11 replies to this topic

[Tim East]

When you are using the Arrow to snipe in its default configuration, you are doing it wrong, to the great detriment of your team's ability to win. The Arrow is meant to be like a slower but tougher and harder-hitting Locust 1V; you should use the laser to poke a hole in a slow or stationary foe, and then swoop in to rip off components. If you're going to snipe with the thing, at least boat ACs or something so that you can do pinpoint damage to a degree at range. A single laser spreads far too easily outside of about 500m, especially if your target moves.

On a similar note, those ECM LL Ravens... Come on, guys. I know you can get good damage numbers, but is that because you kill the enemy, or because you shower 2 damage across 3 components on 8 enemies? I can't even count the number of times the ECM Raven has been the last dude standing and accomplished nothing.

Ah well, maybe I'm just venting my aggravation about the all-too-prevalent "hiding behind a rock until the enemy crushes you" meta, but I've done enough not hiding to know that when everyone attacks, we win more often than not. I also know that PPD seems to be better for sniping than spreading damage like lasers. Actually, I've seen some supposedly under-powered Summoners today rock people's socks off at both near and far ranges with supposedly under-powered ERPPCs, but hey, it's whatever.

[dragnier1]

About ecm ravens, in their defense once in a blue moon i see one taking on 4-6 others as the last mech standing and win the match for their team.

Well, once in a blue moon...

[Takashi Uchida]

I used to be one of those Snipers.. I had visions of glory once I saw one do 1400 damage, take out 3 assaults and survive to the end of a close match.

Here's a vid of me trolling and eliminating a would-be ECM sniper lol



I would think that the Arrow works like a souped up Cicada-3C. I enjoyed playing the 3C to get elites for my CDA-3M, but eventually sold it to make some room. That BJ Mastery Pack is tempting tho, I might pick it up once the medium queue goes back down lol.

[Tim East]

Hahaha, that was a funny vid Takashi. I usually just circle and leg them with my SPL Locust, but when he shot the pillar between you two, that was golden. Yeah, I think I just wanted to vent my spleen a little there. It just bugs me when I see these guys do horribly time after time after time. I'm not even against ECM sniping as a concept, but I just really don't like the laser-using ones. I can definitely respect the gauss snipers for their tendency to plug you for a ton of damage and not even really give away their location. The Cicada 3M is pretty good imo, though I'm biased to fear mediums a little bit.

Also, congrats on climbing as high as you have in the rankings. I couldn't quite manage to keep my slot in the Commando bracket this time around. Maybe next time I'll have a better plan.

[Saiphas Cain]

I regularly core people with the ERLL Raven 3L but I understand the concern with laser spread. It is an issue. The problem with the Raven is you're stuck with lasers and missiles. No ballistics on the 3L. PPC's are an option but they're just so hot and slow hitting anything at the ranges you engage at to prevent LRMstorms is nearly impossible unless the target is asleep at the helm. The other option is going the classic close range 3L but that tends to alternate between covering allies with ECM and getting stomped. The Raven's beak makes disengaging without taking parting shots on the cheek difficult. The issue may be the angle they engage at. I try to find around a 90' angle from the action so enemies have to turn to face me. When they do they're not looking at the main force.

[Tim East]

You know, I used to drive a 4X waaaay back in the day as an anti-gausskat sniper with dual AC2, but that was pre-AC2 repeated nerf. The shake and smoke used to be good enough to all but stop counter-battery fire.

[ChapeL]

Takashi Uchida, on 24 October 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

Here's a vid of me trolling and eliminating a would-be ECM sniper lol

Your settings are probably the lowest I have ever seen! Took me a bit to recognize that Raven.

[Thejuggla]

I don't have a problem with these people. They should be vulturing till their MGs can come into use with exposed internals, whether its from sniping or teammates. However taking ecm away from team to go snipe isn't credit to team.

