went off to the right to hunt down a few spotter/sniper lights, then went for a flank maneuver... BUT didn't tell the rest of us. Because I was watching my radar, it was easy to see what they were trying to accomplish. However, as I pushed forward to support their flanking maneuver, none of the rest of the front line moved with me. The premade Lance got crushed with me, and then the enemy rolled up the rest of the team. Funny thing, the premade Lance raged at the rest of us for not supporting them! I could see it, but you should be trying to give all us PUGs a hint if you want that flank to work.

Winning example: Terra Therma. Right from the get go I announced that Charlie Lance was going to be flank. As the rest of the team moved to the middle for the inevitable battle at the volcano, we maneuvered around to catch the enemy team. Because our team made a defensive stance, the other team broke themselves against our line. Although the enemy team I was able to defeat those mechs, they were left with 3 damaged verses our fresh Lance of 4. We made quick work of them as we came up behind them for the win.




"I do not crave power. Only victory. "

[Shatterpoint]

In any given match (at the low end of the elo that I assume I'm in) 10 players on your team will be completely oblivious to 10 enemy mechs flanking them, even if you're pretty clearly stating in chat
"MOST OF ENEMY TEAM COMING AROUND BEHIND US <-------- THAT WAY, NOT THE WAY YOU'RE SHOOTING"

The remaining 2 players get the choice of dying in a last ditch attempt at stalling or being picked off from behind with the rest of their team.