Which Medium To Chose?
#1
Posted 11 July 2014 - 07:55 AM
#2
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:00 AM
Good hit boxes, XL friendly, jump jets, can run almost any load out well, and has 5 variants in game currently.
Edited by DarthPeanut, 11 July 2014 - 08:01 AM.
#3
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:16 AM
Shadow Hawk hard to beat. Where to start, dakka, LRMs, SSRM's, SRM's. Not as many energy hard points, but with everything else, you do not need them. You can through a 360 into the thing have SSRMS and chase down lights, especially clan lights. Run with LRMs and cause people nightmares. Then the AC's, through an AC 20 on the thing, JJ's and ML's and have fun. There are many ways to play this chassis.
Wolverine, tough bugger. You have less balistic hard points, but a good number of Missile points. Energy points are good, except for one. It has one in the head. Someone may pass you up for shooting at another target in this mech. then the one with is it 4 or 5 energy hard points in one arm. I think one does not have JJ's. With two of the variants you can also fire 180+ behind you.
I would say the Griffin for me, but recommend the Shadow Hawk for the ability to try various loadouts. It is a jack of all trades and good at many of them.
#4
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:17 AM
Given that, the obvious answer is the SHawk. It can do all the builds the other mediums can, only with 5 extra tons and jets. It is the blatantly superior choice and the only reason not to go for it is if you have a strong attachment to a different medium. Since you like the Hawk already, this is win/win for you.
#5
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:24 AM
#6
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:42 AM
Edited by Spheroid, 11 July 2014 - 08:44 AM.
#7
Posted 11 July 2014 - 08:58 AM
You have several very strong combinations of hardpoints, all with JJ's.
High mounted ballistics:
3 ballistic/3 missile/1 energy 1H
2 ballistic/2 missile/2 energy 5M
1 ballistic/4 missile/2 energy 2D2
1 ballistic/3 missile/3 energy 2D
High mounted energy:
3 energy/3 missile 2K (this thing runs PPCs or LL great with the high mount point)
Griffins run PPC really well and are strong mechs, but you have some weakness in that a lot of the energy is in one arm, so people tend to aim for your RT or RightARM and you're screwed. You get better missile tubes but the lack of any variant with ballistics makes this a bit more limiting for a first medium. (Favorite Griffin Build = 2PPC in ARM, 3 SSRM2's, 1 med laser, JJ)
Wolverine with ballistics is a solid as hell mech that is probably my personal favorite out of all three, but the other Wolverine variants lack the ballistic options the Shadowhawks come with. Also like the Griffin, the RightARM is a weakness because all the lasers/ballistics are stacked in that arm. (Favorite Wolverine build = AC2+AC5 or AC10 in arm, 3 SSRM2's, 1 med laser, JJ)
Shadowhawks are just that good when you compare all the things you can do with the variants compared to the Griffin/Wolverine.
Edited by AlphaToaster, 11 July 2014 - 09:01 AM.
#8
Posted 11 July 2014 - 10:20 AM
Fast mobile mechs that pack a punch. with an XL-320 you can do some interesting load outs on the 6K getting 103KPH with tweak for the non JJ varriant. though the others you would probably just want an XL-300 and some JJ's, but still over flexibility. Not meta, but fun!
#9
Posted 11 July 2014 - 11:39 AM
The Griffin is the best "Feeling" mech in the game that I have played. I can't explain it but it just seems to dance around the battlefield very light on its feet. However, it has the horrible misfortune of placing all its weapons on one side of the mech and most people just end up trying to take out the right arm and/or poping the RT at the same time. Still I enjoy the mech.
Haven't played the Wolverine but they look pretty good in Smufy's. Eventually I will pick up a Wolvie, but with the upcomning cost of clan mechs, spending 10-12 million to outfit a single Wolvie is off the table at the moment.
#10
Posted 11 July 2014 - 10:26 PM
The Griffins are pretty good, so long as you don't want to mount a ballistic. Max out the engine, pile in 4 streaks, Beagle, and a pair of Medium Lasers, some jump jets, and the GRF-3M is probably the best light hunter in the game. The Griffin has perhaps the best field of view in the game, and due to excellent arm and torso articulation once fully elited does not have a blind spot. The main draw back being that the variants are so similar that making them feel unique from each other is difficult.
The Wolverine... The 6R feels like a Centurion with jump jets, not bad at all. The 6K is kinda' bad; no jets, 1 missile hardpoint, all energy. The 7K feels a lot like a Griffin.
Viktor Drake, on 11 July 2014 - 11:39 AM, said:
Given that most people run an XL in the Griffin losing a side torso is death anyway.
#11
Posted 11 July 2014 - 10:32 PM
1. Most of the variant rely on a mix of different hardpoints. Boating isn't gonna happen (not that a 55 ton mech was going to boat crazy weapons anyways..).
2. You're a really tall Mech. That makes you a great sniper, but also super easy to hit. Add to the big ol' claw arms to that and you have a recipe for torso twisting goodness that comes at the price of a big hitbox.
Also, the SHawk isn't quite as maneuverable as other Mediums imo. If you want to try out a fun, small, boxy Mech that torso twist like a champ I would suggest the Wolverine or Hunchie. They make for epic brawlers. If you wanna boat missiles and/or lasers, Kintaro. If you wanna buy one chassis that can do it all, I would suggest the SHawk. A couple of great SHawk builds are (2 LPL, 3 SRM) (AC/20, lasers, SRM4s) (3 AC/5s and a medium laser).
