194 replies to this topic

[Jabilo]

Count me IN.

As soon as this build is stable ditch 32 bit support and lets all live in the 21st Century.

[Smokeyjedi]

Frothing @ mouth**

[EmperorMyrf]

VictusRhul, on 18 December 2014 - 12:03 PM, said:

I ran the patch and the option does not appear in the gear box. I uninstalled the whole thing and downloaded the client from the web site. Reinstalled clean and patched. Still no gear box option to run 64 bit. Any clues? I know this is xperimental but just wondering if there is something else I need to do?
Both the Xdiag and C++ installs said what was loaded is current or newer than what was downloaded.
Any advise would be appreciated.

You're not seeing it because the patch hasn't been released yet

[Padjo]

VictusRhul, on 18 December 2014 - 12:03 PM, said:

Still no gear box option to run 64 bit. Any clues?

Patch not out yet... next few hours...

[Roland]

It's hilarious reading the posts from folks who are ecstatic about this, while obviously having really no idea what it even means.

"OH MAN, TWICE AS MANY BITS! THAT'S LIKE, 32 AS MANY BITS OF ROBOTS!"

[Leviticas]

Sprouticus, on 18 December 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

I have not been on the PC side of things for a while, but if I remember correctly here is how memory works in Windows

32 Bit:
Max of 4 gb of memory used by the OS + all process
However, you graphics card counted against that memory total, so if you have a 1 gb graphics card you would only use 3 Gb for the processes

64 bit
Home Basic- 8 GB for OS plus all processes
Home Premium- 16 Gb
higher than that 192 Gb

HOWEVER,

when running 32 bit apps, that process is limited to 4 Gb of space. Unlike a 32 bit OS, the graphics card does not count against that limit as long as you have more memory. In addition, iother 32 bit processes (OS, TS, Firefox, etc) can each use 4 gb of space, and 64 bi process can use the entire memory space. this means the 4 Gb is not shared like a 32 bit OS. For this reason 8Gb minimum is your best bet for a 64 bit Windows OS

when running a 64 bit app, the process can utilize all available memory. up to the limits above.


What this means re: 64 bit MWO.

If you have >4Gb memory and a 64 bit OS, AND you are not using all the rest of the memory for your graphics card, the Os, and other process, you should see more memory utilization.


Example: (numbers are made up, but not unreasonable)
8 Gb x64 machine:

Graphics card mapping: 1 gb
OS: 512 Mb
TS: 50 Mb
AV- 25 Mb
other apps- 125 Mb

This leaves 8Gb -1 Gb - 750 Mb = 6,25 Gb free space.

since MWO runs as a single process app,
32 bit MWO can only use 4 gb of the free memory.
64 bit MWO can use all 6.25 Gb of the memory

yes thats right. The other advantage is the packet size as well. when you are running 64 bit the information can be sent in large packets and a 64 bit processor can process more information faster.

[DevilCrayon]

Roland, on 18 December 2014 - 12:31 PM, said:

It's hilarious reading the posts from folks who are ecstatic about this, while obviously having really no idea what it even means.

"OH MAN, TWICE AS MANY BITS! THAT'S LIKE, 32 AS MANY BITS OF ROBOTS!"

I'm pretty excited to be able to use more of than ~1/3 of my 16GB of ram.

[Flapdrol]

64 bit is good news, means the game can leak to memory all day long without crashing.

[Roland]

DevilCrayon, on 18 December 2014 - 12:36 PM, said:

I'm pretty excited to be able to use more of than ~1/3 of my 16GB of ram.

Well, assuming you are actually doing other things on your computer, you're probably still using more of your ram anyway.

This would really only impact the amount of memory used by MWO itself...which, really, probably shouldn't be needing more than the amount of memory that can be allocated to a 32 bit process anyway.

But hey, whatever. I just find the reaction of some folks funny.

[Jabilo]

Roland, on 18 December 2014 - 12:31 PM, said:

It's hilarious reading the posts from folks who are ecstatic about this, while obviously having really no idea what it even means.

"OH MAN, TWICE AS MANY BITS! THAT'S LIKE, 32 AS MANY BITS OF ROBOTS!"

It's not what it means now, it's what it can mean in the future.

Ultimately it's the same game code in a different environment and one that's untested and experimental. Performance if anything is likely to be worse - right now.

What it represents is a commitment from the devs to expand, modernise and work on engine performance and features. It is a commitment which to date has been severely lacking - just look a the frame drops and performance issues this game has had from day one.

It is step one of a long road, which could ultimately lead to a hell of a lot of cool things. Larger, more detailed maps and environments. Quicker load times both in to maps and back to mech lab. Faster performance.

If they are prepared to look at things like a 64 bit client now, what will they be prepared to look at in the future. Direct X 12? Mantle? High res texture packs?

It shows they have a long term technical vision and that IS something to get excited about.

