Jump to content

New Clan Info


62 replies to this topic

#1 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 03:31 AM

VIa:

https://soundcloud.c...nogalaxy/mdb-15

Ultra-Autocannons will be firing in bursts. Thank god. Now if they can only do that for all ultra-autocannons in the game.... Still a jam chance.

Lasers will do more damage, will take up less space, will have more range, but will also have that extended burn time. More required time on target to do full beam damage.

LRMs firing in ripple fire. Oh yeah. Totally nailed this one, suckas. :P A very fast ripple fire. Think MW2 ripple fire. This is exactly what I hoped for, as it provides counterplay in AMS, but keeps the LRM system totally functional as a direct fire weapon system. This is intended to be placed on top of the minimum range concept they are mulling over, where it does 0 damage at zero meters and 80% at 160 meters. The actual damage curve is being tinkered with. Could even have a "minimum" of less than 180 for all we know.

This surprised me. They are already eyeballing ATMs. Not sold on inclusion but they are already looking at them. I thought these were post Tukayyid weapon systems. o_0

HOLY CRAP. Clan LBX. He is trying to give us CLUSTER/SOLID toggle! Happy day! But, he wants to keep it a Clan only feature. Still, dual modal LBX! FINALLY!

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 23 April 2014 - 03:31 AM.


#2 FireSlade

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,174 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 23 April 2014 - 03:57 AM

Love the ripple fire idea for the CLRMs since I have been secretly wishing that the IS missiles did the same. Sounds like the Ultras are going to be handled nicely since I was freaking out about having to deal with 80 damage in less than 5 seconds for something that weighs 12 tons, 24 in total. Lasers I do not mind since they have their perks, there should be drawbacks. And that would be nice to see on the LBXs, making at least a direct damage option for the Clans. Now if only they could figure out how to ballance ballistics properly so that an energy mech like the Quickdraw can at least keep up with a Jagermech with out the pilot feeling like they ran through a minefield blindfolded and hands tied behind their back. Going to try to listen to the broadcast later today, Thanks for the info.

#3 Odanan

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 8,199 posts
  • LocationBrazil

Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:18 AM

View PostPariah Devalis, on 23 April 2014 - 03:31 AM, said:

VIa:

https://soundcloud.c...nogalaxy/mdb-15

Ultra-Autocannons will be firing in bursts. Thank god. Now if they can only do that for all ultra-autocannons in the game.... Still a jam chance.

Lasers will do more damage, will take up less space, will have more range, but will also have that extended burn time. More required time on target to do full beam damage.

LRMs firing in ripple fire. Oh yeah. Totally nailed this one, suckas. :P A very fast ripple fire. Think MW2 ripple fire. This is exactly what I hoped for, as it provides counterplay in AMS, but keeps the LRM system totally functional as a direct fire weapon system. This is intended to be placed on top of the minimum range concept they are mulling over, where it does 0 damage at zero meters and 80% at 160 meters. The actual damage curve is being tinkered with. Could even have a "minimum" of less than 180 for all we know.

This surprised me. They are already eyeballing ATMs. Not sold on inclusion but they are already looking at them. I thought these were post Tukayyid weapon systems. o_0

HOLY CRAP. Clan LBX. He is trying to give us CLUSTER/SOLID toggle! Happy day! But, he wants to keep it a Clan only feature. Still, dual modal LBX! FINALLY!

Thanks for the info, Pariah.

Oh boy... Paul's nerf gun is happy triggering.

#4 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:28 AM

View PostFireSlade, on 23 April 2014 - 03:57 AM, said:

Love the ripple fire idea for the CLRMs since I have been secretly wishing that the IS missiles did the same. Sounds like the Ultras are going to be handled nicely since I was freaking out about having to deal with 80 damage in less than 5 seconds for something that weighs 12 tons, 24 in total. Lasers I do not mind since they have their perks, there should be drawbacks. And that would be nice to see on the LBXs, making at least a direct damage option for the Clans. Now if only they could figure out how to ballance ballistics properly so that an energy mech like the Quickdraw can at least keep up with a Jagermech with out the pilot feeling like they ran through a minefield blindfolded and hands tied behind their back. Going to try to listen to the broadcast later today, Thanks for the info.



