35 replies to this topic

[Lucky Strongarm]

In most multiplayer "shooteresque" games, how enemies are spotted and reported really affects gameplay.

For instance, there are games where enemies within a certain range automatically appear on YOUR minimap, but have to be "spotted" to be communicated to teammates. Other games report enemy locations to your entire team as soon as the enemy appears to you.

I can think of "one f2p game" in particular that has a bit of a wacky spotting system that does not render enemy units in the environment even though you have plain view of the location where they hide, and even though it's 20 meters away (granted that game provides an unrealistic third person perspective).

Will the environment only render enemy units that appear on your minimap? Are they only visible to you? Are they visible to the entire team? Will they be visible in the environment first, requiring the scout to actively spot them (use a key command instead of just "walk near" them)? Do smaller 'mechs get concealment bonuses or is the concealment advantage a natural result of a 'mech's size (no bonus, just "smaller" [relative term] so harder to spot)? Should I ask more similar questions that make answering more difficult?

Inquiring minds want to know, since it has a rather large impact on gameplay and tactics.

[Kittygrinder]

The way im pretty sure its going to work, is everyone will be rendered, and you can see them. The point of a scout is this exactly. Run in, spot mechs so they show up for the rest of the team on their huds, and then run the hell away.

[Adridos]

You can see things as in real life.

You can target things you can't see if someone with the right scouting equipment realys their position to you.


I hope these two short sentences made you understand how it works.

[RedDragon]

Lucky Strongarm, on 25 June 2012 - 05:56 AM, said:

In most multiplayer "shooteresque" games, how enemies are spotted and reported really affects gameplay.

For instance, there are games where enemies within a certain range automatically appear on YOUR minimap, but have to be "spotted" to be communicated to teammates. Other games report enemy locations to your entire team as soon as the enemy appears to you.

I can think of "one f2p game" in particular that has a bit of a wacky spotting system that does not render enemy units in the environment even though you have plain view of the location where they hide, and even though it's 20 meters away (granted that game provides an unrealistic third person perspective).

Will the environment only render enemy units that appear on your minimap? Are they only visible to you? Are they visible to the entire team? Will they be visible in the environment first, requiring the scout to actively spot them (use a key command instead of just "walk near" them)? Do smaller 'mechs get concealment bonuses or is the concealment advantage a natural result of a 'mech's size (no bonus, just "smaller" [relative term] so harder to spot)? Should I ask more similar questions that make answering more difficult?

Inquiring minds want to know, since it has a rather large impact on gameplay and tactics.

Mechs will definitely be rendered whenever you can see them, they will not "vanish" if your radar can't pick them up. As I understand of now, you have a certain radar range and every enemy outside that range won't show up on your radar (obviously). Now if a friendly mech is ahead of you and gets radar contact, he will relay that information to you, so you have that contact as well on your radar.

There will be cases when you can see an enemy mech but it won't show up on your radar, be it for use of ECM-gear, shutting down or whatever.

[Lucky Strongarm]

Thanks for the responses. This sounds like what I wanted to hear.

RedDragon, on 25 June 2012 - 06:04 AM, said:

Now if a friendly mech is ahead of you and gets radar contact, he will relay that information to you, so you have that contact as well on your radar.

One small detail: Are you saying that your radar is "ganged" with friendly radars, and you automatically see what they see on your HUD, or it will require "active spotting" to relay locations?

[RedDragon]

As I observed from the videos as of now, whenever a friendly unit spots an enemy mech, it will show up on your radar.
You can see it in this video. The Catapult stays in the back and its buddys run around at the front and make radar contact.

[RG Notch]

Adridos, on 25 June 2012 - 06:03 AM, said:

You can see things as in real life.

You can target things you can't see if someone with the right scouting equipment realys their position to you.


I hope these two short sentences made you understand how it works.

Umm you shouldn't be posting this info if you're in the beta...and if you're not in the beta you shouldn't be posting this as fact when you don't know.

[Risky]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 06:38 AM, said:

Umm you shouldn't be posting this info if you're in the beta...and if you're not in the beta you shouldn't be posting this as fact when you don't know.

Actually no, this info has already been readily available to future players since before the closed beta signups started through gameplay videos provided by PGI interviews and the likes and through descriptions before those interviews took place.