[Klantic]

I, for one, am super excited about this update. I'm waiting to unleash the potential of my machine!

~Klantic

[Sprouticus]

Roland, on 18 December 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

Well, assuming you are actually doing other things on your computer, you're probably still using more of your ram anyway.

This would really only impact the amount of memory used by MWO itself...which, really, probably shouldn't be needing more than the amount of memory that can be allocated to a 32 bit process anyway.

But hey, whatever. I just find the reaction of some folks funny.

Depends on how the MWO coding works.. If more memory allows for keeping more graphical info (probably not) or battle state (quite possible). info in memory, then it could be useful, and is certainly better than paging. If not, then yea, minimal impact. If I remember correctly, it is much cheaper to page a graphical element to RAM than it is to page it to disk. Just not sure if that is really the case in MWO.

Edited by Sprouticus, 18 December 2014 - 01:07 PM.

[Roland]

Sprouticus, on 18 December 2014 - 01:07 PM, said:

Depends on how the MWO coding works.. If more memory allows for keeping more graphical info (probably not) or battle state (quite possible). info in memory, then it could be useful, and is certainly better than paging. If not, then yea, minimal impact. If I remember correctly, it is much cheaper to page a graphical element to RAM than it is to page it to disk. Just not sure if that is really the case in MWO.

Yes, any time you can pull stuff from memory, it's an order of magnitude faster than going to disk. But I don't believe that MWO is pushing the memory cap imposed by 32 bit processes currently.

Whatever though. What you'll see with this change is that the memory footprint will likely go up by a bit. I wouldn't expect any real change in how things operate. You may see new bugs if some of the code is especially messy.

Like I said, it's not bad or anything. The response from some folks was just funny.

[Sprouticus]

Roland, on 18 December 2014 - 01:19 PM, said:

Yes, any time you can pull stuff from memory, it's an order of magnitude faster than going to disk. But I don't believe that MWO is pushing the memory cap imposed by 32 bit processes currently.

Whatever though. What you'll see with this change is that the memory footprint will likely go up by a bit. I wouldn't expect any real change in how things operate. You may see new bugs if some of the code is especially messy.

Like I said, it's not bad or anything. The response from some folks was just funny.

similar to Dx11, if the game is not optimized for it, it won't help. Im not a coder, but Im guessing the memory foot print statement would be right deneding on how the memory paging works in 64 bit apps. There may just be a lot of empty memory pages.

but Jabilo does have a point about this being a good omen for future back end changes that WILL have more value.

[MauttyKoray]

I could cry right now. I've got a 64 bit Ivy Core with 8GB of RAM and I can't wait to make full use of it.

Edited by MauttyKoray, 18 December 2014 - 01:29 PM.

[nehebkau]

Kinda wish we could have tested this on the public test servers... or am I missing something? BTW my 32 GB eagerly awaits being consumed by roboty goodness.

Edited by nehebkau, 18 December 2014 - 01:36 PM.

[Ian Drsaurri]

If the game was designed as a game that only utilizes the amount of RAM in a 32 bit system then why are you making a 64 bit client. Are you going to redo the engine to utilize all the RAM because i have 16 GB RAM

[Heffay]

Ian Drsaurri, on 18 December 2014 - 01:50 PM, said:

If the game was designed as a game that only utilizes the amount of RAM in a 32 bit system then why are you making a 64 bit client. Are you going to redo the engine to utilize all the RAM because i have 16 GB RAM

Probably to release the 4096x4096 texture packs for the mechs. Heck, even increasing them to 2048x2048 would be a huge increase in the amount of memory the client will use, but make a dramatic improvement in the visual quality.

[Deathlike]

XenonCx, on 17 December 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:

I tried to install Visual C++ 2010 from the link provided but it told me a newer version is already installed. Any reason why you aren't linking to the newest version? Will it cause any issues?

It's smarter to use the SP1 versions of the redistributable (bugs usually come to mind).
http://www.microsoft...s.aspx?id=13523

You're already using the x86 (32-bit) versions for the game as it is (best to use SP1 as well on that too).
http://www.microsoft...ls.aspx?id=8328

Expect more memory usage naturally (using 64-bit will consume more memory, but you should have more than 4GB of RAM in the first place), but there "should" be a decent boost CPU wise... realistically small gains at a minimum.

Don't expect it to be a miracle patch unless it dramatically improves things for you.

Edited by Deathlike, 18 December 2014 - 02:04 PM.

[Void2258]

VictusRhul, on 18 December 2014 - 12:03 PM, said:

I ran the patch and the option does not appear in the gear box. I uninstalled the whole thing and downloaded the client from the web site. Reinstalled clean and patched. Still no gear box option to run 64 bit. Any clues? I know this is xperimental but just wondering if there is something else I need to do?
Both the Xdiag and C++ installs said what was loaded is current or newer than what was downloaded.
Any advise would be appreciated.

Patch is not deployed yet.