193 replies to this topic

[Lily from animove]

Since 3 days I try to play with a clanmate form another game, He's new to the game, but putting a group of 2 people into the group queue is just impossible overkill for any new players who may get a friend or something.

Various reasons,

nearly all mechs in the group queue are heavies or assaults.
He now owns a kit fox and a Nova. Not much fun, because all the laodouts are kinda hard meta and lurking around a corner is kinda instantkill for any medium mech.

light mechs are also nearly non existent.

Because of those mechclasses being used so much, the waiting times for matches are extremely long. easily 5mins +

How should I show someone new the game under this conditions? The gaming experience is quite horrible for newbies. All I would need to do is telling him to go to solo queue? That can hardly be the point of an online game.

I try to teach him now how to support the team via ECM with the kit fox, but oh my, this is just massively hard for a new palyer and nearly 0 fun.

This should really not be, half the mechs are dead in this game mode and teamplay with mechs you like, unless they are heavy+ or some ecm lights is nearly impossible.

Dunno what, but do something, This way the game is just horrible

[Sandpit]

Lily from animove, on 01 August 2014 - 04:07 PM, said:

light mechs are also nearly non existent.

which, again, has nothing to do with group or solo as both queues are the exact same

Lily from animove, on 01 August 2014 - 04:07 PM, said:

Because of those mechclasses being used so much, the waiting times for matches are extremely long. easily 5mins +

How should I show someone new the game under this conditions? The gaming experience is quite horrible for newbies. All I would need to do is telling him to go to solo queue? That can hardly be the point of an online game.

I try to teach him now how to support the team via ECM with the kit fox, but oh my, this is just massively hard for a new palyer and nearly 0 fun.

This should really not be, half the mechs are dead in this game mode and teamplay with mechs you like, unless they are heavy+ or some ecm lights is nearly impossible.

and again, it's the same for both queues on weight classes so I don't see where that comes to be an argument for putting 2mans in solo queue.

If anything teaching him should be easier because you're on his team, helping him out. I just don't understand how the wait times and low numbers of heavies and assaults has anything to do with putting 2mans in the solo queue

[Ozric]

Don't do this. Never do this. Whatever alterations may or may not be needed to the matchmaker opening up the solo queue to groups again is definitely, totally, absolutely not the answer.

[darkkterror]

They can't. If groups of 2 didn't go into the group queue then groups of 10 wouldn't be possible.

[BourbonFaucet]

I think what the OP is trying to say is that the group queue is too fierce of competition to teach new players. His or her friend has a light and a medium 'Mech, which is eaten like popcorn by the "meta" (or in general overtonnage) that you face in the group queue. (does 3/3/3/3 fix this or even alleviate it now? I thought it did). A newcomer in a light or medium is going to be destroyed as those take a lot more talent to pilot than a heavy or assault.

So how does the OP train her friend? I guess he's gotta use the trial heavies or something until he's talented enough to play the medium or light without getting destroyed.

[Livewyr]

darkkterror, on 01 August 2014 - 04:16 PM, said:

They can't. If groups of 2 didn't go into the group queue then groups of 10 wouldn't be possible.

Seems pretty common sense to me.


(Or perhaps not-so-common.)


Someone had to bite the bullet. I do not run groups of 2 often, for that reason.. but having them in group queue enables it to function and gives us the 100% solo queue people have wanted for years.

[Davers]

It wouldn't be a "pug queue" if there were premades in it.

The Devs have stated that groups of 2 have a noticeable advantage over straight pugs.

[Lily from animove]

Sandpit, on 01 August 2014 - 04:12 PM, said:

which, again, has nothing to do with group or solo as both queues are the exact same


and again, it's the same for both queues on weight classes so I don't see where that comes to be an argument for putting 2mans in solo queue.

If anything teaching him should be easier because you're on his team, helping him out. I just don't understand how the wait times and low numbers of heavies and assaults has anything to do with putting 2mans in the solo queue

it has a lot to do with the gamign experience a new palyer gets, especialyl when he has no idea about the plan and not owns a heavy or assault. And no, you can still very easily and successful use a medium on the PUG queue, because in there people do not run meta all day.

And helping him? How when he dies in like 2 seconds after 3+ coordinated opponents spot him.
You guys may need to understand that the life of someone who is new to the game is completely different from what you do and know. But right now, you can not say: "hey buddy lets play MWO together", when you know he is new, since this will lead into just nowhere except many frustrating matches for the newbie. And this will hardly generate potential customers on the long term. And playing the preset heavies/assaults is neither a working concept for a newbie.

and groups of 2 a noticeable advantage? that was not much the case.

There needs to be the 3/3/3/3 back in the groupqueue to force people using something else than Heavy/assault all day.

For new palyers or fresh grouping palyers form the pug queue, the game is just a devasting experience. They will very unlikely start to play as a group in the long term.

Edited by Lily from animove, 01 August 2014 - 04:33 PM.

[Heeden]

I think it might be interesting to allow 2-man groups in the solo queue if one of them is still on their cadet games (first 25 I think).

