44 replies to this topic

[Dolev9]

We all know the situation were we choose a hot mech and reach teraa therma, or choosing a short range mech and reaching alpine peaks etc.
All the maps are good, but we can all play better and enjoy more if we have the right mech for the map !
There are probably not enaugh players for choosing maps.
Choosing maps might also cause many maps to extinct (althought randomizing maps is fun !)

Choosing your mech by the selected map solve all the problems !

So what do you say, do you think its a good idea? Do you see any problems with this option?

[Rogue Jedi]

I would like to see this option, but in a limited form, before UI2.0 we had a ready list were you could assign 4 Mechs, how I would envision this sort of feature working is, you can place up-to a maximum of 4 Mechs on the dropship so when you know were you are to drop you select the best suited of your available Mechs.

this would stop people from setting up a particular Mech for each map but still allow you to avoid using for example your brawler atlas on Alpine Peaks or a hunchback 4p with 9 lasers on Terra Therma.

[Spleenslitta]

Rogue Jedi is correct. I also voted yes but i also kinda....sort of....want things to stay the way they are. Reason?
Because i want the current meta to die. There i said it. That felt good.

I wish players would stop making AC40 Jagers, LRM 60 Catapults etc.
I want MWO to truly become a thinking players game where we need skill, tactics and intellect to come out victorious.
Not just brute power within a certain range category for the certain win.

[MilesTeg1982]

I voted No because I think this mechanic would ruin the game.

How so? Because players would start to use builds designed for specific maps - which would mean that players don't need to rethink and adjust to the map anymore. Also this would finaly kill every allround-build there is because players using these builds would always have a disadvantage compared to players using specialised builds for single maps.

[Durant Carlyle]

The last I heard/read, they will be introducing a mechanic where 12 players are put onto a team, 2 teams are put into a lobby of their own, maps would be voted on, and then 'Mechs would be chosen. The match would be played, and the teams would return back to the same lobby where they could vote on map, choose 'Mechs, and drop again. There wouldn't need to be any searching for new players unless some dropped from the original group. Also, this future system would allow the opportunity to re-connect for people who disconnect.

Unfortunately, I don't know how far down the road this system is...

[Ovion]

I think you should have a favourites, or 'ready' mechs section, where you select say, 2-4 mechs that you can choose from when you enter a game (if you don't select it selects one at random).

Maybe start with 2, being able to unlock up to 2 more with GXP or MC?

[fandre]

Great idea, that wll surely increase meta fun playing. You could optimize meta mechs even more with it. No allrounder and lot less variability.

...

voted NO.

[Magna Canus]

MilesTeg1982, on 16 April 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

I voted No because I think this mechanic would ruin the game.
How so? Because players would start to use builds designed for specific maps - which would mean that players don't need to rethink and adjust to the map anymore. Also this would finaly kill every allround-build there is because players using these builds would always have a disadvantage compared to players using specialised builds for single maps.

It would be reasonable if we had the drop-ship mechanic and planet raiding supposedly to be introduced in CW. You would know exactly which planet (and therefore which map) you would be attacking/defending and logically you would build your mech accordingly. If CW ever comes this may just be the norm, so why not get used to it sooner rather than later?

To be honest there are few meta builds that are entirely dependent on a certain range. The AC40 is one of them, but the Pop-tart, Heavy-LRM, etc. are all effective at most ranges, which is of course one of the reasons why they are the meta. 2PPC/AC5 is more common than the AC40 for just that same reason, and AC40 usually tends to be a "beginners meta".

And I think the core of the idea is that you have 2-4 mechs pre-configured and loaded up before you set off for a match. Since you can only have 1 of any particular chassis, you can't build 4 different specialized versions of a mech using the same chassis. You could use similar mechs, like the Heavy Metal and the HGN-733C, but again, how much can you really tweek when your meta dictates that you need x of this weapon and y of the other? You could squeeze out an extra DHS more or less, but that's about it.

[Archon]

This makes total sense to me; In all of the previous mechwarrior games you had intel on a map beforehand and could therefore choose and outfit your mech to best be accustomed to that map before launching. Being stuck with a brawler on alpine or an energy-heavy mech on Terra Therma is never fun. How does it make any sense that someone would land on a planet without knowing anything about it?

[Captain Stiffy]

Choose a mech? Are you crazy? We all know that in the battletech universe mechs randomly fly around in space until 24 of them happen to land on one of five planets (again randomly) and then teams are randomly assigned by drawing straws.

Otherwise people would just purpose-build mechs for different battlefields and scenarios and that is NOT what Battletech is about!



















/sarcasm

[Impyrium]

I voted no, because for pug play it'd kill the game. What we should be aiming for are diverse teams that fill a variety of roles. If every Alpine game, each 'Mech was using long range weapons, frankly that'd be the most boring game I could think of. It'd kill diversity.

For CW, that's a different story. Most of the 'logical' reasons people state here make sense, but they're forgetting that's what CW is supposed to embody. I say yes yes then. But PUG play isn't exactly... role playing style or anything. It may as well be a deathmatch mode.

