68 replies to this topic

[Kjudoon]

Quote

I think it's safe to assume you won't be getting a free island cockpit item.

Thank God!

Thanks for the laugh too.

[Bleary]

The way that CW is designed and the CW queue set up, it definitely gives an edge to the small fraction of the player population who can fully outfit 4 'Mech with modules and have enough people on their contact list to drop in big groups.

But . . .the solution, as said, is 'don't play CW'. Not play CW and screw all of your teammates whenever you see a 12-man.

Edited by Bleary, 08 March 2015 - 11:40 PM.

[anonymous161]

jeirhart, on 08 March 2015 - 10:04 PM, said:

I was there for at least one of the games in question. [The Guy Who Left] initially said when we saw the enemy that we were going to be slaughtered, then when I called for the team to take up defensive positions (so as to not be poked to death) and let the enemy come in so we could kill them, he said the following and left:




In case you were curious, this is how the battle turned out:

[Recated]

Yup that it alright, we had one good wave, but then it degenerated very fast.

Something really needs to be done about balancing.


You should be heavily penalized for quitting like this. I can understand where the quitter comes from but it still not right to screw your team over, both the guys that left could have made a big difference.

Edited by GM Patience, 19 March 2015 - 03:35 PM.
name and shame

[Joseph Mallan]

Ngamok, on 08 March 2015 - 07:45 PM, said:

So you suggest that everyone play in a 12 man in CW? I bolded the part you said.

Or just accept it is going to happen cause CW is where the feces impacts the horizontal impeller.

[anonymous161]

Apparently a lot of other topics like this only it's them complaining about clans be op.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

I've seen people legitimately sitting around and doing nothing but suiciding in CW so that the enemy team can win.

[anonymous161]

Which confuses me...they gain nothing from it. I see this all the time when playing halo reach, your own team will betray you until they get booted...Why waste your time?

[Mudhutwarrior]

Here is the thing, I went into CW and saw what it was all about. It took some heavy investment to build a decent drop deck.

It was a waste of time for a pug. No doubt about it.

Best thing anyone can do is not go there and let the groups have it for themselves. As you can see your clearly not welcome there so why go where your not invited.

The best part is it will die a slow death because the groups will get bored having to slug it out against other good players and come to solo to farm. They all do right now.

At least if we abandon CW it will die and PGI will invest in Solo more understanding that catering to moms basement boys will get them no where in the long run.

[Sjorpha]

I'm not sure there is any way to balance pug vs premade games since the only advantage the premade really has is coordination and more good players.

You can balance by divorcing the pugs from the groups like in the public ques, but there is no sensible way to actually balance the matches themselves. And CW can't handle splitting the players.

Something very promising I've seen as a CW defense strategy on the clan side lately is "pug whispering", which is experienced players from units deliberately dropping with pugs alone or in pairs to lead and coordinate their defense against big groups. It works, I've seen pugs suddenly act as a unit under the leadership of good officers. This creates much more fun matches than the regular stomping of disorganised clan pugs.

Maybe there could be some kind of framework and reward system for experienced players willing to lead pugs? If you qualify as officer for your faction through some signup and trial process you could choose to be dropped with pugs with a special tag and automatic leadership status, but you'd be expected to lead when you do and not doing so would demote you.

Edited by Sjorpha, 11 March 2015 - 04:03 AM.

[ROSS-128]

Mudhutwarrior, on 11 March 2015 - 03:48 AM, said:

Here is the thing, I went into CW and saw what it was all about. It took some heavy investment to build a decent drop deck.

It was a waste of time for a pug. No doubt about it.

Best thing anyone can do is not go there and let the groups have it for themselves. As you can see your clearly not welcome there so why go where your not invited.

The best part is it will die a slow death because the groups will get bored having to slug it out against other good players and come to solo to farm. They all do right now.

At least if we abandon CW it will die and PGI will invest in Solo more understanding that catering to moms basement boys will get them no where in the long run.

Well, I've done at least semi-decently pugging around in CW, as at the moment I'm hopping faction to faction to pick up free mechbays from the first two loyalty ranks, and then grab whatever I can before my 7 day contract expires.

