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Advisory For Anyone Having Network Issues


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#1 Jon Cunningham

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:02 PM

Hello folks,

Some of you are having network issues and are finding your pings are much higher (30 to 40 ms) than they used to be.

This isn't the normal state of affairs. For most users, pings have decreased. Sometimes by 10ms, sometimes by a 50ms. We've put a lot of care into optimizing our network, but we still have more to go.

Some of you are seeing pings that will have gone up by 1-8 ms. This is probably normal - see my explanation below.

Some of you are seeing increases 40 or 50 ms. This is abnormal, so read on for info on what might be going on.

Q I'm on the west coast and my ping increased by a few ms, is this a problem?

Part of this is just the reality of moving 600 km east from Toronto to Montreal. It takes light ~4 ms to make a round trip between Toronto and Montreal. And chances are it won't be a straight line, either, and routers along the way will add additonal delays. So yeah, if you used to live in Toronto and had a ping time of 1 ms, it's probably 10 ms or higher now. Likewise if are on the west coast, even if you're on Google fibre, you're still going to see slightly higher ping time. If you're on the East coast, probably lower! it's just the laws of physics.

Q. Actually I'm seeing severely higher ping times, like 40 ms or more than they should be.

Please get in touch! There's a couple of reasons that could be the case, and one of them is pathing. A number of ISPs (looking at *you*, Telstra) have selected truly suboptimal paths to our datacenter. Like for instance, by crossing to China, travelling through all of Asia and Europe and then the Atlantic ocean, before arriving on the eastern coast of Canada. Not a good path.

We want to get those routes fixed. We're not the ones setting them, but we *can* apply pressure to ISPs to get them to pick better routes. What we need from you to do this, though, is a screenshot of a traceroute (using the tracert command) and your IP address. Basically, we need evidence. When we can prove to an ISP that they need to fix their routes, we're often able to get them to fix it.


--

Hope that answers some of your questions. I hope to have time on Friday or later in the week to sit down with our CSRs and brief them more fully on this issue so they can respond better to your tickets. Right now the best way to get help is to let me know through this thread or by other means if you can.

#2 Deathlike

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:04 PM

Well, it's good to know someone's on the case.

#3 NocturnalBeast

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:17 PM

Good information, but data does not quite travel at the speed of light, even through fiber, because of the transducers required to convert the light to electricity and back.

#4 Past

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:28 PM

Telstra being called out as crap by people from all the way from Canada amuses me greatly. Good luck getting them to do anything if there's no profit in it for them.

If any Aussies looking to jump ship i can tell you my ping with Internode wasn't affected by the move.

Edited by Past, 11 September 2014 - 08:40 PM.


#5 repete

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:29 PM

Thanks for the update. 250ms ping from NZ, both before and after the move.

View PostPast, on 11 September 2014 - 08:28 PM, said:

Telstra being called out as crap by people from all the way from Canada amuses me greatly.


I'd hate to see what it looked like if Telstra and Comcast had a baby.

#6 sporesp4wn

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:22 PM

What IP address should we ping / tracert to?

I would think that 70.42.29.65 (relay-1.mwtactics.com) wouldn't be very useful after the datacenter move.

Edited by Sporespawn, 11 September 2014 - 09:37 PM.


#7 p4r4g0n

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:27 PM

@Sporespawn 192.99.109.129

Its the IP for the backend server ... having said that, it would be better if PGI could give us some other usable IP so as to avoid unintentionally bombarding the backend server with pings.

Edited by p4r4g0n, 11 September 2014 - 09:29 PM.


#8 Gryphorim

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:43 PM

Just ran Tracert, all of a sudden ping back in normal range. This call to action seems to have made an impact.

Admittedly spent 2 hrs on the phone yesterday to Telstra's networking centre tech support team, where we were investigating some of their globalnet servers routing in all the wrong ways, so it's likely they've been trying to fix at least since then.