No kidding. I suppose the two energy balancing approaches they could take would either be to directly modify all autocannons, both AC and UAC, to burst fire (thereby introducing a "burn time" to ballistics) or to cut down the burn time on lasers directly (which would essentially make them hitscan front-loaders). I would personally be more inclined to make Standard and Ultra ACs burst, considering the implications of hitscan front loaded damage is beyond nuts. The problem (as I see it, so personal opinion can vary), is that instead of trading heat for weight, like energy vs ballistics have traditionally done, we currently have a heavy weapon that is cold and deals up front damage vs a hot weapon that deals damage over time, making it an unequal trade. Damage should be damage should be damage, but it is not. :\

#5 Av4tar

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 193 posts
  • LocationOcean 12

Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:32 AM

any infos about omni slots, any restrichtion?

#6 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:37 AM

Nothing aside from the beautifully detailed tech post about it from earlier. Which basically amounted to:

All "variants" for the sake of the pilot tree are based on the center torso of the mech. Left arm, right arm, left torso, right torso (right and left legs?) are modular between 'variants' of the same chassis. So, all variants of a TImber Wolf can share omnipods, but you cannot use a pod from a Summoner. However, left arm means left arm, right arm means right arm. You cannot stick a right arm on the left arm slot, nor a left torso on the right side of a mech. Omni pods can be purchasable in the mechbay in addition to them coming on the preconfigured variants to cannibalize.

Armor VALUES are adjustable, but armor TYPE (ferro vs standard) is not. Internal structure TYPE is also locked, as is the engine of the mech.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 23 April 2014 - 04:38 AM.


#7 Raiyuken

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 74 posts

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:10 AM

I still believe lasers shouldn't retain it's current model. Understand that this game is an online game and thus when a weapon requiring more burn time meaning it would miss most of the time. And on top of that, most users of energy weapons are light mechs and they do not have the luxury to have more DHSs when they required Endo and Ferrous.

Normal Lasers should use current Pulse Laser model whereas Pulse Laser should use a capacitor model where you can discharge the beam up to a upper limit stronger than Normal Laser. For example:

Medium Laser 5 DMG 0.5s burn time CD 3.0s.
M. Pulse Laser 7 DMG 0.75s capacitor capacity Recharge rate of 0.25s capacity/s.

Both should have same min/max range as reduce range should strictly be reserved for X-Pulse Lasers in the future.

It was always illogical that a missile would do no DMG sub 180m but would could still be critically hit. So yes allow something like a alternate mode like 40% rack capacity under the logic that by firing more than 40% missile salvo will cause chain explosion from the target to the launchers.

As far as Ultra AC goes this is a welcomed idea of a dual mode and burst fire as I find the current UAC model is more of the Rotary AC model. LBX should not be allowed to fire like a normal AC as it would make AC really redundant, should there be a need give it a long range mode make it a ring with less spread but there must still be spread.

Gauss currently has too many Cons compared to its Pros. Weighing, requiring so many critical slots and being highly volatile on top of that add a charge up time would render the weapon really weak compared to other ballistic weapons. Remove the charge up increase the CD and a slight DMG increase but disable weapon being usable while being airborne. (Hence preventing pop-tarting)

PPC should be allowed to turn off sub 90m protection where point blank PPC fire would deal damage to an upwards of 1-50% from 90m to 1m. Whereas ER-PPC should remain it's sub 90m protection have a 25% heat increased compared to a PPC. In addition to that PPC hits beyond it's max damage range will deal dissipated splash damage. For example:
860m PPC to CT = 10 DMG CT
1200m PPC to the CT = 10*0.61 = 6.1*0.75 = 4.5DMG on CT 6.1*.25/5 = 0.3 DMG on H LT RT LL RL

As far for Omnislots, it should have one weakness is that internals have 2 times easier to be critical destroyed once it is cored, where the chances of being destroyed just as the last scrap of armor is shaved off. This is to compensate for its benefit of being flexible.