That said, I did take the time to build a mostly complete drop deck first. I don't have anything Mastered yet, but everything in my deck is Basiced at a bare minimum and usually 2-3 of them are Elited. Even Basic and Elite make a huge difference in how a mech plays. The only trial mech I've used was the Firestarter back when it was on trial, and well, it's a Firestarter. Now I've got an elited Raven 4X for light rushes (sure it's no Firestarter, but I picked it up while eliting my Raven set and it has jumpjets) and a Cicada 2B for when I don't need JJs in my light slot.

The backbone of my deck has always been an elited Hunchback 4P and an elited Banshee 3M. Since the trial rotation I haven't been able to take a second 4P like I used to, but the IS tonnage buff lets me take a Thunderbolt 5SS instead.

Is it an ideal, 100% meta, completely mastered deck with full moduels? No, far from it. But it's got decently solid mechs that I am comfortable playing and perform well in, and that the enemy is usually reluctant to push against.

In general, if I manage to get into a queue with an 8 man unit group or larger I will probably win (there's no such thing as a guarantee of course, but the odds are pretty decent). If I queue with a 6 man unit group it's a bit of a tossup depending on how the other 5 pugs do and who we're facing. Queue with a complete pug group and it's usually a wash, unless we're holding the base on Counterattack (AKA easymode) or the opposition is also pugs. Sometimes I'll accidentally carry one of those games, but it kind of comes down to luck and who the enemy is.

No matter how well or poorly we do, I'll generally rake in a decent amount thanks to doing ~1k damage (usually a kill or two and several assists+most damage done) on bad games and 3k+ on good games (~5-11 kills, 15-30 assists, lots of destroyed components and most damage bonuses). Pretty much the only times I've done less than 1k damage were when my team got facerolled so hard that I might as well have been the only mech on the team (ie multiple people die with <100 damage total at the end of the match).

So the secret to successful CW pugging is:
1: Have at least a 3/4 complete deck with at least Basic efficiencies, as long as the trial you use to fill the 4th slot is *known* to be good, though even so with no efficiencies you should probably avoid actually dropping it until you really need to (ie it's your last mech, or you specifically need that weight class for a specific tactic like Steiner Scout Lance or Light Rush).

2: Look around in the queues for groups of 6+ waiting in line (a bar in the "6" column or higher, avoid full "1" columns unless you can see you're going to get Counter Attack). 8+ is ideal.

3: Be polite, use VOIP. Correct use of VOIP causes people to magically perform better by making them more aware of what's going on. Call out good targets and vulnerable components: your team might not have that Dire Wolf targeted, they might not know his CT is cherry red. Throwing a tantrum and raging at your team degrades their performance, causing them to do worse. Telling your team they're doing well or alright also mysteriously causes them to start doing even better, no idea why.

4: Fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals. Drop in good mechs with good loadouts. Torso twist. Focus components. Manage your heat. Use override (but don't blow yourself up unless you're about to die anyway). Lead with ballistics/PPCs. Track with lasers. AIM. Put UAVs and arty in good places. Dropping arty on a deathball that's trying to push a chokepoint (gates, narrow valleys, Death Valley on Boreal) works wonders for killing a push, especially against pugs. Try to avoid blocking teammates' movement. Do pushes as a team. Don't conga-line. Know when to switch between ECM and ECCM (and how, it's J by default). All these basic little things that apply in every battle and every situation.

Edit: Oh, and if you're a large Unit that wants to see more productivity out of your faction's pugs, provide the 8+ groups for them to join. Just drop in groups of 8-11 and use chat/VOIP to bring the pugs up to speed on how you plan to approach the match. Leadership and support will usually cause pugs to play better, plus they act as cannon fodder/TAA/padding to help your unit spread itself across more fights.

Edited by E Rommel, 11 March 2015 - 10:12 AM.

