50 replies to this topic

[Artgathan]

Wolfways, on 05 September 2014 - 12:38 PM, said:

They aren't supposed to have a minimum range.

Actually, IS LRM's are supposed to be able to hit at point blank range for full damage, but it is harder to hit under minimum range.

I know Clan LRMs don't have a minimum range in TT. However they're already 1/2 the weight of the equivalent IS launcher - do they really also need to be able to do damage under 180m?

[Variant1]

Wolfways, on 05 September 2014 - 12:26 PM, said:

Not always, but most of the time yes. People started using them again recently because they were buffed to the point where they are barely viable (mostly if boated), plus clan launchers weigh so little that they are more worth carrying as secondary weapons.
You will always see lots of LRM's in low ELO matches because new/bad players die easily to them, but in higher ELO they are rare. I'm probably around mid ELO and while i see many LRM's (but rarely any boats) they don't really do much damage unless they have a really good scout helping them.
But even if the LRM user has a good scout helping him you can still almost completely avoid missiles by hugging terrain as you move around the map.
Edit: Just realized who i was responding to. Sorry, there is no easy mode in this multiplayer game.

wait people started using them? so who where the other people that have been using them ever since the alpha? isn't lrms the point of something you can carry as a secondary weapon to soften you're targets up form a distance before engaging up close? thats sounds alot more dynamic then point wait shoot over hill. isn't that the problem that new player die to them easy because they don't know lrms fly over hills? or the fact that some cover may look good but ends up being a death sentence? And isn't it the point to be able to protect yourself from lrm fire? the only easymode i see is the lrms and ac40 jags.

got anymore weak arguments for me to tear up?

[Wolfways]

Artgathan, on 05 September 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

I know Clan LRMs don't have a minimum range in TT. However they're already 1/2 the weight of the equivalent IS launcher - do they really also need to be able to do damage under 180m?

I don't see why not. Any time they are fired under the minimum range the player is using up ammo for less damage.
Personally i hope that clan and IS don't end up as just the same with different colours.

[Mcgral18]

Variant1, on 05 September 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

got anymore weak arguments for me to tear up?

You are trying to argue?


LOL

[Wolfways]

Variant1, on 05 September 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

wait people started using them? so who where the other people that have been using them ever since the alpha?

New players or players like me who will use whatever i like no matter how bad they are (I run stock mechs).

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isn't lrms the point of something you can carry as a secondary weapon to soften you're targets up form a distance before engaging up close? thats sounds alot more dynamic then point wait shoot over hill.

Yes they should be, but the slow missile speed and incoming missile warning mean that LRM's cannot be used at long range.

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isn't that the problem that new player die to them easy because they don't know lrms fly over hills? or the fact that some cover may look good but ends up being a death sentence?

It doesn't take long to figure out that LRM's can be fired indirect, or that cover needs to be big enough to cover your mech.

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And isn't it the point to be able to protect yourself from lrm fire?

Why? You don't get to protect yourself from other weapons, but you do get LRM counters (ECM, AMS, Radar Dep. module)

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the only easymode i see is the lrms and ac40 jags.

AC40 Jagers are easy kills. They are very short range and their arms blow off very easily.

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got anymore weak arguments for me to tear up?

No point. You refuse to believe you are a bad player.

Edited by Wolfways, 05 September 2014 - 01:00 PM.

[Artgathan]

Wolfways, on 05 September 2014 - 12:52 PM, said:

I don't see why not. Any time they are fired under the minimum range the player is using up ammo for less damage.
Personally i hope that clan and IS don't end up as just the same with different colours.

While true (using ammo for less damage), the earthquake simulator that is unleashed as a result of the point-blank firing means that the CLRMs are still useful in a brawl. I made my original post after getting the drop on an LRM70 TBR, which then proceeded rock my mech worse than an AC/20 barrage using chain fire at <100m.

In general I'm actually in favor of increasing the overall utility of LRMs (such as fire-and-forget when firing at a target in LOS, or allowing 'body targeting' of mechs under ECM). It just really annoys me that Clan LRMs essentially get 2 buffs over IS LRMs (half the weight + still useful under minimum range). That said, I would like to keep the 'flavour' of the two kinds of missiles distinct.

[Wolfways]

Artgathan, on 05 September 2014 - 01:14 PM, said:

While true (using ammo for less damage), the earthquake simulator that is unleashed as a result of the point-blank firing means that the CLRMs are still useful in a brawl. I made my original post after getting the drop on an LRM70 TBR, which then proceeded rock my mech worse than an AC/20 barrage using chain fire at <100m.

