37 replies to this topic

[Tiamat of the Sea]

Escef, on 17 August 2014 - 09:28 PM, said:

If it makes you feel any better, none of the later clan tech is considered better than the clan ERPPC, LPL, or LRMs. Hell, the ATM (Advanced Tactical Missile) is considered inferior to the Inner Sphere MML (Multi-Missile Launcher, comes in 3, 5, 7, and 9 packs, bulky, not too tonnage efficient, but can hot-swap between LRMs and SRMs).

That's kind of surprising.

[dragnier1]

My main gripe is the flimsy arms. Only the body feels "tough". There have been a few times where i'm running around armless.

Bigbacon, on 16 August 2014 - 02:00 PM, said:

am I one of the few that run without ECM?

what is amazing now though is the amount of these on the field now that they can be bought with bills and the amount of ECM cover is astounding now.

I run my D and Prime without ecm.

[CriticalG]

Just want to say, the Kit Fox is the WORST mech ever. Slow, lightly armed, lightly armored with LARGE hit boxes on the torso's and arms, it is twice as lame as a Locust at 5x the cost. Thanks for the ripoff worthless mech PGI. Don't know why I bothered.

Might want to add, it would be more effective to ride into battle on a tricycle with a spit ball shooter than drive the "**** Fox".

Edited by CriticalG, 20 August 2014 - 07:16 AM.

[Sethliopod]

The only thing more cute than a Kit Fox is a Kit Fox with one leg removed. That pitiful little limp is so adorable, I highly endorse not killing them after breaking one leg.
In all fairness, this goes for all light targets (especially Spiders!), but that's more griefing than giving into "adorablity."

I feel the observations of this article would, in many ways work for the Nova. Of course, there's a lot more damage output, but your sweet spot is still standing beside and slightly behind a big bullet magnet. Both Mechs have a max speed that suggests they are right where they should be--ripping the arms off an enemy who's obsessing over someone far bigger.

edit: My least favorite feature of the Kit Fox: playing the ECM-less variants of Light IS ECM Mechs. It just feels so embarrassing now.

Edited by Sethliopod, 20 August 2014 - 08:06 AM.

[ShinVector]

CriticalG, on 20 August 2014 - 07:09 AM, said:

Just want to say, the Kit Fox is the WORST mech ever. Slow, lightly armed, lightly armored with LARGE hit boxes on the torso's and arms, it is twice as lame as a Locust at 5x the cost. Thanks for the ripoff worthless mech PGI. Don't know why I bothered.

Might want to add, it would be more effective to ride into battle on a tricycle with a spit ball shooter than drive the "**** Fox".

You considered worst than a Locust ? (I mastered Locust the slow way by the way..)

Don't blame the tools ?

Edited by ShinVector, 20 August 2014 - 08:50 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

JagdFlanker, on 17 August 2014 - 07:21 AM, said:

keep in mind cLRM tubes mean nothing - since the missiles stream out at launch, putting a cLRM20 in a 10 tube launcher shouldn't make any difference and it will save you a crucial 1t over dual cLRM10s

According to smurfy the cLRM10 is 2.5 tons and 1 slot, while the cLRM20 is 5 tons 4 slots. 4x10s would be 10 tons and 4 slots while 2x20s is 10 tons and 8 slots. Also group firing them means twice as many missiles at a time so AMS is less effective.

[Greenjulius]

I like this little guy. He can pack some good firepower for a light, is ECM and jump capable, and the Omni slots make it that much better.

The bad: He's as expensive as a heavy, and possibly the most fragile mech I've ever piloted or fought. It belongs behind assaults, where it can provide AMS/ECM/Narc/Tag support, and pop out to help in melees. If you get focused on by anything big... Prepare for spectator view. The one positive is that it can lose a side torso and survive due to the Clan XL.

Overall, by practicing an abundance of caution, the Kitfox can be a great mech for team players. I can't recommend it to new players because of it's low survivability, but it rewards players who play patiently.

Edited by Greenjulius, 20 August 2014 - 01:16 PM.

[OznerpaG]

Darwins Dog, on 20 August 2014 - 10:40 AM, said:

According to smurfy the cLRM10 is 2.5 tons and 1 slot, while the cLRM20 is 5 tons 4 slots. 4x10s would be 10 tons and 4 slots while 2x20s is 10 tons and 8 slots. Also group firing them means twice as many missiles at a time so AMS is less effective.

sorry, i use Artemus - never looked at non-Artemus launcher stats lol. -50% lock-on time is worth the tiny weight increase

Edited by JagdFlanker, 20 August 2014 - 04:19 PM.