So even if that guy is in beta, he's not stating anything new.

Edited by Risky, 25 June 2012 - 06:44 AM.

[RG Notch]

Risky, on 25 June 2012 - 06:43 AM, said:

Actually no, this info has already been readily available to future players since before the closed beta signups started through gameplay videos provided by PGI interviews and the likes and through descriptions before those interviews took place.

So even if that guy is in beta, he's not stating anything new.

So again, you're in beta and know nothing has changed since those videos? It's amazing what people know for a fact from a few bits of video that may not even represent the current beta. I'm not saying it's not the case, but I certainly wouldn't say it definitely is. I wonder why they need an NDA if everything about the game is so clearly evident from these videos.
Anyways, just like most of the posts here, its merely speculation, while it may be well founded based on the videos, its dangerous to make too many conclusions while beta is still underway.

[Celros]

Also I want add that ofc needs right skill from pilot and equipment on mech to able relay intel to commander and his lance. sry if my spelling sounds strange

[RedDragon]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

So again, you're in beta and know nothing has changed since those videos? It's amazing what people know for a fact from a few bits of video that may not even represent the current beta. I'm not saying it's not the case, but I certainly wouldn't say it definitely is. I wonder why they need an NDA if everything about the game is so clearly evident from these videos.
Anyways, just like most of the posts here, its merely speculation, while it may be well founded based on the videos, its dangerous to make too many conclusions while beta is still underway.

Dude, chill out a bit. There are things that shouldn't be presented as facts, but what Adridos said in his post is confirmed by all the vids and comments from the Devs, so there's no doubt that it will stay that way. He doesn't have to be in the Beta for something like this.

[Risky]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

So again, you're in beta and know nothing has changed since those videos? It's amazing what people know for a fact from a few bits of video that may not even represent the current beta. I'm not saying it's not the case, but I certainly wouldn't say it definitely is. I wonder why they need an NDA if everything about the game is so clearly evident from these videos.
Anyways, just like most of the posts here, its merely speculation, while it may be well founded based on the videos, its dangerous to make too many conclusions while beta is still underway.

You're like my mother, ***** about things because you think you know some false truth even though the facts are right there in front of you, but you're still blind. Kind of like Chr...nah I'm not that mean.

Here's where your argument for things change goes awry. Alpha! Not beta. Is used for defining these in depths systems and how they work. Beta is used to find and work these systems to a near perfect level so that future players may enjoy that system with little to no trouble. Not change how they work, but change errors they may give off. Say you spot a jenner and then your hud decides there's a thousand jenners running around or that if you spot that jenner the game will delete boot.ini and procede to take over the world and enslave the human race.

Since the game is out of alpha, it's pretty damn safe to assume that what we've been shown is fact.

And for the record,

No, I'm not in beta.

Edited by Risky, 25 June 2012 - 07:05 AM.

[Lucky Strongarm]

Risky, on 25 June 2012 - 07:00 AM, said:

You're like my mother, ***** about things because you think you know some false truth even though the facts are right there in front of you, but you're still blind. Kind of like Chr...nah I'm not that mean.

Here's where your argument for things change goes awry. Alpha! Not beta. Is used for defining these in depths systems and how they work. Beta is used to find and work these systems to a near perfect level so that future players may enjoy that system with little to no trouble.

Since the game is out of alpha, it's pretty damn safe to assume that what we've been shown is fact.

I think we can all assume a speculative context for these posts. I shall not wail in agony if what's been put forth here turns out to not be the case. Simply pondering the possibilities.

[RG Notch]

Lucky Strongarm, on 25 June 2012 - 07:03 AM, said:

I think we can all assume a speculative context for these posts. I shall not wail in agony if what's been put forth here turns out to not be the case. Simply pondering the possibilities.

But the guy above who isn't in the beta knows it's a fact so we can all relax. Again why the NDA if the game is ready to go? Oh never mind, never argue with people who "know" things. So I wonder why there are so many people with questions about the game, I mean it's all in the videos and not subject to change. I do like how even the "knower" qualifies it with "safe to assume". All I'm saying is that people are assuming, safely or not. That's where your argument breaks down. Otherwise remove the qualifier and guarantee it. I don't get why pointing out that people are assuming is so bad, then again I don't "know" a lot like some people.

