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Foot Mechanics


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#1 RazorbeastFXK3

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Posted 29 September 2014 - 10:39 AM

My curiosity gets the best of me at times and I threw myself into 3rd person view mode and looked at my 'mechs' feet. I noticed that when I turn my 'mech the foot lifts and turns in the direction of where I'm going before getting set down again.

Would it prove more beneficial to the server load if the feet were static where they are always facing forward unless planted with the mech pivoting on it? So when the foot is raised off the ground the foot rubberbands back to the forward facing position instead of pre-turning in the air to the direction the 'mech is turning?

Wasn't sure if it would matter to the load or not but it's a feature I'm referencing from Mechwarrior 3 where yeah.. the foot of the 'mech didn't twist unless it was on the ground and the 'mech was pivoting on it whether standing still and turning its legs or walking while turning.

The start of the battle in this video shows an example of the foot mechanics I'm talking about.

#2 Firewuff

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Posted 29 September 2014 - 10:01 PM

its all client end. ther server doesnt care where the feet look liek they are at.

#3 RazorbeastFXK3

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 12:13 PM

If it was all Client End does that mean I can modify how the feet work on my end? Or would that constitute as a hack?

View PostFirewuff, on 29 September 2014 - 10:01 PM, said:

its all client end. ther server doesnt care where the feet look liek they are at.


#4 9erRed

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 04:04 PM

Greetings all,

I'm assuming this is left over code and positional work from when we had 'terrain following' feet placement.

- It was removed as 'at the time' took too much number crunching and caused issues.
(now we get Mech's standing on slopes by only there toes?)

This may return as knockdown, crouching and the standing back-up animations are returned to the gameplay.

9erRed

Edited by 9erRed, 03 October 2014 - 07:20 PM.


#5 CocoaJin

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 10:13 PM

View PostRazorbeastFXK3, on 29 September 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

My curiosity gets the best of me at times and I threw myself into 3rd person view mode and looked at my 'mechs' feet. I noticed that when I turn my 'mech the foot lifts and turns in the direction of where I'm going before getting set down again.

Would it prove more beneficial to the server load if the feet were static where they are always facing forward unless planted with the mech pivoting on it? So when the foot is raised off the ground the foot rubberbands back to the forward facing position instead of pre-turning in the air to the direction the 'mech is turning?

Wasn't sure if it would matter to the load or not but it's a feature I'm referencing from Mechwarrior 3 where yeah.. the foot of the 'mech didn't twist unless it was on the ground and the 'mech was pivoting on it whether standing still and turning its legs or walking while turning.

The start of the battle in this video shows an example of the foot mechanics I'm talking about.


Wow...that game more or less, kind of really sucked...a lot.

#6 RazorbeastFXK3

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 02:52 PM

If you're basing your needless judgement about how that game "kind of really sucked" on the shared video alone then I really hope for your sake your offline life is much better than your online life.

View PostCocoaJin, on 03 October 2014 - 10:13 PM, said:

Wow...that game more or less, kind of really sucked...a lot.


I'm not sure if that's how the foot mechanics worked for MWOMercs when they first started but that's how they worked for Mechwarrior 3. I don't have a foot fetish or anything but in my last few battles when walking on sloped terrain I noticed the feet hover over the ground instead of conforming to how feet normally work where if you're on a slope then the foot tends to reposition itself so the bottom matches with the angle of the surface.

I understand that it's not really that important to gameplay 'specially how when bodyparts get blown off sometimes they hover in the air and vanish over a short period of time instead of falling to the ground and doing so but yeah, my curiosity leads me to notice strange details at random. A lot of the times I figure it out myself and put it on the backburner and sometimes I end up asking questions like these.

You say that it was coded in so the foot of the 'mech followed the terrain and was removed somewhere down the road.. I'm now wondering if maybe that code were to be brought back if it would resolve the issue of 'mechs getting stuck in certain spots (No leg movement/throttle controls or jumpjets) and finding themselves falling through the terrain surface before/after dying 'cause the 'mechs would no longer be "standing on slopes by only their toes."

View Post9erRed, on 03 October 2014 - 04:04 PM, said:

Greetings all,

I'm assuming this is left over code and positional work from when we had 'terrain following' feet placement.

- It was removed as 'at the time' took too much number crunching and caused issues.
(now we get Mech's standing on slopes by only there toes?)