Current machine gun model should also be changed too. Remove the twice the critical on core but instead change it to twice the critical chance should the machine guns hit a laser burn zone as long as there is a glow. This would make lights using them being more viable bringing SLs to "light" up for better damage instead of getting builds where people equip machine guns just to be piranhas swarming into cored mechs. This model would at least make machine gun viable when there is still armor on the target.

Moreover it is also understood that Clan XL engine doesn't fail should one Side torso be destroyed. However, asking for 2 Torsos to be destroyed is just asking for too much. I would say put one of the following in the event of LT or RT being destroyed:

-Mech can no longer perform Torso turn.
-Mech will be unable to function should one Side Torso be destroyed along with a leg.
-Mech will lose 50% of it's internal heat sinks.

Edited by Raiyuken, 23 April 2014 - 05:24 AM.


#8 BLOOD WOLF

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Jaws
  • The Jaws
  • 6,368 posts
  • Locationnowhere

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:11 AM

I dont know how i feel about them U/auto-cannons. This is interesting.

#9 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:13 AM

View PostRaiyuken, on 23 April 2014 - 05:10 AM, said:

I still believe lasers shouldn't retain it's current model. Understand that this game is an online game and thus when a weapon requiring more burn time meaning it would miss most of the time. And on top of that, most users of energy weapons are light mechs and they do not have the luxury to have more DHSs when they required Endo and Ferrous.

Normal Lasers should use current Pulse Laser model whereas Pulse Laser should use a capacitor model where you can discharge the beam up to a upper limit stronger than Normal Laser. For example:

Medium Laser 5 DMG 0.5s burn time CD 3.0s.
M. Pulse Laser 7 DMG 0.75s capacitor capacity Recharge rate of 0.25s capacity/s.

Both should have same min/max range as reduce range should strictly be reserved for X-Pulse Lasers in the future.

It was always illogical that a missile would do no DMG sub 180m but would could still be critically hit. So yes allow something like a alternate mode like 40% rack capacity under the logic that by firing more than 40% missile salvo will cause chain explosion from the target to the launchers.

As far as Ultra AC goes this is a welcomed idea of a dual mode and burst fire as I find the current UAC model is more of the Rotary AC model. LBX should not be allowed to fire like a normal AC as it would make AC really redundant, should there be a need give it a long range mode make it a ring with less spread but there must still be spread.

Gauss currently has too many Cons compared to its Pros. Weighing and requiring so many critical slots and being highly volatile on top of that add a charge up time would render the weapon really weak compared to other ballistic weapons. Remove the charge up increase the CD and a slight DMG increase but disable weapon being usable while being airborne. (Hence preventing pop-tarting)

PPC should be allowed to turn off sub 90m protection where point blank PPC fire would deal damage to an upwards of 1-50% from 90m to 1m. Whereas ER-PPC should remain it's sub 90m protection have a 25% heat increased compared to a PPC. In addition to that PPC hits beyond it's max damage range will deal dissipated splash damage. For example:
860m PPC to CT = 10 DMG CT
1200m PPC to the CT = 10*0.61 = 6.1*0.75 = 4.5DMG on CT 6.1*.25/5 = 0.3 DMG on H LT RT LL RL



Some things in your response do not make sense in the context of the new info. Specifically the ultra/lbx comments you made. The Ultras will not have a toggle. They will be burst fire, always. The LBX will have a toggle, between cluster and solid. They do not want to give that option to the IS because it could invalidate the standard AC completely, but clan mechs have no standard AC so a toggle mode for LBX, like it is supposed to have in lore, makes sense. Clan ERPPC have no minimum range, as well.

#10 Lukoi Banacek

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • WC 2018 Top 12 Qualifier
  • WC 2018 Top 12 Qualifier
  • 4,353 posts

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:30 AM

Well... FLD weapon combos shall remain king but this at least looks interesting for thr non-meta level of fun. And Clans do not seem UP or OP overly much based on the description. I look forward to their arrival even more now. Thanks for the x-update **.

