Jump to content

Why Is The Matchmaker So Fantastic ?


11 replies to this topic

#1 Desintegrator

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 1,225 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 16 August 2014 - 04:06 AM

Hey PGI !

Why did you programmed such a fantastic matchmaker !!

As you stated at the start of the improved Matchmaker, we will never experience 12 : 0 stomps any more. There will be only a difference of 2 - 3 kills at the end of every match.

And you are absolutely right !!
Yeah, as you know from your statistic server the matches are perfektly balanced now. The playing of MWO was never better than now and you will never find a match where one side will be dominating each other.

Absolutely great work !
Thanks PGI for this great Matchmaker !

#2 BOWMANGR

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Philanthropist
  • 220 posts

Posted 16 August 2014 - 04:22 AM

Well, when they programmed the matchmaker Clan mechs were nowhere to be found. Now that they are in the game in all of their totally underpowered features and pay 2 lose attributes, the MM can cope even better and make those great matches that you see and enjoy.

Moreover, since there aren't any talks of upgrading the poor Clan mechs to cope with the totally overpowered IS mechs, the incredible nailbiting matchmaking has a great future of attracting new players to the game, keeping old players playing like crazy and totally not pushing anyone to other games, including me. I totally increased my game hours after seeing how incredibly balanced the matches of the last two weeks have been and never even thought about abandoning playing MWO until they give Clans some power to cope with the broken IS mechs. Seriously, things have never been better for MWO since Closed Beta!!!

#3 Leidulfr

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 142 posts

Posted 16 August 2014 - 06:48 AM

Posted Image

#4 Pineapple Salad

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Rage
  • Rage
  • 142 posts
  • LocationFinland

Posted 16 August 2014 - 06:51 AM

Posted Imagemust be the tournament.

#5 Modo44

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • 3,559 posts

Posted 16 August 2014 - 06:58 AM

View PostPineapple Salad, on 16 August 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

must be the tournament.

At other times it is not playing at the right hour or with the right mech, luck, the nature of the game. Next week, it will be the unfortunate constelation alignment. There is no way it could be the thing actually building matches.

#6 Tesunie

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Seeker
  • The Seeker
  • 8,575 posts
  • LocationSeraphim HQ: Asuncion

Posted 16 August 2014 - 07:54 AM

Funny, last night I had some really well balanced matches. Besides some continual problems I've been having with MWO (downloading late into matches, rubberbanding, and other really strange happenings), most of my matches last night (while I was doing the free mech bay challenge) were matches where each side often was down to the last two mechs on each team duking it out.

For the record, PGI never said that you would "never experience 0-12 matches again" with the new MM. They just stated that you should experience more even matches because they added in tonnage balance, something a lot of people on the forums were demanding. Matching by tonnage isn't a solve all, but it does help to present different chassis onto the field.

Edit: Grammar

Edited by Tesunie, 16 August 2014 - 07:56 AM.


#7 Desintegrator

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 1,225 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 16 August 2014 - 08:44 AM

I dont see many balanced games !

I've played about 30 matches today and maybe 2 or 3 of them were balanced !
Yeah - thats some nice 10%.

The biggest failure in matchmaking actually is, that the ELO balancing will be done with the last priority !
First there is the Mech Typ balancing, then the tonnage balancing (Heavy with 70 tons to another Heavy with 70 tons on the other side) and then at last the ELO balancing !

But what is wrong with this ??

If you dont know it, then play a game and try to die fast and then switch to your teammate with the 100 ton Atlas and see that he cannot even steer this Mech around a rock at the ground, and then trying to run up 50% slopes on the Map and then do not find the fire button on his mouse when he finally found an enemy Mech - and then getting killed with a own score 18 points of damage !

On the other side you can (after you died) switch to your teammate with the Firestarter, and watch how he fights like hell, killing many enemys with his Med Lasers and turns the game from a loss to a victory with 4 kills and some whopping 800 points of damage !

And then tell me -> What is more important ??

Tonnage balancing or Skill balancing ??

And thats the reason for this catastrophical balancing of the matches. At first the do the 3/3/3/3, then the tonnage balancing in each class and at last - because it is not important at all - the skill balancing !
A big big failure...

Even if it sounds arrogant to you - but it's the truth:
With some very good players you would win a match in 12 Locusts againts 12 Atlas -> when you sit noobs into the Atlas Mechs. So what priority should the ELO matching have ??

Edited by Desintegrator, 16 August 2014 - 08:45 AM.


#8 Modo44

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • 3,559 posts

Posted 16 August 2014 - 08:52 AM

View PostDesintegrator, on 16 August 2014 - 08:44 AM, said:

The biggest failure in matchmaking actually is, that the ELO balancing will be done with the last priority !
First there is the Mech Typ balancing, then the tonnage balancing (Heavy with 70 tons to another Heavy with 70 tons on the other side) and then at last the ELO balancing !

Essentially, the matchmaker is using a very crude battle value system instead of tracking actual skill.

