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Are Mediums An Endangered Species?

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#1 Octantis

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 09:41 PM

I love to play mediums. Yet I see less and less of them on the field. Of all the matches I played tonight the other team didn't have a single one. Every team is heavy and assault with each assault being a Dragon Slayer with 2 ppcs and 2 ac5s.

Having been in a medium I can see why no one plays them. Take the old weathered chassis of a Yen Lo Wang. A couple of flights of missiles and the arm is tossed off. Get stuck on terrain and you're cored out in a second. Truth be told the only mediums I see any more are Shadowhawks and Cicadas. Are the other chassis obsolete?

Cents used to have the luxury of being a real strong mech. Since the "fix" for hit boxes there just isn't much left for them to do.

Lately with my mediums I just hide for the first half of the match until someone on the other team gets impatient and I dog pile with everyone else. With an AC20 on your arm and 2 medium lasers you can't do much until the brawl starts. Even then everyone is gunning for you as you are the softest target.

I've been an ardent defender of playing mediums forever yet even I am losing my faith.

I guess with the launch module coming up there has to be some on the field or nobody will be dropping at all.

Thanks for letting pour out my sadness. I think I need to take a break until the 29th.

Edited by Egomane, 22 April 2014 - 10:53 PM.


#2 Darth Futuza

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:35 PM

No. My hunchback still works great. Used it to hold off the enemy for a good 5 minutes and kill a few of them with only one other teammate left.

#3 XX Sulla XX

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:48 PM

Well we are getting 3-3-3-3 so there are going to be mediums :P

#4 xe N on

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:50 PM

Pugging only. In my Metahawk 5M (2xPPC + 1xAC5) I score often more damage than in my Victor.

On regular basis I score also more damage then heavies or even assaults in my team.

However, it quite depends on the medium. In a brawler Cent it is quite more difficult to pull of some damage.

Edited by xe N on, 22 April 2014 - 10:50 PM.


#5 Lyoto Machida

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:50 PM

Nope...are still fine and will see more play most likely with the 3/3/3/3 coming up. Private matches will allow for user run leagues so you'll probably see stuff like 3L/5M/3H/1A more in those types of games/leagues (to fit more with lore).

#6 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:51 PM

I run almost exclusively mediums, and see plenty of SHDs and HBKs still. Griffs and Wolverines and Cicadas seem to be tapering off some, and Cents, and KNTs are getting scarce, whereas the Treb is all but extinct.


That said, I reckon I see at least 3-4 Mediums per match. Do think the number should be higher, though.

#7 Roachbugg

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:54 PM

i have been driving a lot of mediums lately especially my griff and S hawk

#8 Karl Streiger

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 10:55 PM

I think slow mediums are near extinction - really you don't want to run 60-70kph in a Mech that don't have enough armor - to survive even - 4 -5 seconds in the LOS of the enemy.
Maybe it will change with 3/3/3/3 because the number of one hit wonders will be removed.... but even than i don't see a place where the classical HBK-4G or CN9-A can exist

the high end mediums Cicade, or the Big 55s are another story - as some of the newbie friendly Hunchbacks

Edited by Karl Streiger, 22 April 2014 - 10:56 PM.


#9 YueFei

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 11:25 PM

Medium Mechs are fine, it's the maps and game modes that need a shake-down.

It's just like how a Gridiron Football Running Back is a valued member of the team despite there being much larger and stronger guys on the field, as well as others who are much faster and more agile.

But if Gridiron Football was played on a field only 30 feet wide instead of 160 feet wide, your typical Running Back wouldn't have enough room to be useful. That's not an issue with the physique of the athlete, that'd be a problem with the design of the sport.

#10 Eglar

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 11:41 PM

View PostKarl Streiger, on 22 April 2014 - 10:55 PM, said:

you don't want to run 60-70kph in a Mech

ew, sounds like you want to play a medium as an assault to me D-: Medium mechs should start with at least 80 in my books and can go up to 151 with speed tweak. While the Cicada is more like a Light mech, other medium mechs do have their place. I admit that not all medium mechs are the same but this goes for any other weight class(locust, dragon, awesome).

Currently the shadowhawk is undoubtedly the strongest medium mech within the same weight class and also makes it into the competetive 12-mens regularly, other medium mechs do have their place. Apart from the SDH, I also play the BJ-1, BJ-3, CN9-A, CN9-YLW(something different heh), HBK-4H and HBK-4P regularly with all of them having a k/d of 4+ and a w/l of 3+.

Every new player who just started MWO and are about to buy their first mech I recommend the SDH, simply because the SDH variants offer so much versatility in terms of options (jj, big engine, decent armor) and variety (a great compliment of hardpoints,) that you can actually level up 3 different variants while still enjoying the game. A much better option than falling for the typical 100 ton Atlas Trap.

Every Player wanting to train jumpsniping I'd put onto a Bj-3 with 2x PPCs 2 JJs and lots of heatsinks.

#11 Karl Streiger

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 11:57 PM

View PostEglar, on 22 April 2014 - 11:41 PM, said:

ew, sounds like you want to play a medium as an assault to me

Nope - just a fact - that those Mechs don't have a real purpose

HBK-4G
CN9-A

not when they are forced to face:
CTF-1X
CTF-2X

and as said the fast 40 or 55t don't have the "problems" of their mediocre kin in the 45t and 50t bracket

#12 Onmyoudo

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 11:58 PM

I regularly see every medium except Trebuchets. Even Kintaros are more popular.