This may return as knockdown, crouching and the standing back-up animations are returned to the gameplay.

9erRed


#7 9erRed

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 05:32 AM

Greetings all,

The code work that was removed was positional data for the feet and skeletal positioning of the legs on different slope angles.

- It required too much back and forth between the server and client for all the changes the Mech's feet/legs made on hills and slopes. The LOS and hit detection, back then, was still in it's early stages, so this set of codes was removed to speed up fixing the whole issue.
- Now, it's still not great and the hit detection and boxes go from working great to all messed up from patch to patch.
(It seems like they fix it and then it gets over-written or deleted at each patch, and back to the broken state again? Who's writing the fix code and why is it not staying corrected? Karl, you in on this?)

So, I would assume that once we get 'truly fixed' hit detection and the weapons changes don't break it again, we may see this worked on with the knock down code. It's related to that and the 'standing back up' dynamics.
- But we still need additional details fixed for the foot placement and eliminating the 'sliding in place' we still see on some feet as the Mech moves. That's directly linked to the feet not actually 'finding' the surface and just doing a hover position over the ground terrain. This is one of the lacking visual indications on the Mech's weight being placed on the ground, and a bit difficult to believe when they barely touch the surface. (this has been mentioned before in different threads, Mech's not touching the ground when they walk.)

This is all eye candy for now, not really required for game play to happen and still be fun. But to fine tune the animations, the leg movement, the feet, all brings some emersion into the game. And I'm assuming that's why we all play it in the first place.

Just some info,
9erRed

#8 RazorbeastFXK3

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Posted 06 October 2014 - 09:26 AM

Thank you very much for your response. I found a better video that shows the foot mechanics though I don't know if visuals help any with adjusting codes.

2:03 the damage display image on the lower right corner shows the ankle pivoting on the planted foot
3:33 shows again but able to see the foot rubberband to the straight/forward position when lifted
4:55 same deal
5:43 it briefly shows the leg/footwork in 3rd person view but a bit too brief for me to see how the feet work on sloped terrain.

View Post9erRed, on 06 October 2014 - 05:32 AM, said:

This is all eye candy for now, not really required for game play to happen and still be fun. But to fine tune the animations, the leg movement, the feet, all brings some emersion into the game. And I'm assuming that's why we all play it in the first place.

Just some info,
9erRed



Crouching would be awesome. I don't remember which of the mechwarrior series alllowed one to "bump into another 'mech and cause gyro overload" but watching the old MWOMercs youtube videos it seemed a bit ridiculous. If it's re-introduced I'll be fine with it as it'd be an amusing start to some sorties where players will have to either be real cautious when starting up or end up being knocked over like bowling pins. I kind of enjoyed the feature of destructible terrain where if you unloaded LRM20x2 at the ground near your enemy's feet or hit them a few times with an AC20 or two that they suffer a gyro overload but as the rules go not sure if those would be considered.

View Post9erRed, on 03 October 2014 - 04:04 PM, said:

- It was removed as 'at the time' took too much number crunching and caused issues.
(now we get Mech's standing on slopes by only there toes?)

This may return as knockdown, crouching and the standing back-up animations are returned to the gameplay.

9erRed

Edited by RazorbeastFXK3, 06 October 2014 - 09:27 AM.


#9 RazorbeastFXK3

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 11:20 AM

Still curious to know if it would have any impact on the game (not the gameplay but the game itself) if the legs had loose ankles so when the foot is in the air it doesn't turn until it's planted while the 'mech is turning and when it's planted the entire foot doesn't pivot on the ground like a ballerina.

#10 Zephonarch II

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 09:01 AM

View PostCocoaJin, on 03 October 2014 - 10:13 PM, said:

Wow...that game more or less, kind of really sucked...a lot.


Great game. If you meant graphics-wise, well graphics do not determine how do-able a game's objective is. By defintion. Seriously those graphics pretty made any game apart of the 'simulator' genre. But in agreement, yeah the most annoying/challenging thing that game had was probably the limited torso twist for the Blackhawk/nova, strider, owens, puma, firefly. Otherwise, MW3 wasn't that bad.

And the Foot mechanics, should be re-implemented. It shouldn't be that hard since many other games have done it.

Edited by Zephonarch II, 24 November 2014 - 09:02 AM.






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