[Tahribator]

First post updated with more content. Some tips and tricks and some thoughts on a build I used in the tournament that works well.

[Greenjulius]

Tahribator, on 21 August 2014 - 04:42 AM, said:

First post updated with more content. Some tips and tricks and some thoughts on a build I used in the tournament that works well.

Your updated tactics/tournament section is spot on. I was nodding my head the entire time I read it. Also, I completely agree with your view on ECM and AMS. I've tried many combinations of the two and decided only ECM is worth having for the weight. I have as of yet not tried putting an UAC5 on the shoulder, but have thought about it. I'm excited to try it this evening.

My current build is 2xcERML, ECM, 1xcLPL, 2xcMG, 2xJJ. It can lay out some serious damage to unprepared opponents. If I get too hot, I have the right arm cERML and 2xMGs set for group two, and I can fire them endlessly. Mr Kitty

Thanks for the recommendations!

Edited by Greenjulius, 21 August 2014 - 11:27 AM.

[Spleenslitta]

I don't have much seat time in my Kit Fox prime but i noticed one thing.
I realised that my Firestarter 9S is capable of mounting more firepower and i'm not just talking about the 5 extra tons here.
If you don't change omnipods the Kit Fox is kinda lacking in the amount of weapon hardpoints.
The only way the Kit Fox can outgun a IS light of similar weight is to rely on big guns and SRM's since the Clan SRM's are so light.
That's my opinion anyways.

For me the Kit Fox isn't just slow and oversized. It's almost totaly outgunned by an IS light mech.
My Firestarter has 3 SL's, 2 ML's and 1 ER PPC with 2 JJ's, an XL 265 engine and full armor.
It has only 10 or was it 11 Double heatsinks to cool it down.

But even if the Firestarter runs kinda hot i find myself overheating more often in my Kit Fox with 1ERML, 1ERLL, SRM6 and an LBX5.
That's kinda weird concidering the heat from firing the IS ER PPC.

[Greenjulius]

Spleenslitta, on 21 August 2014 - 12:15 PM, said:

I don't have much seat time in my Kit Fox prime but i noticed one thing.
I realised that my Firestarter 9S is capable of mounting more firepower and i'm not just talking about the 5 extra tons here.
If you don't change omnipods the Kit Fox is kinda lacking in the amount of weapon hardpoints.
The only way the Kit Fox can outgun a IS light of similar weight is to rely on big guns and SRM's since the Clan SRM's are so light.
That's my opinion anyways.

For me the Kit Fox isn't just slow and oversized. It's almost totaly outgunned by an IS light mech.
My Firestarter has 3 SL's, 2 ML's and 1 ER PPC with 2 JJ's, an XL 265 engine and full armor.
It has only 10 or was it 11 Double heatsinks to cool it down.

But even if the Firestarter runs kinda hot i find myself overheating more often in my Kit Fox with 1ERML, 1ERLL, SRM6 and an LBX5.
That's kinda weird concidering the heat from firing the IS ER PPC.

You really can't play the kitfox like a light. The firestarter has a smaller profile, much faster speeds and usually higher firepower. As a pure fighter, it's the best light in MWO. However, it's only that; a fighter and skirmisher. Like the spider and Jenner, it can operate solo and conduct quick, devastating hit and run attacks.

The Kitfox is basically an above average speed medium with light armor, and quite low to the ground. What you're saying about omnipods is correct, but who would willingly run a clan mech with stock omnipods? It defeats the purpose of omnimechs! For me, it's 100% a support mech. And it's great at that. I can mount ECM, cLRM and long range equipment, and remain quite cool once I figure out the right weapon grouping.

If you only use a stock KFX of any three varieties, you won't have ECM, it's best feature. It's on a separate arm after all. So comparing the KFX to most IS lights isn't really valid. A more valid comparison is the RVN-3L, the COM-2D, the SDR-5D or the CDA-3M. I feel the Kitfox is a better mech for pure support than any one of those 4 mechs. It can also outgun any one of them. (in the right configuration)

As for weapons to use on the KFX, I'd recommend at least 2 cERML. The cERLL is nerfed so bad right now with the 2s duration; I find little reason to use it over the cLPL, which still has great range, does more damage, and produces less heat. It has 1.3s fire duration too, which matches perfectly with the cERML at 1.3s. LBX5 do too little pinpoint damage, so automatically I would recommend the UAC5 instead.