#11 Raiyuken

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 74 posts

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:35 AM

Just finished the listening to the recording. Well what was stated if I'm not mistaken that Clan UAC 20 will fire in a chain-burst of 4 rounds of AC5. Current ER PPC doesn't have a minimum range either, it's just that should be an option for PPCs to turn of it's safety feature just as it is stated in Battletech to allow for sub 90m firing.

Due to balancing reason there should be a difference between Clan LBX, IS AC and IS LBX. The Clan LBX can be of same efficiency as the IS LBX but when switched to cluster fire should not have the same pinpoint accuracy as the IS AC, cause that would invalidate IS AC and IS LBX. Thus leaving a food for thought as to would you want this weapon to be sort-of good long range sniping weapon but able switch mode when the death dancers comes closing in. Still I do think that even if Clan LBX have the same efficiency as an IS LBX would invalidate IS LBX, so maybe a quirk like wider spread pattern for the Clan LBX.

Edited by Raiyuken, 23 April 2014 - 05:36 AM.


#12 Odanan

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 8,199 posts
  • LocationBrazil

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:41 AM

View PostRaiyuken, on 23 April 2014 - 05:35 AM, said:

Just finished the listening to the recording. Well what was stated if I'm not mistaken that Clan UAC 20 will fire in a chain-burst of 4 rounds of AC5.

That's a very clever solution for balancing! It might work.
I'm impressed.

But what about UAC/10?

#13 shellashock

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Little Helper
  • 439 posts

Posted 23 April 2014 - 05:58 AM

Looking forward to this!

#14 CyclonerM

    Tina's Warrior

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • 5,684 posts
  • LocationA 2nd Wolf Guards Grenadiers JumpShip

Posted 23 April 2014 - 06:18 AM

View PostPariah Devalis, on 23 April 2014 - 03:31 AM, said:

VIa:

https://soundcloud.c...nogalaxy/mdb-15

Ultra-Autocannons will be firing in bursts. Thank god. Now if they can only do that for all ultra-autocannons in the game.... Still a jam chance.

Lasers will do more damage, will take up less space, will have more range, but will also have that extended burn time. More required time on target to do full beam damage.

LRMs firing in ripple fire. Oh yeah. Totally nailed this one, suckas. :P A very fast ripple fire. Think MW2 ripple fire. This is exactly what I hoped for, as it provides counterplay in AMS, but keeps the LRM system totally functional as a direct fire weapon system. This is intended to be placed on top of the minimum range concept they are mulling over, where it does 0 damage at zero meters and 80% at 160 meters. The actual damage curve is being tinkered with. Could even have a "minimum" of less than 180 for all we know.

This surprised me. They are already eyeballing ATMs. Not sold on inclusion but they are already looking at them. I thought these were post Tukayyid weapon systems. o_0

HOLY CRAP. Clan LBX. He is trying to give us CLUSTER/SOLID toggle! Happy day! But, he wants to keep it a Clan only feature. Still, dual modal LBX! FINALLY!

Yeah! Burst-fire UACs! But then why they do not make IS ACs burst-fire too?
maybe standard ACs could fire a single shell like as they currently do while the UAC/s are burst-fire to give ACs an advantage over UACs.

LBX.. Great!The toggle is something i was not hoping anymore!

But. .I understand from a balance viewpoint, but how in the hell are missiles supposed to deal less damage at 160 meters than at 180? I never heard of "charging" warheads B)

View PostOdanan, on 23 April 2014 - 05:41 AM, said:

That's a very clever solution for balancing! It might work.
I'm impressed.

But what about UAC/10?

2 shells dealing 5 damage each? ;)

EDIT: about ATMs.. Yes. 3060 ^_^ Why not Arrow IVs instead? They would be different from LRMs and compatible timeline wise. They could start adding the C3 Catapult variant.

Edited by CyclonerM, 23 April 2014 - 06:24 AM.


#15 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:02 AM

View PostCyclonerM, on 23 April 2014 - 06:18 AM, said:

Yeah! Burst-fire UACs! But then why they do not make IS ACs burst-fire too?
maybe standard ACs could fire a single shell like as they currently do while the UAC/s are burst-fire to give ACs an advantage over UACs.

LBX.. Great!The toggle is something i was not hoping anymore!