#13 YueFei

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 12:02 AM

One other thing I have noticed is that the more skilled players are very quick to make the decision to shield themselves when they step around the wrong corner. I still have this problem where my instinct is to shoot first, and then shield afterwards, but the problem with doing that is if the enemy is looking right at where I'm popping out, it's a lousy trade cuz I'll catch the Heavy/Assault's alpha in my chest.

For example I've spectated Helmstif's HBK play, and he has good instincts so he often pops out when the enemy isn't looking, probably 75+% of the time. But occasionally the enemy is looking exactly at where he pops out, and rather than trying to line up a shot and shoot he'll twist first and block the shot, then use footwork and speed to get an angle and make a shot, so he still retaliates against the slower Heavy/Assault mech before it can pull behind cover, and then Helmstif will pull away and reposition to try from another angle. It also helps that the HBK's *incredible* torso twist range lets you wheel away and be running backward at an oblique angle back into cover, without ever exposing your back to the enemy, because of the ~130 degree twist.... you're basically sleeting back toward cover at a 45 degree angle moving away from the enemy. Most other mechs would expose their backside doing this, so they have to do the forward/reverse shuffle, but the HBK doesn't have to.

By doing this, even when he steps out at the wrong place, he preserves his all-important right shoulder Hunch, and continues to contribute to the fight.

Most mediocre pilots, like myself, tend to step around a corner and line up a shot and shoot, and even if it's just a fraction of a second that we spend on making that shot, it's often long enough for the enemy to drill us where it hurts.

I have to admit I don't quite have the ability to execute that kind of stuff, I'll end up tripping over things or ramming buildings. Or, as I've often done lately, I'll twist *too far*, and catch a shot in the back shoulder, and die instantly, which has happened more than I'd like to admit in my CN9-AL (which I recently threw an XL into... makes it exciting! But sometimes I get one-shotted).

Edited by YueFei, 23 April 2014 - 12:07 AM.


#14 Ulketulke

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 12:25 AM

Mediums have less Firepower and armor than heavies and assaults.
The lights can compensate that with their speed and their small mech models.
Mediums neither have enough armor nor enough speed to survive a direct battle vs heavies/assaults.
So the only role they can fit in, is a range support with PPC/LRM/Gauss/ACs or light hunter with a lot of streaks [in PUGs].

Edited by Ulketulke, 23 April 2014 - 12:28 AM.


#15 Revorn

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 01:14 AM

Iam doing surprisingly well with this nearly classical Cent. :P

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eeed3cc0a9dcc3c

or this one.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...cd85523a3f17a7e

but also with my Griffins an Wolfs. Oki playing a Medium is a hard Job, but rewarding in Fun as well. Imho.

Edited by Revorn, 23 April 2014 - 01:17 AM.


#16 Samziel

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 01:45 AM

The new Shadowhawk 2K became my favourite mech straight away! Rocking it with 4 KDR :P

Edited by Samziel, 23 April 2014 - 01:45 AM.


#17 Curccu

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 01:49 AM

Good news dude, next week 3/3/3/3 is going kick in and every game will have 3 medium mechs for each side!
and brawling isn't only option for a medium mech :P

#18 Smitti

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 02:18 AM

I really enjoy my Griffins and Wolvies, especially the GRF-1N and 3M and the WVR-6P. I use them for LRMishing/sniping, light hunting, hit-and-fade sneaky backstabbing, and running circles around and over Fatlases and Hidelanders.

They also make wonderful fiery tombs whenever I misjudge a situation or become over-confident in my abilities. I have a tendency to play very aggressively in some of them, leaping from fight to fight without even stopping to cool off or assess the battlefield.

#19 AlexEss

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 02:38 AM

View PostUlketulke, on 23 April 2014 - 12:25 AM, said:

Mediums have less Firepower and armor than heavies and assaults.
The lights can compensate that with their speed and their small mech models.
Mediums neither have enough armor nor enough speed to survive a direct battle vs heavies/assaults.
So the only role they can fit in, is a range support with PPC/LRM/Gauss/ACs or light hunter with a lot of streaks [in PUGs].


Heh.. I guess that is true if you try to run them ahead of the pack. The trick is to hang back a bit and let the big buys (who are very over represented right now) take the brunt of the anger and then you sweep up and do some ugly stuff. Heck right now i´d say my best performing mech is my HBK 4SP with SRM´s and Med lasers. Especially as people tent to ignore SRM due to their wonky hit detection... But forget that said problem is not constant... And when a pair of SRM4´s hit you full force.. it hurts.

By the same merit my YLW is a decent brawler.. Sure you can find better ones i am sure but it is a ac/20 wielding menace that usually only need one or two good hits to kill you.

Mediums do in no way shape or form NEED to hang back, it just takes some thinking on the part of the pilot.

Edited by AlexEss, 23 April 2014 - 02:39 AM.


#20 Trevor Belmont

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 02:49 AM

I play my Treb 3C all the time. It's my favorite Medium hands down. XL 360 for a top speed of 128 kph, 4 MLs, 2 Streak 2s, AMS, BAP, 14 DHS and almost max armor. No one expects a Treb to be that fast. And it can take on lights easily. Almost a 2/1 KD ratio in it.


http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5360fa0058d6272

Edited by Trevor Belmont, 23 April 2014 - 03:06 AM.






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