40 replies to this topic

[JC Daxion]

I just want all the newbies out there to know... High damage is generally bad...


While sure, 600+ damage, 4 kills+9 assists.. is always good......

500+ or 600+ on 3-5 mechs, and you loose?? why? because mechs are just soaking damage.

remember, most mechs are only 40-50 damage for a kill or 60-80 perhaps 100 tops... the best games i have ever played, one person had 300 damage... everyone else, 6-7 assists, and under 200..

I have personally had 4 kills with 100 damage... (gotta love an AC-20) but hitting damage spots, is 20x better than just spreading damage... Personally i think PGI should rig the cash count to bonus on damage spots... and reduce on armored... buy that is a different topic.

anyway, don't be obsessed with damage counts.. 9 times out of ten it is about people with bad aim..........

Edited by JC Daxion, 23 April 2014 - 08:38 PM.

[Koniks]

While that's true, racking up lots of damage also means that a pilot survived and was in position to participate in a lot of the match.

[White Bear 84]

JC Daxion, on 23 April 2014 - 08:37 PM, said:

I just want all the newbies out there to know... High damage is generally bad... While sure, 600+ damage, 4 kills+9 assists.. is always good...... 500+ or 600+ on 3-5 mechs, and you loose?? why? because mechs are just soaking damage. remember, most mechs are only 40-50 damage for a kill or 60-80 perhaps 100 tops... the best games i have ever played, one person had 300 damage... everyone else, 6-7 assists, and under 200.. I have personally had 4 kills with 100 damage... (gotta love an AC-20) but hitting damage spots, is 20x better than just spreading damage... Personally i think PGI should rig the cash count to bonus on damage spots... and reduce on armored... buy that is a different topic. anyway, don't be obsessed with damage counts.. 9 times out of ten it is about people with bad aim..........

So much wrong with this post... ...in fact, the whole opening statement is just completely misleading.

Just because you get '500+ or 600+ on 3-5 mechs, and you loose' does mean that a pilot has bad aim. If you are doing that much damage and the rest of your team is not, then the pilot is obviously carrying a lot harder than the rest of the team - this is a given since as the team has done hardly any damage and are getting popped by the enemy - getting stomped, leading to a loss irrespective of the work you put in.

Now if you were trying to say to newb pilots that it is better to focus fire rather than shoot all over the place.. ..that is a different story?

Damage scores do vary between matches, but more than often getting a high damage is reflective of a concerted effort by a pilot to contribute as much as possible to the team. I would hardly go calling 500+ on 3/5 mechs... ...bad aim...

Edited by White Bear 84, 23 April 2014 - 08:52 PM.

[Hoffenstein]

6 damage, 1 kill. Best Commandlol match evar

[Shatterpoint]

I agree with the principal, though it really says more about the AC20 to me than high damage..it's a lot harder to pinpoint that dmg for a quick kill if you're using missiles, lasers at a distance and such.

[XX Sulla XX]

Many kills and low damage can also mean you are just killing already damaged mechs.

[SnagaDance]

With my missile mech Lrm 60) I often get great damage numbers but low numbers in kills. That's because if the enemy is seriously damaged and there are also friendlies targeting that mech I'll stop firing in order to save ammo/start stripping a new target.

This together with the spread damage nature of Lrm's means my high damage games are an indication of good matches. It depends on the mech and the weapon systems.

[Androas]

Maybe my math is off, but, 4 Kills and 9 Assists, totals to 13....

So yeah, if you start TKing, thats really bad

But that aside, as others allready stated, if a few on the team pull such numbers, and you still loose, there was something horrible horrible wrong with the rest of the team....

[ImperialKnight]

XX Sulla XX, on 23 April 2014 - 11:42 PM, said:

Many kills and low damage can also mean you are just killing already damaged mechs.

I have no problem with team mates cleaning up. It's FAR preferably to team mates who spam damage all over the mech when it's CT is cherry red

[Rumrunner2]

4 kills with only 100damage?
Somebody else from ur team destroyed the armor of ur opponents and u placed the final hits in an open spot.
I call this luck or killstealing but not good gaming.

[Errinovar]

This really shouldn't be in the New Player Help because it is spreading misinformation about the way the stats are compiled. What it ignores is that while 4+ players might have hit 600 damage and only managed 3-5 kills/assists that you cannot surmise that all that damage was focused solely on those 3-5 enemy mechs. Assist numbers only come from enemy deaths.. so it would be very possible to have someone with 750+ damage done with 0 kills and 1-3 assists who was actually very active and spread that damage out among 8-10 enemies but got smoked with their team before they could land many kills.

While the idea that putting 600 damage on only 2-3 mechs is not a sign of good aim, you in no way can generalize that based on damage+k/d stats on most matches unless the end of the match was very close.

[Magna Canus]

On average 120 well placed damage will kill most mech's (often much less). So if you want to work some numbers around 120 damage per kill and 60 per assist are "good". So 600 damage with say 0 kills / 10 assists would be good, or 600 damage with 5 kills, etc.

"Bad" would be sub 30 damage per kill (you are just cleaning up and not really optimally supporting the team), or 12 assists with sub 300 damage (you are not focusing targets and just spamming damage).

The numbers are of course debatable by perspective.