But. .I understand from a balance viewpoint, but how in the hell are missiles supposed to deal less damage at 160 meters than at 180? I never heard of "charging" warheads ^_^


2 shells dealing 5 damage each? :P

EDIT: about ATMs.. Yes. 3060 ;) Why not Arrow IVs instead? They would be different from LRMs and compatible timeline wise. They could start adding the C3 Catapult variant.



Rough interpretation? The LRM warheads are not armed while in the tubes, and the reduced damage is a function of not all of them being fully armed before impact? I understand they need balancing, and being able to actually do some damage at a knife range is wonderful. I just wonder if they should reduce that scaling damage to start at 90 or 100 meters in as opposed to 180.

#16 Odanan

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 8,199 posts
  • LocationBrazil

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:04 AM

View PostCyclonerM, on 23 April 2014 - 06:18 AM, said:

2 shells dealing 5 damage each? :P

That's IS UAC/5.

#17 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:06 AM

View PostOdanan, on 23 April 2014 - 07:04 AM, said:

[/size]
That's IS UAC/5.


Two bursts of an IS UAC5, actually. Two bursts of a UAC10 would be 4 shells of 5. Or, alternatively, one burst can be 3 shells of 3.33 damage each. UAC5 two shells of 2.5 damage each. UAC2 being just a super high rate of fire single shell?

#18 J0anna

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Merciless
  • The Merciless
  • 939 posts

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:18 AM

The burst fire of UAC's could be good or bad, for example if the UAC-20 fires 5 rounds over 5 seconds, it will quickly be passed over for the LBX-20. So what really matters is how long the burst is. Time will tell...

The swapping ammo for the LBX is a dream come true, about time. While clan weapons having the same Ghost heat worries me ( possibly useless Warhawk and Nova) I could swear I heard Phil say (and Paul agree) that Clan Double heatsinks remove more heat than IS Double heatsinks (around the 43 minute mark Phil states the efficiency of clan double heatsinks is "pretty staggering" and Paul agrees) - This is absolutely essential as Clan Mechs are energy weapon heavy in general - having true doubles would significantly help.

Without true clan weapons and the restrictions on customizing mechs, I can't see the Summoner ever being the equal of the cataphract without some help, but time will tell.

#19 Pariah Devalis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Clan Cat
  • The Clan Cat
  • 7,655 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationAboard the NCS True Path

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:20 AM

I missed that bit about clan doubles. Or rather, I just assumed it was because they are smaller and can therefore be fit in larger quantities. Had not even crossed my mind that they might be true dubs, or anything more than 1.4s, anyways. If so, the efficiency of several of my planned mechs just skyrocketed, and they were going to be sick before.

#20 NocturnalBeast

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 3,685 posts
  • LocationDusting off my Mechs.

Posted 23 April 2014 - 07:25 AM

View PostPariah Devalis, on 23 April 2014 - 03:31 AM, said:

VIa:

https://soundcloud.c...nogalaxy/mdb-15

Ultra-Autocannons will be firing in bursts. Thank god. Now if they can only do that for all ultra-autocannons in the game.... Still a jam chance.

Lasers will do more damage, will take up less space, will have more range, but will also have that extended burn time. More required time on target to do full beam damage.

LRMs firing in ripple fire. Oh yeah. Totally nailed this one, suckas. :P A very fast ripple fire. Think MW2 ripple fire. This is exactly what I hoped for, as it provides counterplay in AMS, but keeps the LRM system totally functional as a direct fire weapon system. This is intended to be placed on top of the minimum range concept they are mulling over, where it does 0 damage at zero meters and 80% at 160 meters. The actual damage curve is being tinkered with. Could even have a "minimum" of less than 180 for all we know.

This surprised me. They are already eyeballing ATMs. Not sold on inclusion but they are already looking at them. I thought these were post Tukayyid weapon systems. o_0

HOLY CRAP. Clan LBX. He is trying to give us CLUSTER/SOLID toggle! Happy day! But, he wants to keep it a Clan only feature. Still, dual modal LBX! FINALLY!


This all but guarantees that I will be doing my best to procure a Dire Wolf!





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users