[Impyrium]

Lily, I've been in your situation so I understand your thinking. I was trying to get a friend of mine into the game, and we found the group queue incredibly competitive and difficult for him. However, I don't want to see groups of two in PUGs. If someone wants to learn, they should either play in the group queue and learn from mistakes, or go solo for a bit. That, and it's impossible, for it would remove groups of ten and frankly that'd cause a lot more outcry.

[Davers]

Lily from animove, on 01 August 2014 - 04:28 PM, said:

it has a lot to do with the gamign experience a new palyer gets, especialyl when he has no idea about the plan and not owns a heavy or assault. And no, you can still very easily and successful use a medium on the PUG queue, because in there people do not run meta all day.

And helping him? How when he dies in like 2 seconds after 3+ coordinated opponents spot him.
You guys may need to understand that the life of someone who is new to the game is completely different from what you do and know. But right now, you can not say: "hey buddy lets play MWO together", when you know he is new, since this will lead into just nowhere except many frustrating matches for the newbie. And this will hardly generate potential customers on the long term.

I run lights and mediums in group queues all the time. It is NOT Heavy/Assault only. It's funny how you don't like it when players are coordinated against you, but you want to be coordinated against them.

Why don't you use your premium time and try to set up private matches for you and a friend instead to learn the game?

Edited by Davers, 01 August 2014 - 04:35 PM.

[Lexx]

No because when you are running a group of 10, who are you going to link up with?

[occusoj]

Quote

Put Groups Of 2 Back To PugPut Groups Of 2 Back To Pug

NO. Please not.
For new players its frustrating to get tossed in a pool with big premades but putting 2-men groups in solo isnt the solution as it will invite some of the "pro" crowd stomping some poor souls if they want a few relaxed matches that are even more easy mode for them than they already are. Solo is reasonably fine, leave it alone.
NPE of MWO is already one of the worst Ive ever seen and something should (but wont) be done about it.

Edited by occusoj, 01 August 2014 - 04:39 PM.

[Lily from animove]

AUSwarrior24, on 01 August 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

Lily, I've been in your situation so I understand your thinking. I was trying to get a friend of mine into the game, and we found the group queue incredibly competitive and difficult for him. However, I don't want to see groups of two in PUGs. If someone wants to learn, they should either play in the group queue and learn from mistakes, or go solo for a bit. That, and it's impossible, for it would remove groups of ten and frankly that'd cause a lot more outcry.

taking into account, that the majority of palyers queues solo, would show the outcry coems just from a small palyerbase.
Additionally to this, think about all the other palyers, who may want to test MWO as a team of new players. You will force seperate newbies or give them a never return experience.
Its not like a shooter where you need just some exoerience. Its serveral millions cbills to make a mech competitive even beyong the cadet boni money. So how should they lern tactics in a total inferior mech? And with dying over and over, the outcome in money is so low, that this takes ages. so basically new palyers should abandon all friends and solo queue their first 50 matches or even more. This can hardly be the reason of a game.

[Bhael Fire]

Sorry, but NOPE.

They removed groups from the solo queue for several very good reasons. Putting them back in would be counter-productive.

This is ultimately a matchmaker issue...they just need to make some adjustments with how matchmaker handles the group queue.

[MonkeyCheese]

Lexx, on 01 August 2014 - 04:35 PM, said:

No because when you are running a group of 10, who are you going to link up with?

Solo people who get paid more to go into the group queue would solve everything...

[Daoa Hakoke]

First thing, the 3/3/3/3 rule in the group que effects mostly what you can have in your group. In other words the larger your group is the more balanced class wise it will be. Just wanted to say that. Also, if you or your friend are not against using ts you guys could jump on with a newbi friendly group and drop together. Could very well provide a better experence for you two.

So I'll throw in a shameless plug and mention the merc group I'm in, the Ransom's Corsairs. We are always happy to see new faces and we do not pressure people to join us. We don't normally run meta and normally we have a rotating group of 6 or up to 12 players on during US prime time.

I know its not what you are trying to discuse here, but it could help out your friend and you. Heck, if you've got your own group you drop with take him to there ts.

[Bhael Fire]

MonkeyCheese, on 01 August 2014 - 04:39 PM, said:

Solo people who get paid more to go into the group queue would solve everything...

Yeah, I think adding the option for solo player to opt into the group queue with a "Hazard Pay" bonus would be fantastic.

[Davers]

MonkeyCheese, on 01 August 2014 - 04:39 PM, said:

Solo people who get paid more to go into the group queue would solve everything...

While I like this suggestion, there is a part of me that says throwing a pug into the group queue is actually a handicap for his team. Maybe he is in an assault mech and just sticks with the herd so it won't be that bad. But a light or medium has to be able to communicate to the group, whether scouting or for quick response to enemy threats.

[Destructicus]

Lily from animove, on 01 August 2014 - 04:28 PM, said:

and groups of 2 a noticeable advantage? that was not much the case.

Thats not the point
the point is that if you got your way then ten mans would be screwed and with them, much of the group queue