[Varvar86]

I'm a random PUG. I don’t have 12+ friends to crate unit. I have enough lovely upgraded and customized mechs for join a faction and not bringing trial mechs into drop ship. I join CW and facing 10/12 man units 7 times out of 10 drops. Every unit meet ends in defeat. Sometimes fast, sometimes slow and very painful. But I never ever won against units. I sure that If there any wins/loses statistics collecting on servers it should be somewhere around “random PUGS vs Units – 1/100+”.
Even with all that voip implemented and paid champions mechs, etc. – random people will never compete against disciplined premaid units.

How It happens:
I drop against Unit, (worst of met VRGD , PHL, others) and getting ***** in all possible ways, whatever our “team” tries to do, during 20+ minutes painful round. In result I get completely wasted time. I play 2,4,6 of such matches, I make a break play some basic solo drops, later I return CW – join and again see 10+ men clan. YES I quit! I admit! Who wants to be ***** every single game? Nobody!
I return CW after day or two, play few good matches against same randoms as myself. If planet is valuable or there is not many planets to choose from - units came. And all starts again. Last few weeks I usually stop playing CW immediately after Unit start attacking/defending planet. I also noticed that after unit comes to planet people start leaving thequeue on that planet so I’m not the only one.

For now CW suffering of this matchmaking pretty bad.
My vision:
Units fights on full scale CW maps with orbital cannons and “staff” on the planet surface, gets tons of loyalty points and all the glory they acheaved.
Random PUGS drops on he orbital bases over the planet surface (moon base looklike), or on the near asteroids bases, moon bases or small surface fort posts. This is smaller maps, with maximum 20 min. time limits, less rewards, and twice amount capture/defeat slots to complete or defend the base/fort post.
Being a solo PUG I’m completely understand and agree with such outline. If you want to play best and meet skillful enemies, won the best prizes and loyalty - than play unit on high level. If you are not ready, and don’t have time and possibilities for that (like me) and just want to enjoy the game – here is your game mode, its less glory and less money, but this is your choice. That’s how I wish it to be.

Sorry for mistakes if any. English is not my native.

Edited by Varvar86, 11 March 2015 - 08:57 AM.

[Black Ivan]

The problem I see is that new players start CW in the wrong image it is a galactic conquest fun game.
It is not, it was made by PGI for the units and the other players are just there to fill the gaps. So the experience for them is very bad.

I agree with previous poster that hrere needs to be a CW alternative for PUG games.

[LiquidLlama]

KraftySOT, on 08 March 2015 - 08:57 PM, said:

-several snips-

Wait, wait, waitwaitwaitwait... wait.

So unless I spend real money (aside from Premium Time, which I do) to purchase things that have zero real value, I shouldn't be able to play half the game which I'm spending real money (again, Premium Time) to help support?

I, um... I'm not sure I agree with that.

I've argued this several times, and why I continue to, I have no idea. Yes, I get roflstomped 8.5 out of 10 times in CW. Yes, I bring Trial 'Mechs because A) I've only been playing for about 3 weeks, and 2) have only ground out 3 'Mechs. I try to be as team player and not useless as possible, but sometimes **** just goes wrong. However, in your opinion, I should be beaten with my keyboard, and my PC thrown out the window?

Really?

REALLY?!

E Rommel, on 11 March 2015 - 07:24 AM, said:

Well, I've done at least semi-decently pugging around in CW, as at the moment I'm hopping faction to faction to pick up free mechbays from the first two loyalty ranks, and then grab whatever I can before my 7 day contract expires.

Also, this is a great way to pick up a couple of extra 'Mech bays.

Edited by LiquidLlama, 11 March 2015 - 09:59 AM.

[KraftySOT]

Really there should be an achievement like the 1% (Richer than Blake) award that you have to get, before you "graduate" to CW.

[Iskareot]

Darth Bane001, on 08 March 2015 - 07:24 PM, said:

Yes I understand playing against 12 mans can pretty much mean you lose automatically it sucks but I dont see that as an excuse to just quit the match before it's really begun.

Had 2 guys tell the team good luck not facing against a 12 team...if you dont want to face them why bother launching a map without one? All you do is hurt our own experience and you will be reported.

If this trend keeps up there will be no point in playing cw. This needs to be addressed in my opinion as fewer and fewer will want to play it thus making it pointless in being in the game.