Edited by AUSwarrior24, 17 April 2014 - 04:15 PM.

[Ovion]

AUSwarrior24, on 17 April 2014 - 04:08 PM, said:

I voted no, because for pug play it'd kill the game. What we should be aiming for are diverse teams that fill a variety of roles. If every Alpine game, each 'Mech was using long range weapons, frankly that'd be the most boring game I could think of. It'd kill diversity.

For CW, that's a different story. Most of the 'logical' reasons people state here make sense, but they're forgetting that's what CW is supposed to embody. I say yes yes then. But PUG play isn't exactly... role playing style or anything. It may as well be a deathmatch mode.

That's why I say make it so you select 2 mechs, which you can choose from. (And no 2 of the same chasis or weight class probably - trials can be selected)

There are still 13 maps, and only 2 doesn't give you a crazy amount of options with the above restrictions.

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

What you are suggesting is part of the "Drop Ship" Mode.

- From what was discussed by PGI, the Pilot selects 4 Mechs to load into his "Drop Ship"
- These may have to be within a selected weight limit or chassis size
- The Company is built from the selected Mech's (weight/chassis restrictions selected)
- The Map is voted on (now it was not specified if this is after or before the Company is selected.)




Side note:
- We have yet to see any specific details on "Front and Planetary Warfare", and if that will effect the limits on chassis or weight that can be brought to the battle. We may even see some of our owned Mech's be "unavailable" for some battles or locations.
(possibly denied by your current Faction, to use, at this time. )

- Some Factions had Mech's that were specific to only their House and were not sold or used by other/outside Factions. This could lead to a restricted selection of Mech's for your Pilot when selecting what Mech's he can use when affiliated with certain Houses or Factions. As your affiliation changes to different Factions so does the selection of Mech's you can use or purchase. If you currently have elements from many different Factions, you may only be able to use the ones allowed.
(or for fluff ~ the current Faction cannot support that chassis as it does not have the specs or parts to repair.)
- This could lead to a reason to work your way through each Faction, to open up the market allowing you to buy/use different chassis. This may put a damper on random Mech purchases for PGI, but the unique Faction Mech's will see an increase, so it should balance out.
End of side note.


We will be receiving the rest of the Launch Module on the 29 April. Allowing for normal and Premium options within the launch module. One of these selections is for the Map.

9erRed

Edited by 9erRed, 18 April 2014 - 07:25 AM.

[Wolfways]

Voted no.
It would be the end of the few people left using balanced builds. But don't worry. It's a bad idea so i'm sure PGI will include it at some point.

[Deadpool79]

I am going to have to say no on this one. I totally agree with the fact that you are not going to get dispatched on assignment to assault something without knowledge of the terrain ahead of time. For realism it would make sense to allow you to choose your mech based on the battle ground. However this would create an issue with individuality in play style. We all know certain maps are more negotiable with different builds and less with others. High heat maps like Terra Therma always are more preferable with better heat control builds. However this makes you work to be a better pilot, that is to have to learn to adapt your play style based on where you drop. This plays into the pilot skills, a better pilot will learn to play his mech regardless of environment. Sure he could perform even better being able to choose a mech based on the location of the fight.
My concern is being able to choose your mech after you know the map will possibly make way for a era of designated builds for certain maps. Much like (forgive the reference) the ability to queue for only specific dungeons in WoW so you were running the right build for your character class. The current format certainly has player preferred builds, but it boils down to what the pilot likes to run and feels comfortable in. Then it falls to pilots adapting their play, their mech to their environment.

[Pixelzpusher]

Having this option is just logical. In battle, you bring the weapons suited to your environment. Why would any mission not equip their troops with the right weapons based on their destined drop? If you know you're dropping in a hot environment, you don't bring an all laser mech. A large open map, you bring something that's capable of long range, not a close range brawler. It seems to be common sense and good military strategy.

[Bilbo]

The map is selected, which means the teams are already selected and balanced as best as can be by Elo and tonnage. You then want to throw that balance out the window and let everyone bring something different. I don't think so.

[Egomane]

Pixelzpusher, on 08 October 2014 - 11:48 AM, said:

Having this option is just logical. In battle, you bring the weapons suited to your environment. Why would any mission not equip their troops with the right weapons based on their destined drop? If you know you're dropping in a hot environment, you don't bring an all laser mech. A large open map, you bring something that's capable of long range, not a close range brawler. It seems to be common sense and good military strategy.

A little lesson on the battletech universe (I'll borrow a little bit from some posts I saw earlier today, that made a lot of sense).

1. A mechwarrior in the battletech universe usually only has one battlemech. Not a dozen or even more then hundred. Even if such a super rich mech pilot would exist, there are other problems he needs to face, and I will not even start mentioning how hard it actually is, to modify a mech.