Edited by Pezzer, 11 July 2014 - 10:32 PM.
#12
Posted 11 July 2014 - 11:01 PM
As for Wolverine versus Shadow Hawk.... Shadow Hawks are less appropriate for extended jumping maneuvers, having fewer jets. They're generally worse for brawling with their field of view limitations, high cockpit, and much heavier predication towards torso-mount weapons. However, the high shoulder weapon mounts are excellent for hill-humping and jump-sniping, and also wonderful for peeking around upper corners of things. Griffins and Wolverines are both a bit broader than Shadow Hawks as well (although shorter).
If you care about it, Shadow Hawks tend to be targeted more often to boot.
#13
Posted 11 July 2014 - 11:24 PM
Mediums then again are starting to get out of my play style.
#14
Posted 11 July 2014 - 11:30 PM
#15
Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:35 PM
#16
Posted 23 July 2014 - 06:45 PM
I tend to favour a more aggressive brawling play style rather than LRM support role.
With the recent SRM buff, I recently got more into SRM brawler builds and the 2D2 and 2K have been awesome. The best combination so far has been the 2K with a PPC and 3X ASRM6. I can pretty reliably get 500+ dmg with a few 800+ rounds sprinkled in there if I happen to catch any distracted assaults. The 2K has the highest mounted shoulder laser so you can keep most of your profile hidden (the 3M's shoulder torso laser is slightly lower so you end up hitting earth a bit more).
After falling in love with SRM builds, I looked into the Griffins as a fast SRM striker (supposedly one of the most manuevrable mechs in the game). So far, my experience is that the GRF-3M is pretty good and will only get better once elited, but I have noticed that it dies to Side Torso deaths a lot more than the SHD. It is very noticeable and I'm wondering if other's have noticed the same. I think the Griffin's hitboxes are pretty good (and has good ability to use the arms as shield) but it's definitely easier to hit the Side torsos than the SHD. Just not as XL friendly as I'd thought. I die so much more frequently to Side Torso deaths than the SHD's ever did.
The 1N and 1S are definitely weaker as most Griffin pilots agree. Some people really like the right biased weaponry and I too enjoy having the choice to have the left side as a shield but I was very surprised at how often the right arm got blown off. As some others have mentioned in Griffin threads, It's definitely true that no matter how much twisting you do to hide and protect your Right Arm weapons, it'll get blown off very frequently especially if you've got LRMs coming from all directions. I envisioned the 1N as a great short range brawler but was not prepared to lose that right arm almost every time I got in close. These 2 variants beg you to use them as Long Range LRM support mechs with tag. If you want a short range brawler, take the GRF-3M or the SHD-2D2 or 2K.
I'd definitely say that the SHD's are still the most survivable (best hitboxes) and have the greatest variety of builds. If you have the 2K or the 2D2, you can do a lot of what the 3M can do if Streaks or SRM builds are your thing. So similar that I don't know if it's worth it to try and elite another chassis just to be able to achieve pretty much the same thing.
Even though it's not my preference, I suppose I now have a Chassis that is geared towards mobile LRM builds. On whether or not to get both: I don't think you NEED to have Griffins if you have Shadowhawks which can do it all and can tank damage better.
But if you like LRMs, then Griffins are much better suited with the 15 tube shoulder missile launcher. The cockpit visibility is indeed much better in the Griffin and I think that the 3M can probably outdo the 2D2 as a streak boat/light hunter because of the torso twist.
#17
Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:14 AM
#18
Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:42 AM
Griffin's can LRM better than the Shadowhawks too as they have larger tube counts. But I tend to prefer my LRMs on slower mechs (Hunchback-4J, Wolverine-7K).
Another of my most used mechs is the Wolverine-6R based on dual AC2s and triple LRM5s. This mech is actually my highest KD mech. And I'd place it on my top 5 favorite mechs in the game easily. The problem with the Wolverines as a chassis is the 6K variant. The 6K has no JJs, lots of energy in one location and a single (10 tube) missile hardpoint that is mostly useless.
Shadowhawks probably have the most diversity as it can mount any ballistic, a lot of missiles and some energy.
I'd go with Griffins > Shadowhawks > Wolverines
Griffins:
1N > 3M > 1S
Shadowhawks:
2H > 2D2 > 5M > 2K
Wolverine:
6R > 7K >>>>> 6K
But really you can't go wrong with any of them.
Edited by EyeOne, 25 July 2014 - 06:48 AM.
#19
Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:55 AM
Treb 7K makes a nice ERPPC+PPC boat, with an XL and speed tweak its fast, great for repositioning quickly.
Kintaros, make great SRM boats and light fast LRM boats.
Cicada 3M, has ECM and is a popular dual PPC sniper. Also works well with dual ERLL or LPLas
Hunchback, each variant offers something different, has excellent torso twist range and speed when mastered, 4P/SP are the best variants imo.
#20
Posted 25 July 2014 - 07:04 AM
KHETTI, on 25 July 2014 - 06:55 AM, said:
Agreed, except that my favorites are the 4G and 4H.
Hunchback is probably the most newb-friendly Mech out there, and remains a dependable workhorse. It's been nerfed by recent patches, but remains a classic Mech with a lot of options.
If you're having trouble learning the mechanics of the game, go with the Hunchie. If you feel that you have a good handle on MWO, then go with the Shadowhawk. Either way, you won't regret it!
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