79 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

HARDKOR, on 22 January 2015 - 03:06 PM, said:

Um Warhippy... that "IF" you refer to is determined by you guys.

My initial point was, that if you want a bunch of money and really fun gams, come fight us and actually fight us. Win or lose you'll make hella bank, and have a good time fighting fun people who don't trash talk you when they win and don't complain when they lose. Hell, we rarely field more than 4 9S's in a whole CW game and have guys that only own mediums.

Or, you could run by us once, make about the same as you make fighting turrets, and send us back to fight clan wolf, where it's pugtastic most of the time and we make 500-800k a game.

Right below you is someone complaining that we often run waves on attrition only. I suspect that the only tactic some people respect is losing; if we're not losing we're either cheating or being evil and sneaky and manipulative.

We all want paid; the issue right now, and I hate to be blunt, is that Marik is a bigger issue for us than Liao. They're very good, very organized and very persistent. If we're dropping on Liao it's generally in a rush because we need to get some wins ground out there before going back to fight Marik. Also when we do go attrition we get told we're trying to 'stall'. Insane given that it's in situations where we're clearly going to win, we're just wanting to make a fight out of it.

Dunno what to tell you. Love your attitude on it; we both want good fights. Not all your faction agrees though.

[Chef Kerensky]

WarHippy, on 22 January 2015 - 09:44 AM, said:

Playing by attrition is fine and I have no problem with people doing that, but you and a couple of others are going on and on about making money when that is what the normal queue is for.

When the most effective method of play as attackers results in extremely small payouts while the most effective method of play as defenders results in massive payouts, the impetus is on the developers to look into tweaking things until they're just right, either by providing a victory-based incentive for attackers to engage defenders rather than rush past them or by tweaking other factors until A. you're making bank for playing well instead of playing ineffectively and B. playing the game the most "efficient" way is actually fun.

Thankfully PGI seems to recognize some of these things are an issue, hence why they haven't taken the "beta" sticker off of their new toy yet.

Edited by ChefGerstmann, 22 January 2015 - 10:08 PM.

[Chef Kerensky]

Lance425, on 22 January 2015 - 10:10 AM, said:

It's also the cheesiest most BS way of winning. Hence, why I haven't dropped in CW in weeks. Playing a game is about winning, but being a human being is realizing when you are making the game miserable for everyone you are playing against.

Just my 2 cents and good luck with the rest of your drops.

For that matter, zerg rushing isn't particularly fun or interesting in terms of gameplay either. There's something to be said for the thrill of successfully speeding past unprepared defenders, but it's not much fun when you get cut down without putting up a fight against the people shooting you, and conversely I don't think it's very much fun as a defender to shoot people who aren't actually paying attention to you and are single-mindedly sprinting towards the objectives as fast as they can.

[Chef Kerensky]

Really I think the solution lies somewhere in the strategies that other PVP games use to balance attack and defense objectives: make the defender respawns significantly longer than those of the attackers so that killing defenders isn't actually a detriment to your objective (blowing up the gun - you know, the one right next to their respawn location). To prevent games from ending in a single successful push, there ought to be multiple hurdles for attackers to jump through - progress across the map should be slow and gradual rather than a mad dash from one side to another.

Just look at team-based games like Battlefield 1942 and the capture point mode in Team Fortress 2. None of these games feature a single, hard-to-reach attack objective placed on the far side of the map, because that's dumb and either offers poor feedback for attackers who are struggling to push their way through a well-played defense, or it results in defenders being overwhelmed by an insane zerg rush that ends the game about five minutes after it starts.

[WarHippy]

HARDKOR, on 22 January 2015 - 03:06 PM, said:

Um Warhippy... that "IF" you refer to is determined by you guys.

My initial point was, that if you want a bunch of money and really fun gams, come fight us and actually fight us. Win or lose you'll make hella bank, and have a good time fighting fun people who don't trash talk you when they win and don't complain when they lose. Hell, we rarely field more than 4 9S's in a whole CW game and have guys that only own mediums.

Or, you could run by us once, make about the same as you make fighting turrets, and send us back to fight clan wolf, where it's pugtastic most of the time and we make 500-800k a game.

Are you guys deliberately trying to be dense? I have no problem with attrition battles in fact I rather enjoy them, but if you are trying to earn c-bills CW is not and efficient way to do it regardless of how you play the battles. Yes, you can make 500-800k per game of CW and it looks awesome, but in the same amount of time it took you to find and play one of those games you could have played 3-5 normal games at 200-300k each. Even then you are not always going to get an attrition battle in CW since zerging is common. The point is CW is not a good place to earn c-bills efficiently and that is all I have been saying this entire damn time. I get that for a lot of people it is more fun to slug it out, and I don't disagree, but I was pointing out the absurdity of the people in here looking at CW as some sort of cash cow when it is nothing of the sort regardless of how you play the games.

[HARDKOR]

I have no illusions that it's a cash cow, but I'm not putting up with it for free either. Longer waits, more stress, more greifing, craploads of lag and low FPS... no way I'm doing that for 100k
(especially if it's going to involve 200k in consumables)

Edited by HARDKOR, 23 January 2015 - 08:50 AM.