2. Transport capacity is very limited and expensive. The most used dropships transport 4, 12 or 36 battlemechs. A transport jumpship has between 1 and 9 docking collars for dropships. The bigger the jumpship, the more expensive and rare it gets. The same goes for dropships. Mercenaries usually have to pay for their transportation or are transported by their contractor. Transporting not needed equipment costs a lot of money and is therefore frowned upon by both sides. Units with their own means of transportation are extremly rare and mostly limited to a single dropship, maybe two, without jumpships. Only the richest and biggest mercenary units, like the Wolf Dragoons or Kell Hounds have the currency to operate their own fleet. And even those are often doing trade runs to cover their own costs.

3. You have a several days or even weeks of travel time before you reach your target. While the jump from one star system to another is nearly instantanous, it is limited to 30 lightyears in distance and the ships usually need a week to recharge between jumps (+/- a few days, depending on the star they use to charge). For the most parts it's still days, after you reached the target system, as most jumpship captains will not jump to pirate jump points further in-system. They will instead use the normal nadir or zenith points over a star, as that reduced the stress on their ships and makes it easy to recharge the jumpdrive with a solarsail.
Sublight travel is limited. No in-system hyperjumps, no travel near lightspeed, no artificial gravity. Most flight is done at an acceleration of 1 G and needs to decelerate after half the distance traveled. Sometime, to reduce travel time, the flight is done with 2 or even 3 G, but that is expremly stressfull to the human body, for such an extended time period and would decrease the combat capabilities of the troops. Such a hard burn is mostly reserved for emergencies.

4. You are attacking a planet. Look at the earth... how many climate zones do we have? How many different environments? The opposition can chose their battlefield, while you are still in transit from your jumppoint. The whole planet is a possible battlefield.

So... how do you know, weeks before you make landfall, what type of mech and equipment you will need? Just because we are playing a game, we shouldn't ignore the universe we are playing in.

Edited by Egomane, 08 October 2014 - 12:36 PM.

[Myke Pantera]

I'll just quote myself from the Game Mode Voting - Poll V2.0

myself said:

Hi folks, given how many players seem to have a problem with this voting system, i suggest disabling it for now, BUT reenable it along with a feature to take 4 mechs of the same class into the battle, and once you know which Map and GameMode it will be you can select one of those. Maybe you can reuse some Dropshipmode code for this?!

This would:

• Allow Assault pilots to bring something quicker to the field if it's Conquest instead of Skirmish/Assault
  
• Allow Locust pilots (like myself) to pick something else in case it's not Conquest mode
  
• Adds something to the metagame. Who is better at preparing for different circumstances?
  
• Will reduce the hate against Alpine or Terra Therma, because people can bring something appropriate

If this was implemented and it turns out that the possibility to bring specialized mechs for certain maps will cause spamming issues (Like Gaussfest for Alpine, or LRMfest for Caustic), it might need to be designed, so that mech selection needs to be done before the map is announced.

So yeah, I am all for this, although there is one thing that needs to be seen: If Alpine turns into a either dual gauss or get [redacted] map, or Caustic Valley turns into either LRM or get... you catch my drift. So to avoid over-specialization, I think it's necessary that the number of mechs to choose from is limited to 4 of the same weight-class. Also we need this mode voting back, so people need not only consider hot-cold, shortrange-longrange but also the game mode in their preparations. ++metagame.

On the negative side, this means we have to buy certain modules 4 times, but we need to do that for the upcoming 'Invasion' mode anyway...

MilesTeg1982, on 16 April 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

... Also this would finaly kill every allround-build there is because players using these builds would always have a disadvantage compared to players using specialised builds for single maps.

My biggest concern also! If number of mechs to pick from is limited, and there are more things to consider than just map, e.g. game mode, some might still put an allrounder into their selectable mech list as fallback. But yeah, i agree, there is a high risk, that versatile builds will dwindle. On the other hand, how many players are using jack-of-all-trades builds anyhow?

Edited by Egomane, 10 October 2014 - 01:08 AM.
avoiding word filter

[MilesTeg1982]

Myke Pantera, on 09 October 2014 - 11:03 PM, said:

So to avoid over-specialization, I think it's necessary that the number of mechs to choose from is limited to 4 of the same weight-class. Also we need this mode voting back, so people need not only consider hot-cold, shortrange-longrange but also the game mode in their preparations.

(I). the game mode has very little influence on the mech build - in theorie yes some builds could be more effective than others for certain game modes. However the influence of the map layout is much higher.

(II). 4 mechs to choose from are more than enough to have specialized builds for pretty much any map, example:

1. LRM-Boat
2. Ballistic-Build
3. Energy Build
4. <pick whatever you want>

(III). Yes many players do use speacilized builds allready - these players are taking the risk that their build might be not the best for a certain map - fair trade imho.

ps. isn't it funny that most people complaining about a certain map allways refer to some characteristic of the map they have problems with - TT = Heat, Alpine = to big (favours long range), Caustic = very little LRM-Cover, River City = too small (well for a DWF), Mine = to much cover (for people who know how to use their brain), to little cover (for pewpew kids)

pps. did you consider how much it would suck if everyone else would have the option to pick specalized builds too - not just you?