If so, thanks guys at Telstra networking centre tech support team, the level of customer service I received yesterday was the best I've ever received from the company.

Of course, thanks to PGI for fighting this from your end.

#9 StillRadioactive

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 10:03 PM

View PostJon Cunningham, on 11 September 2014 - 08:02 PM, said:

Hello folks,

Some of you are having network issues and are finding your pings are much higher (30 to 40 ms) than they used to be.

This isn't the normal state of affairs. For most users, pings have decreased. Sometimes by 10ms, sometimes by a 50ms. We've put a lot of care into optimizing our network, but we still have more to go.

Some of you are seeing pings that will have gone up by 1-8 ms. This is probably normal - see my explanation below.

Some of you are seeing increases 40 or 50 ms. This is abnormal, so read on for info on what might be going on.

Q I'm on the west coast and my ping increased by a few ms, is this a problem?

Part of this is just the reality of moving 600 km east from Toronto to Montreal. It takes light ~4 ms to make a round trip between Toronto and Montreal. And chances are it won't be a straight line, either, and routers along the way will add additonal delays. So yeah, if you used to live in Toronto and had a ping time of 1 ms, it's probably 10 ms or higher now. Likewise if are on the west coast, even if you're on Google fibre, you're still going to see slightly higher ping time. If you're on the East coast, probably lower! it's just the laws of physics.

Q. Actually I'm seeing severely higher ping times, like 40 ms or more than they should be.

Please get in touch! There's a couple of reasons that could be the case, and one of them is pathing. A number of ISPs (looking at *you*, Telstra) have selected truly suboptimal paths to our datacenter. Like for instance, by crossing to China, travelling through all of Asia and Europe and then the Atlantic ocean, before arriving on the eastern coast of Canada. Not a good path.

We want to get those routes fixed. We're not the ones setting them, but we *can* apply pressure to ISPs to get them to pick better routes. What we need from you to do this, though, is a screenshot of a traceroute (using the tracert command) and your IP address. Basically, we need evidence. When we can prove to an ISP that they need to fix their routes, we're often able to get them to fix it.


--

Hope that answers some of your questions. I hope to have time on Friday or later in the week to sit down with our CSRs and brief them more fully on this issue so they can respond better to your tickets. Right now the best way to get help is to let me know through this thread or by other means if you can.


Holy ****. This is precisely the sort of granular, SME-level communication that should surround just about every issue, no matter how small.

View PostDeathlike, on 11 September 2014 - 08:04 PM, said:

Well, it's good to know someone's on the case.


Look, even Deathlike liked it. Deathlike doesn't like anything.

#10 Kilo 40

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 10:08 PM

View PostStillRadioactive, on 11 September 2014 - 10:03 PM, said:

Look, even Deathlike liked it. Deathlike doesn't like anything.


I laughed

#11 Father Dougal

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 11:15 PM

Can we have the server IP? How am I supposed to do a trace route without an IP to route to?

#12 THE REAL FKN DEAL

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 11:28 PM

My ping ranges from 260-380 from Australia using a VPN doesnt do anything anymore. There are massive problems with your servers even people from Montreal get 5-80 ping why is there such a massive variance even locally?

#13 boboking

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:21 AM

I'm on Telstra - so I've been having high pings for a while now.

Well I checked tracert today and my ping from 400ms has gone down to 300ms. Better than nothing but its still higher than my normal 240-250ms ping :(

#14 Appogee

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:30 AM

My ping went to 270 (+40) after the data center move, but yesterday it dropped down to 220 (-20 relative to the data center move).

So something significant improved yesterday.

My hitreg continues to be crap though. I was testing it in private matches last night. The number of times I'm appearing to hit targets (reticle + paperdoll) yet my opponent (50 ping) tells me he has taken no damage, is frightening. In addition, when he bunny-hopped to spread fire, he did not even appear to be jumping at all on my screen.

It's not possible to be competitive when you can put 8 alphas into someone at close range and yet have them kill you anyway because they took no damage.