In general I'm actually in favor of increasing the overall utility of LRMs (such as fire-and-forget when firing at a target in LOS, or allowing 'body targeting' of mechs under ECM). It just really annoys me that Clan LRMs essentially get 2 buffs over IS LRMs (half the weight + still useful under minimum range). That said, I would like to keep the 'flavour' of the two kinds of missiles distinct.

Well it's not that clan LRM's got a buff but more that IS LRM's got nerfed. The TT IS LRM's could still be fired at point blank range and do full damage but it was harder to hit.

Imo having to keep the reticule on the target for a couple of seconds while lock is achieved is enough to represent minimum range as it is harder to keep it on mechs close to you, especially faster mechs. I also think there should be splash damage so that if you did use LRM's at point blank range you would take some damage yourself from the explosions.

[Variant1]

Wolfways, on 05 September 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

New players or players like me who will use whatever i like no matter how bad they are (I run stock mechs).
Yes they should be, but the slow missile speed and incoming missile warning mean that LRM's cannot be used at long range.
Why? You don't get to protect yourself from other weapons, but you do get LRM counters (ECM, AMS, Radar Dep. module)
AC40 Jagers are easy kills. They are very short range and their arms blow off very easily.
No point. You refuse to believe you are a bad player.

actually you can protect yourself from other weapons by taking cover. Slow missile speed wont matter if a fierce firefight between front line team takes place because taking cover from lrms would mean death of other squad-mates. You must have great reflexes and aiming if you can hit those small arms of a jagger because the same don't apply to me, and plus many maps have cover so they can easily close the gap.
-Fine im a bad player but you have to admit that arc is annoying.

[Wolfways]

Variant1, on 05 September 2014 - 01:44 PM, said:

actually you can protect yourself from other weapons by taking cover. Slow missile speed wont matter if a fierce firefight between front line team takes place because taking cover from lrms would mean death of other squad-mates. You must have great reflexes and aiming if you can hit those small arms of a jagger because the same don't apply to me, and plus many maps have cover so they can easily close the gap.
-Fine im a bad player but you have to admit that arc is annoying.

Why would i admit the arc is annoying? You still don't get it. I rarely get hit by many LRM's because:
1) I use cover all the time
2) If i get myself in a bad position there's a warning message that let's me know.

I've been playing since closed beta and I've just got so used to using terrain well that i don't have to think about LRM's. The only map where i have to think about where LRM's are likely to come from is Alpine...and sometimes Caustic depending on where my team goes (solo queue only). Every other map has masses of available cover.

When I'm playing my CPLT-C1 it's the opposite. I have to consider every piece of cover that could be hiding a brawler ready to jump out and rip my mech to pieces. Even if I'm advancing with my lance I'm often the prime target, which is fine by me as it leaves my teammates (who are probably in better mechs) untouched and fighting longer.

[Variant1]

Wolfways, on 05 September 2014 - 02:03 PM, said:

Why would i admit the arc is annoying? You still don't get it. I rarely get hit by many LRM's because:
1) I use cover all the time
2) If i get myself in a bad position there's a warning message that let's me know.

I've been playing since closed beta and I've just got so used to using terrain well that i don't have to think about LRM's. The only map where i have to think about where LRM's are likely to come from is Alpine...and sometimes Caustic depending on where my team goes (solo queue only). Every other map has masses of available cover.

When I'm playing my CPLT-C1 it's the opposite. I have to consider every piece of cover that could be hiding a brawler ready to jump out and rip my mech to pieces. Even if I'm advancing with my lance I'm often the prime target, which is fine by me as it leaves my teammates (who are probably in better mechs) untouched and fighting longer.

You use cover all the time? please tell how you have never encountered a brawler while hugging cover.
so if you never get hit by lurms then you must encounter alot of brawlers (assuming you're not playing lrm boats all the time) edit: this also brings up the problem of brawlers become op no thx to the amount of cover maps have. So if you dont die to lurms then brawls is the next option to die to

Edited by Variant1, 05 September 2014 - 02:14 PM.

[Egomane]

Variant1, didn't I tell you to stop necroing threads for your complaint?

It's enough to post a complaint once, in one thread. If you keep doing that, I'll need to warn you for spamming. Closing and moving to archive!