FYI not against the rules to quit a game.. if it was then they would remove the exit match button. ALSO I would add I have done this... seen many do it... I love being IS but sometimes when you see how bad your team is... and you see that there is no point at all wasting the time to finish its just better to leave. This way all the CW clanners get thier content.. they had thier fun and we can at least not waste time.

A few things could help this... since 99% of the time we are nothing more then content for the CW... they need to give us Cbills.. gxp... something.. instead of nothing but loss. We go in.. see things we know it will be imbalanced and horrid yet we get nothing even after the drop to say -- "Yeah you know you will lose and get ****** but here is some CBILLs so we can let the CW clanners have content to shoot"..... something.

There really is no point for most ... it's a big time sink and does nothing for your stats, mechs.... even the fun is taken away when the score is like 48 to zip... BUT of course you dont know that becasue you have won one.. --

*For the record I played 25 matches.. I recorded them all... just to prove a point.. my team lost 24 out of 25. We won the one because the other team had a full lance leave and then one other left midway through. So yeah... IS is my fav but the pug fill CW drops are horrid with no game modifier or something its just a waste of time.

KraftySOT, on 11 March 2015 - 10:09 AM, said:

Really there should be an achievement like the 1% (Richer than Blake) award that you have to get, before you "graduate" to CW.

Great idea - even better make it harder. Time in game.. add in even a min 1.0 kdr something...

[Almond Brown]

Joseph Mallan, on 09 March 2015 - 01:40 AM, said:

Or just accept it is going to happen cause CW is where the feces impacts the horizontal impeller.

Funnily enough, by the time it gets to that point in any CW Match, most of the "time being wasted" has been already passed. What's left, Win or Lose, is just a mere fraction of the whole. If one gets that far, only to bail, isn't really a gamer at all. Just a sore Loser who hasn't even lost but wants to assure everyone else on the Team gets SFA too.

But then again, that is just me, and I need the space bucks...

Edited by Almond Brown, 11 March 2015 - 10:31 AM.

[Iskareot]

Almond Brown, on 11 March 2015 - 10:28 AM, said:

Funnily enough, by the time it gets to that point in any CW Match, most of the "time being wasted" has been already passed. What's left, Win or Lose, is just a mere fraction of the whole. If one gets that far, only to bail, isn't really a gamer at all. Just a sore Loser who hasn't even lost but wants to assure everyone else on the Team gets SFA too.

But then again, that is just me, and I need the space bucks...

There is a difference between knowing you are going to lose before you start and being a sore loser... you actually would have had a chance to win... to know what it is to lose... but when you see nothing but loss... losing becomes boring.. nothing to look forward to in the end. Like I said.. give the content... (sheep) something at least.. bonus Cbills something...

[Tool Box]

KraftySOT, on 08 March 2015 - 08:51 PM, said:

You should have to pay 1,000,000 XP off of 4 mechs before you can bring them into CW. Trial mechs being in your dropdeck makes me want to take your PC and throw it out of a window.

1,000,000 xp is a little too hefty. 100,000 cumulatively off of the 4 mechs in your dop deck would be a little more in line with making sure that you are experienced enough for the oh so try hard community warfare. You have to keep in mind that people would have to grind for quite a few matches in order to get that much experience after mastering a mech variant. It costs 21,500 to master a mech so getting 25,000 per mech after that isn't too bad. Some people just don't have the time to accumulate 1MILLION experience even if it is divided between 4 mechs.

[Almond Brown]

KraftySOT, on 11 March 2015 - 10:09 AM, said:

Really there should be an achievement like the 1% (Richer than Blake) award that you have to get, before you "graduate" to CW.

Yeah! Let's call it "I hate everyone else that isn't ME and my E-Peen"

Surely everyone will spend big bucks to get one of those pronto. LOL!

[Jon Gotham]

PurpleNinja, on 08 March 2015 - 09:10 PM, said:

Not saying that's OK to quit, but what's the point of playing against an attacking IS 12 man group.
99.9% sure that it will be a light rush.

I'm adding a couple of streak boats to my deck for that purpose-if it keeps up, I'm gonna have me some fun:)