#15 Impyrium

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:40 AM

Yeah, I've noticed my connection has been routing properly now. It's been switching back and forth a bit, but it seems pretty stable at the moment.

#16 Deathlike

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:41 AM

View PostStillRadioactive, on 11 September 2014 - 10:03 PM, said:

Look, even Deathlike liked it. Deathlike doesn't like anything.


I like honesty, and people are actually trying to help the situation.

Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to say this is true for other "PGI personalities".

#17 Oderint dum Metuant

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:44 AM

View PostFather Dougal, on 11 September 2014 - 11:15 PM, said:

Can we have the server IP? How am I supposed to do a trace route without an IP to route to?


The ip is available in multiple threads already.
It's also in your address bar; mwomercs.com will still show the routing path.
192.99.109.192

Edited by DV McKenna, 12 September 2014 - 12:45 AM.


#18 DeeBeeP

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:49 AM

I don't know what my route before the data center move was but I had a consistent 180ms latency to the old data center which was pretty good for where I live. I average between 150ms - 190ms to the West Coast normally.

Since the data center move my in-game latency is between 280ms - 480ms, so an increase of at least 100ms with sometimes spiking to to +300ms compared to what I had before the move.

Here is my current route which seems pretty consistent with the latency I see in-game.

Tracing route to 192.99.109.129 over a maximum of 30 hops

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 10.58.46.1
2 6 ms 5 ms 5 ms 118.23.62.2
3 6 ms 7 ms 5 ms 118.23.57.17
4 10 ms 12 ms 10 ms 118.23.110.117
5 9 ms 10 ms 8 ms 221.184.18.193
6 9 ms 12 ms 8 ms 180.37.209.5
7 8 ms 10 ms 8 ms ae-5.r21.osakjp02.jp.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.11.
173]
8 10 ms 10 ms 9 ms ae-5.r22.osakjp02.jp.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.6.1
92]
9 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms ae-7.r24.tokyjp05.jp.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.3.2
21]
10 16 ms 18 ms 16 ms ae-5.r22.tokyjp01.jp.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.3.1
54]
11 82 ms 86 ms 109 ms ae-5.r21.sngpsi05.sg.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.7.3
9]
12 83 ms 82 ms 84 ms ae-11.r20.sngpsi05.sg.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.7.
22]
13 81 ms 86 ms 80 ms ae-2.r00.sngpsi02.sg.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.3.1
47]
14 82 ms 84 ms 83 ms ae0.singapore2.sin.seabone.net [93.186.133.12]
15 287 ms 286 ms 286 ms xe-3-1-0.milano51.mil.seabone.net [195.22.205.15
5]
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 281 ms 280 ms 280 ms sbg-g1-a9.fr.eu [91.121.128.127]
19 284 ms 280 ms 279 ms 37.187.36.153
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 291 ms 274 ms 283 ms 192.99.109.129

Trace complete.

My new route goes the complete wrong direction across the globe. I go all the way to Singapore, then across the ******* planet to Milano, then to France before it finally decides to head to the US which makes absolutely no sense. For whatever reason I am routed west instead of east which is why my ping has doubled. What the hell? Not sure what PGI can do to fix Asian ISP routes but I don't even bother to play anymore, its just too painful.

The mwtactics route is around 199ms but at least crosses the Pacific to LA first.

Edited by DeeBeeP, 12 September 2014 - 01:01 AM.


#19 MonkeyCheese

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 12:51 AM

Well my average ping went down from 280ish to 250ish but this is at least some good news for other Aussies.

Not surprised at all with Telstra >.>

#20 Kiyoshi Amaya

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Posted 12 September 2014 - 01:11 AM

Just for your information, in case you haven't heard.

http://www.battleforthenet.com/

John Oliver explains it nicely in a video almost half way down the page.

Edit: P.S. I have no plans to attack Estonia.

Edited by Shrekken, 12 September 2014 - 01:18 AM.






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