So perhaps what I'm trying to say is it's really difficult to compare any IS mech to the KFX. It's very unique in it's capabilies, but has limitations like any mech. Above all though, it is a support mech. Don't try soloing with it, or you'll likely not last long.

Edit:
One last stat: I ran the build you described, and it came up with 29 firepower, with 2.19 sustainable firepower. That's with 2 additional DHS for 12 total. Definitely a striker. My build of the Kitfox produces 25.96 firepower, but has 4.7 sustainable DPS. That's with 13 DHS. Alternatively you could run it with 4xcERML and 19 heatsinks. That's right... 19. That would produce 28 firepower and 4.17 sustainable DPS. He's a versatile little guy!

Edited by Greenjulius, 21 August 2014 - 01:21 PM.

[Escef]

Greenjulius, on 21 August 2014 - 01:03 PM, said:

What you're saying about omnipods is correct, but who would willingly run a clan mech with stock omnipods?

The Nova and Stormcrow Prime are both fine stock.

[Training Instructor]

It's one of the best deals of the clan packages, because it's the only ecm support mech that gets a 30% cbill bonus.
Uac5 + 3xerml with ecm is the most consistent performer for me. Awesome sustained mid to short range damage, and can also finish.

Clpulse and 2xcerml with ecm and 3xAMS has also turned into a much better support build since the cerl Nerf.

I agree that the ams seems like a waste most matches, but it was great fun trolling the lrm boats during the recent competitions and challenges.

[Gangnail]

o7 good post. Thanks for it

[InspectorG]

Spleenslitta, on 21 August 2014 - 12:15 PM, said:

I don't have much seat time in my Kit Fox prime but i noticed one thing.
I realised that my Firestarter 9S is capable of mounting more firepower and i'm not just talking about the 5 extra tons here.
If you don't change omnipods the Kit Fox is kinda lacking in the amount of weapon hardpoints.
The only way the Kit Fox can outgun a IS light of similar weight is to rely on big guns and SRM's since the Clan SRM's are so light.
That's my opinion anyways.

For me the Kit Fox isn't just slow and oversized. It's almost totaly outgunned by an IS light mech.
My Firestarter has 3 SL's, 2 ML's and 1 ER PPC with 2 JJ's, an XL 265 engine and full armor.
It has only 10 or was it 11 Double heatsinks to cool it down.

But even if the Firestarter runs kinda hot i find myself overheating more often in my Kit Fox with 1ERML, 1ERLL, SRM6 and an LBX5.
That's kinda weird concidering the heat from firing the IS ER PPC.

As a fast skimisher/brawler, yes.

As support, no.

FS series(and Jenner) were/are? the IS light brawler kings. But my understanding is that since clans and Hit reg fixes, that role has been diminished to a fair degree.

Kitfox has over those series the ECM and range. Clan erml is closer to IS LL range i think.

Kitfox can never wolfpack with other IS or fast clan lights. Too slow.
What it does is give the opponent another thing to worry about while they brawl the heavies/assaults.

FS with 6 ml does 30 damage at ml range...with considerable heat.
Fox (3erml uac5) does32-37 damage at LL range...with less heat(i think) while providing ECM

FS has to get closer, has to worry about heat, but has speed to get away
I think FS has more favorable hitboxes as well but thats kinda tangent to the conversation

Kitfox has range and a little cooler, but is too slow to dogfight.

Different roles, dont expect the same outcome. This will likely change should we get CW.

[Cold Cash]

Training Instructor, on 22 August 2014 - 12:20 AM, said:

It's one of the best deals of the clan packages, because it's the only ecm support mech that gets a 30% cbill bonus.
Uac5 + 3xerml with ecm is the most consistent performer for me. Awesome sustained mid to short range damage, and can also finish.

Clpulse and 2xcerml with ecm and 3xAMS has also turned into a much better support build since the cerl Nerf.

I agree that the ams seems like a waste most matches, but it was great fun trolling the lrm boats during the recent competitions and challenges.

Just changed to that build by chance and posted huge scores, amazing fire support/sniper/harrasser build i added ecm , 2 jj right arm cerml, left arm 2x cerml, r-t uac5 4 tons ammo. Massive damage beast.

Other build doing the rounds in our clan is the 2 jj, ecm, cerppc, 2x srm 4, 2x mg. Excellent at range and packs a punch in close if i.s. mechs try to close with ya.

[Jack Shayu Walker]

Don't mean to necro this thread, but I've have had an insane amount of success with the Kitfox, it's hands down my best mech. My Verus build has been a dream to pilot.

Edited by Jack Shayu Walker, 24 September 2014 - 11:34 PM.