The general weight class matching prevents silly tonnage-based stomps, which we know could happen. However, if you had Elo (it is not a ******* acronym, people!!!) for every weight class, strict tonnage matching would fold neatly into Elo matching (e.g. a great lighter assault pilot could be pitted against a less great Dire Whale pilot with a 50/50 expected win ratio). A similar thing can be done by tracking Elo and group Elo separately instead of adding an artificial group modifier. But it requires design and coding, serious resources.

With those in place, the matchmaker requirements would be: "have same weight classes on both sides + have close Elo on both sides". No special values or long searches for that one player at [x] tons. Which would allow the matchmaker to adjust for a deeper issue -- Elo distribution differences (a few great players + rookies vs mostly average decent players -- also a known occurance).

But hey, we get community warfare soon. I bet that will fix things. ;)

Edited by Modo44, 16 August 2014 - 08:55 AM.


#9 Bigbacon

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The 1 Percent
  • The 1 Percent
  • 3,088 posts

Posted 17 August 2014 - 04:21 PM

i'm really starting to think that ECM needs to be taken into account in the MM now. Maybe once the kit fox newness cools down it won't matter so much but ECM is either all over the place now and if one team gets none while the other has like 2 or 3, that other team is royally screwed for the most part.

#10 Tesunie

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Seeker
  • The Seeker
  • 8,575 posts
  • LocationSeraphim HQ: Asuncion

Posted 17 August 2014 - 05:32 PM

View PostBigbacon, on 17 August 2014 - 04:21 PM, said:

i'm really starting to think that ECM needs to be taken into account in the MM now. Maybe once the kit fox newness cools down it won't matter so much but ECM is either all over the place now and if one team gets none while the other has like 2 or 3, that other team is royally screwed for the most part.


ECM has been in a bad place by a lot of people's standards. Some of it's functionality is much needed in this iteration of MW for it to be viable for it's weight. However, there are other pieces that overstep what ECM should do.

What I see as the problem with ECM is:
- It practically does an invisibility cloak. However, I feel this is (in part) needed to make ECM a piece of gear worth taking.
- It delays target data gathering, even when you CAN get a lock. Add this to the invisibility aspect of the ECM unit... and it's starting to look a little too much.
- It causes Missile Lock Delays, on top of target data gathering, on top of invisibility cloak... Lets just say, even with TAG, Artemis, etc, Unless the ECM is cut off completely (jammed by another ECM in counter mode, BAP, NARC, etc), you can't get any kind of a missile lock.
- There is a small gap between being jammed down by ECM, and it being invisible you are "suppose" to be able to get locks. However, those locks are slowed down massively, making it impossible to actually get a lock inside that small band when they aren't invisible and before they shut down your locking systems. (BAP helps counter this, but there is once more another band where ECM still will jam your locks before BAP will shut down their ECM.)
- ECM has a force multiplier attached to it. If it's one ECM to one ECM/BAP, they each can counter each other. If it's 2+ ECM vs 1 ECM/BAP... well... you are going to still be out of luck. (Of course, then you are outnumbered, which is never a good thing either...)
- It provides a cloaking field to other players around the ECM unit. (I feel this, also, is needed and follows lore to an extent.)

I probably could go on here, but you get the point I hope. If anything, I think some of the stacked effects of ECM should be removed, making it preform only one effect out of it's list. If it makes you "invisible" to sensors (Technically is Null Signature System (lost tech), or Stealth armor+ECM (Not invented yet by timeline), then it shouldn't effect data gathering speeds and missile locks when you DO have a lock on them somehow (and vise versa as well).

Fix ECM, and MM should work a lot better as well. However, the exact fix ECM might need, I do not know. I can speculate, but without being able to test and try out such changes, I can't suggest any one course of action.


MM could also probably use to match, not by tonnage, but by either a C-bill cost (of the whole mech) or even a Battle Value for each mech. If done by C-bills, you could have adjustments, such as a reduction to the valued "cost*" of LBx10 ACs (because they don't seem to preform very well right now in MWO), or an inflation of other gear such as PPCs or even inflation of the "value" of certain combo of weapons so boating would effect your placement in matches, not your heat scale. You want to play meta, expect to fight against such other meta "good" designs. (C-bill totals with Elo being included into the concept, so it's your skill combined with the total c-bill value of your mech would determine how you get placed into a match.

* By cost, I don't mean it would actually cost you less or more to place onto your mech, but would cost you the same to equip but MM would adjust the registered "value" of your mech for MM only. This means, the more tricked out your ride, the higher you will tend to be placed. The lower your ride (or even stock new), the lower your "value". Skill (Elo) would still play a role with these c-bill assignments. This means, if you are good enough in a stock mech, you may very well end up fighting meta mechs in a stock mech, but your skill in said mech should overcome any penalties of your downgraded equipment.
(Is probably a confusing idea, and I might not be relaying it correctly for better understanding...)

#11 C E Dwyer

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 9,274 posts
  • LocationHiding in the periphery, from Bounty Hunters

Posted 18 August 2014 - 10:56 AM

My sarcasm detector went into the red zone.

#12 POWR

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bridesmaid
  • 553 posts
  • LocationAarhus, Denmark

Posted 18 August 2014 - 12:42 PM

Most matches feel like they are 12-0ish stomps. But when they aren't, I always seem to be the first one to die so all it does then is to drag the matches out.





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users