[That Dawg]

Thejuggla, on 03 November 2014 - 03:50 PM, said:

However taking ecm away from team to go snipe isn't credit to team.

yes and no
damned if you do, damned if you dont...ravens, kits, cicadas...aren't tough enough really to roll with a pack of mediums or heavies solely to provide ecm cover. (maybe we should start getting paid XP/Cbills for time and total under blanket?)
Can't count the number of times my team was losing a flank, I'm in position to start picking away at that advancing lance and they turn to chase the squirrel!
Very effective in pugs, but even on drops. Always 1-4 will lose focus of the advance and turn to deal with the pest thats not really dealing that much damage.
IF the team is paying attention (yes, I know..epic stupid statement) that invisible ECM behind enemy lines is more valuable than sitting in their midst, providing a blanket of cover.
but there are times a lance of ecm lights with dual ac20's and gauss can't help

[LordMelvin]

LL sniping lights are fine provided they actually do something. Far too often I see a Raven or Locust try to snipe and either get blasted by an orbital strike's worth of gauss rounds or get splashed by a medium laser and spend the rest of the game hiding under an Atlas.

My Raven has two ERLL and a NARC for when the fighting starts. While the teams close range I can soften up targets from afar and if I can get into a good flanking position unmolested I can terrorize the enemy with allied LRMs. I'm a pretty awful light pilot so I prefer a sniping role but hanging out with the LRM boats is a great way to get spotting assists.

[Ascaloth]

In defense of the laser snipers:

I've played a lot of chassis in the past, but found myself to be best under the ECM harasser/spotter/sniper role (to the point of selling all other mechs!). Nowadays i like to run mostly these 2 mechs:

Spider-3D with ECM and 2 ERLL: Very limited armor, but enough speed (and a single JJ) to reach advantage points in no time and fry some big guys rear armor, take out catapults/jaegers arms, delaying assaults advance (if they are stupid enough to stop and try to look for me) and, of course, giving some targets and reports for my team. I commonly use paintball tactics on this build (snapshooting, moving from cover to cover, flanking and so on). I had some issues on PUGs with players bragging about why i didn't stay with the team and give them ECM cover...well, it's just too squishy for that, and also too small (bigger mechs keep treading on me )

Cicada-3M with ECM and 3 ERLL or 2 ERPPC: This build is funny but very effective. It runs slower and hotter than the Spider-3D, but it's able to deliver a crapload of damage with little to none return fire, also being more useful bringing ECM near the team. The Cicada is too big to go unnoticed behind enemy lines, and with the 255XL motor i use, too slow to get in position and also avoid being hunted by lights and even faster mediums, but it doesn't draw too much attention while walking nearby our heavies and assaults and also has reasonable armor to stand some hits. Given the chance, i flank the enemy team. I easily reach the top 3 damage scores and Kill/Assists on my team, for many times on the very top (over 800 damage).

ECM Snipers are worse than brawlers? Sometimes, but if brawling does not apply to that player's play style, sniping might be a wise choice. No mech is intended to be used in a very single way, otherwise we wouldn't be allowed to customize them.

Edited by Ascaloth, 04 November 2014 - 05:50 AM.

[Benjamin Davion]

See, and I'm frequently last man standing in a 2 ERLL Raven or Spider and I have come back to kill 4, 5, 6, once 7 enemy mechs while the last man standing, and pull out a win. I run my ERLL Raven in teams and often outdamage and outkill most of the assaults.

Why? Careful precision fire into open components, and no one is paying attention to me. What's a more attractive target, the Dire Wolf banging away at your team with 6 UACs... or me? He doesn't even have to hit anything, you see him, and he's all you care about taking out. Nevermind that it's actually ME hiding 500 meters away behind a hill that's actually knocking your mechs down, you have tunnel vision on the big scary assault. Piloted properly, with the right skills and the right positioning, the 2 ERLL Raven is one of the most potent assault killers out there.

Edited by Benjamin Davion, 07 November 2014 - 02:22 AM.