[StriplingWarrior]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

So again, you're in beta and know nothing has changed since those videos? It's amazing what people know for a fact from a few bits of video that may not even represent the current beta. I'm not saying it's not the case, but I certainly wouldn't say it definitely is. I wonder why they need an NDA if everything about the game is so clearly evident from these videos.
Anyways, just like most of the posts here, its merely speculation, while it may be well founded based on the videos, its dangerous to make too many conclusions while beta is still underway.

Or, he is in beta and can, without worry of NDA violation point to an already released video as evidence to how the mechanic works. He did not say, "Hey, I'm in Beta and it works like this." He pointed to a video and made an observation..don't be such a DB. That is the mods job(I love you guys ) around here.
Being under NDA for two different games currently and having beta and alpha tested a number of games at this point. Something like that would not violate the agreement since the video came from officially sanctioned sources. In my experience, and having reviewed my copies of the two NDA I have on hand.

[Phelan P Kell]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 07:22 AM, said:

But the guy above who isn't in the beta knows it's a fact so we can all relax. Again why the NDA if the game is ready to go? Oh never mind, never argue with people who "know" things. So I wonder why there are so many people with questions about the game, I mean it's all in the videos and not subject to change. I do like how even the "knower" qualifies it with "safe to assume". All I'm saying is that people are assuming, safely or not. That's where your argument breaks down. Otherwise remove the qualifier and guarantee it. I don't get why pointing out that people are assuming is so bad, then again I don't "know" a lot like some people.

RG,,

You are wrong, and Mr Dragon is right.

Ignore the NDA's, (I am) the Devs made it clear, those functions as described by Mr dragon are correct.

I verify by my own authority, that it is so.


Also just to be sure you get it, when you roll out of bed tomorrow you can't be sure gravity will take hold of you. We are basing that whole thing off of inductive reasoning instead of deductive reasoning. We can't be sure it will be the same. I know you think gravity will exist tomorrow, BUT YOU CAN'T LOGICALY BE SURE!!!!!!!!!!!

THE KELL has spoken!!! So stop hounding us. (budum tish)





****also I added extra commas to **** you off, my guess is that your a grammar troll

Edited by Phelan P Kell, 25 June 2012 - 07:33 AM.

[Arbalister]

I'm sure it'll be pretty easy to spot mechanics. They're usually the ones hanging around the 'Mech bays in grease stained overalls. You know, the guys with the wrenches that are always giving things "one more tweak..."

[Death Mallet]

RG Notch, on 25 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

So again, you're in beta and know nothing has changed since those videos? It's amazing what people know for a fact from a few bits of video that may not even represent the current beta. I'm not saying it's not the case, but I certainly wouldn't say it definitely is. I wonder why they need an NDA if everything about the game is so clearly evident from these videos.
Anyways, just like most of the posts here, its merely speculation, while it may be well founded based on the videos, its dangerous to make too many conclusions while beta is still underway.

Dangerous!!! Dangerous I tell you!!!

I mean, what would happen if people thought the game worked one way, and then turned out to work a completely different way?? Mass chaos, that's what. Dogs and cat's, living together! Real end-of-the-world type stuff!!

Thank you for protecting us from that cruel fate.



. . . Or maybe people on Aug 7 would just say, "Oh, it doesn't work the way we thought it did."

Edited by Death Mallet, 25 June 2012 - 07:31 AM.

[tempest238]

As has been stated. Alpha test are where game developers add and remove features to the game.

Closed beta is a continuation of that process to a certain degree. Generally with a limited number of public players. During the closed beta process, they really only remove/add/change something if it is truly broken.

And open beta is generally the finished product. With a chance to further work out any bugs with a far larger player base closer to the actual predicted population of gamers.

Having been a gamer for nearly 20 yrs. And participating in more betas then I can remember. I know this to be for the most part true.

And although I never watched the videos or read things posted or otherwise spoken by the devs. I am inclined to believe the whole spotting issue as has been stated.

Where mechs dont show up on your radar or hud. Unless a friendly mech or yourself spots it.

[TLBFestus]

Boy, am I glad I got some relatively "quiet" time on these forums before all the "everything I read on the Internet requires me to pick a fight" crowd showed up.