[WarHippy]

HARDKOR, on 23 January 2015 - 08:47 AM, said:

I have no illusions that it's a cash cow, but I'm not putting up with it for free either. Longer waits, more stress, more greifing, craploads of lag and low FPS... no way I'm doing that for 100k
(especially if it's going to involve 200k in consumables)

Fair enough. I can respect that. I just couldn't understand the insistence that CW was the be all end all of making c-bills when it really isn't very good for making a lot of c-bills when compared to other options.

[Gorgo7]

WarHippy, on 23 January 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

Fair enough. I can respect that. I just couldn't understand the insistence that CW was the be all end all of making c-bills when it really isn't very good for making a lot of c-bills when compared to other options.

That's interesting. When dropping for Liao (provided we can actually get a twelve man together) we drop almost immediately.
When that game ends we drop almost immediately again. I easily make 1.2 million an hour.
Are you telling me you can do the same? Pugging? or are you 12 man the pug que?
I don't win 80-90% of the matches I play in the PUG que I win 55% according to my stats. So I don't make the money.

Please elaborate. HARDKOR only relates what most people in CW Liao see these days. HUGE PAYOUTS.

[Faith McCarron]

Precisely, Gorgo. I can get drops almost immediately in CW unless it's dead on the Liao border and I'm trying to kickstart things. An average pug drop on CW nets me 500k easy, an average unit drop nets me 750k a match. If I'm on my game, a unit match will net me 1m a match, that's 2 million per hour. I don't think that's a bad earning rate, and CW matches are FAR more fun.

[WARCRACK]

The Battle for Capella is on!

[MingTheMerciless]

Yup in the queue - unless I get picked up by a group before I drop! Let's go!

[MingTheMerciless]

Good match just now, another win on Capella. Dropped with mixed unit of LIAO that had also HLGK, WHM and others. We all jumped onto the houseliaovoice.com TS server and coordinated from there. Hellebore Springs it was.

Good coordination, calm voice comms and some focused fire pushed the Davs back. First wave we were 10-0 up but then stalled badly and retreated back to the gate to regroup and then pushed again.

SickBoy was on a rampage.



Go, Liao, go.

Edited by WaiMingLee, 12 February 2015 - 03:47 PM.

[ShinVector]

For Capella NA Timezone !! GOO !!

[zeninsight]

Arghh still stuck in office.. wanna get a hold on capella

[vettie]

Faith McCarron, on 24 January 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

Precisely, Gorgo. I can get drops almost immediately in CW unless it's dead on the Liao border and I'm trying to kickstart things. An average pug drop on CW nets me 500k easy, an average unit drop nets me 750k a match. If I'm on my game, a unit match will net me 1m a match, that's 2 million per hour. I don't think that's a bad earning rate, and CW matches are FAR more fun.

Not sure about Liao, so I can not comment either way, BUT, some factions receive MORE pay than others.
As a Merc, our unit receives 50k per pilot and something like65 loyalty pts per match....

Bottom line is, pay is different depending on faction, so some factions make healthy pay days in CW. some make average pay.
For the average pay, Zerg or Turret matches dont net you much...

In our case, playing for the pay is NOT why we do CW. It like Forest Gump - a box of chocolates - never know what we are going to get, Zerg, turrert match or a real battle... We play CW just for the fun...

[ShinVector]

vettie, on 13 February 2015 - 09:00 AM, said:

In our case, playing for the pay is NOT why we do CW. It like Forest Gump - a box of chocolates - never know what we are going to get, Zerg, turrert match or a real battle... We play CW just for the fun...

I think you are mistaking a number of us Liao 'Loyalist' as Mercs.
Anyway salvaging Davion mechs is far better 'Pay.'

[wanderer]

Quote

SickBoy was on a rampage.

That's much more what I expected from him. I was concerned considering the last time I ended up on drops, he was getting 200ish damage at times for all 4 'Mechs.

[_____]

We still don't have quite the numbers to take over planets during NA times. I saw a lot of activity on Capella during NA evening hours but could not push it over 50%. Probably up to the TCAF to take it over again...

[Maxwell Albritten]

BlackhawkSC, on 13 February 2015 - 11:40 AM, said:

We still don't have quite the numbers to take over planets during NA times. I saw a lot of activity on Capella during NA evening hours but could not push it over 50%. Probably up to the TCAF to take it over again...

We had at times 4 companies dropping, but the Davs kept finding just 1 more group than us. Sucks for them because they let Kurita take a planet nearly uncontested

I have also noticed a small influx of new CW players. This is a good thing. Let us take them under our wing and show them the way to most exterminate and destroy Davrats.

[Grynos]

BlackhawkSC, on 13 February 2015 - 11:40 AM, said:

We still don't have quite the numbers to take over planets during NA times. I saw a lot of activity on Capella during NA evening hours but could not push it over 50%. Probably up to the TCAF to take it over again...

I am hoping that WoL returns back to Liao after our time with Marik concludes. But I am just a peon and in no position to makes those decisions...

I will say the bacon flavored millet is making me fat though.

Maxwell Albritten, on 13 February 2015 - 11:46 AM, said:

We had at times 4 companies dropping, but the Davs kept finding just 1 more group than us. Sucks for them because they let Kurita take a planet nearly uncontested

I have also noticed a small influx of new CW players. This is a good thing. Let us take them under our wing and show them the way to most exterminate and destroy Davrats.

Like I said to you last night maxwell, they had numbers due to the fact that Marik was not attacking the Davion front at all...