Shoot what your group is shooting at, finish off what can be finished off (as long as it continues to be a threat), aim for meaningful components (e.g. mech has major weapons in this spot, kill is most likely possible, etc.), don't get tunnel vision and waste your support potential (chasing the light & opening the flank, Leeroy Jenkins suicide, etc.), pay attention to the battle field (use radar + mark I Eyeball), take smart risks while avoiding stupid/suicidal ones, and don't be a vulture and make your group do the majority of the work for you (e.g. but on big boy pants). Do that and the numbers fall into place naturally without you needing to concentrate on them.

[Kinski Orlawisch]

Somebody has to weaken up the targets for you bro. Some bad bad guys will call you a kill stealer...

No. Shure it is better to kill him than to destroy just another arm. But think about that somebody opened him for you to finish it.

Mostly lost games include a lot of mechs doing nearly 0 dmg. All run around like mad and a premade concentrates fire with 4 mechs on those singel running mad men. They come out with 0 losses and 10 kills...and won the game......Yeah.

No there is no excuse for bad aiming. Shoot them into the ground. Kill their XL Torso, leg em..do whatever is nessesary. But don t try to aim too Long..else you are dead b4 you can fire.

[Redshift2k5]

you can do 500 damage and do poorly, or you can do 500 damage and do well. And a lack of kills doesn't neccesarily count, either, because you could have done most of the work but been awarded an assist.

[Fuggles]

intentionally cheesing damage by spreading it and trying to shoot off extra body parts that dont even have weapons in them is bad yes, just get the kill and move on to help your team, but there's nothing wrong with high damage and low kills.

LRMs and lasers will spread damage, especially when the target is twisting to spread damage as well. the LRMs role on the battlefield is to soften targets from range so that brawlers can come in and efficiently punch out an enemy. they will get high damage numbers and assists but not that many kills.

there's nothing worse as a brawler mech to run into an enemy group all with near full armor. it simply takes too long to get them down. your going to get into heat trouble or get out maneuvered because the fight takes too long.

unfortunately sometimes you can have a very good damage dealer on a loosing team because their teamates faced softened up enemy's but couldn't finish anyone off. Noobs that don't press R, don't recognize primary targets, or support their teammates (Focus fire) are the worst at this. This is not the support mechs fault.

[1453 R]

600+ damage with 4 kills and 8 assists (assuming you're not intentionally teamkilling, anyways. 4+9 is bad ), would be a pretty fantastic match for me, actually. Matter of fact, I don't know of anyone so pro that they wouldn't take 4(8) w/600 damage. Unless you're some kind of superhuman headshot god.

Edited by 1453 R, 24 April 2014 - 05:24 AM.

[mailin]

It really depends on the mech and the loadout. In my lights with medium pulse lasers, I try to average 1 kill for every 100 damage, and I tend to average about 3 assists for every kill. That's largely because I'm pretty good at aiming my shots in my lights, and I always try to go for the critical body parts. In my lrm boat I have had 1300 damage and 3 kills, but 9 assists. As far as losing, in conquest I could easily see how you could lose with those numbers. No matter what, it looks like maybe those guys did their job but the rest of the team wasn't pulling their weight.

Edited by mailin, 24 April 2014 - 05:34 AM.

[Bigbacon]

am I one of the only few who don't care how much damage + kills + assists + whatever people had?

I care if we win or lose.

don't get me wrong, I like having a good round with lots of stuff at the end but if I got 100 damage and 3 kills then that is fine, I helped. Some mechs you just can't be expect to do tons but every little bit helps in the end.

[AlmightyAeng]

JC Daxion, on 23 April 2014 - 08:37 PM, said:

I just want all the newbies out there to know... High damage is generally bad...


While sure, 600+ damage, 4 kills+9 assists.. is always good......

First off, stop leading new players to believe that they can somehow magically hit 13 enemy mechs in a match. There are 12. Secondly, both of your 'examples' are perfectly good games for a player. They're not amazingohmygodsauce games...but they're doing their job and helping the team. Stop discouraging that.

Thirdly, I could infer from OP that my 1500+ damage game with 4 kills and 8 assists wasn't as good as the example you listed, because I'm doing extra "useless" damage.

I'd disagree, because it depends on the game. If you do 800 damage on a single Atlas and killed it, well, at least you killed it. The guy that did 600 damage with 2 kills and a few assists spread his damage differently...but it doesn't mean he did better or worse. Maybe tying up that Atlas was incredibly useful. Maybe not. Damage hitting a section other than a CT isn't always useless...ever hit a guy cresting a hill in ANY part of his torso and he panics and backs up, preventing his buddies from advancing? That's not a kill, but it's useful. Ever hit a lights leg to have it run away? Useful. When you CAN damage an enemy, you should.

There are few extreme cases where high damage means someone wasn't terribly useful...and it's usually when they have only 1 assist or 1 kill...like putting all their shots into the arms of a banshee that has all it's weapons in the torso.

But those are generally outliers.

[dr bongstorm]

JC Daxion, on 23 April 2014 - 08:37 PM, said:

I have personally had 4 kills with 100 damage

this is called 'kill stealing'. the odds are that the person who actually outplayed and kicked the crap out of those mechs was kind of annoyed with you.

damage is the best metric to score performance on in this game. cherry picking is not an amazing skill. when someone scores 600 damage, it means that that the player busted their ass getting into good positions, made every shot count and was one of the best contributers to your team. trying to take that away and saying "damage doesn't count" is pretty dumb.