53 replies to this topic

[Ralmer]

Koshirou, on 24 March 2015 - 02:53 AM, said:

1. Cbills only. I don't feel like spending hundreds of Euros on the game. I already spent more on it than I would pay to purchase an AAA title.

I don't think that is what "only" means...

[Khereg]

Greyhart, on 24 March 2015 - 04:30 AM, said:

The amount per match was for simple calculation purposes.

Your estimate is pretty good, although I think it's more like $75k/match unless you're getting champion or premium time bonuses or are a pretty skilled player. Also, in the solo queue you can reasonably expect about 5 matches per hour. You can get a little more by using 2 mechs and hopping out as soon as you die to get into the other mech. You might get up to 7 matches an hour doing this, but it is a true grind.

So, all together, about $400k - $1 Million c-bills earned per hour of play time is pretty reasonable. I'd use $500k/hr as a starting point and adjust based on your personal performance.

As someone else mentioned, using consumables really cuts into that, so if you're grinding for c-bills, I'd avoid them. They can be a bit of a crutch in the solo queue anyway. Save them for when it matters (CW or group play when you care more about winning).

For the original question - I'm all c-bills except for new content that is only available using MC. Buying the packages isn't crazy expensive when broken down by # of chassis received: for example, the $120 clan pack gets you 12 mechs (4 mechs w/ 3 variants each), plus, if bought early you often receive a bonus mech plus more free goodies (custom colors and/or camo patterns, warhorns, etc.). That's $10/mech plus some extra's. Not awful.

Besides, once you invest and have 4 mechs to work with, you'll find by the time you elite them all you'll have plenty of c-bills to go buy another chassis and work it up. The initial investment sets you up for quicker future success.

One other aside for decent uses of MC include converting mech XP to GXP. Once you've levelled up a particular mech chassis fully, if you keep playing it (because now it's awesome, yo), you'll start getting a surplus of mech XP on it that can't be used on other mechs. On the surface, this seems like a waste. However...

If you're in a hurry to level up a new chassis, you can convert your surplus mech XP to GXP and use that GXP to buy the first tier of skills on a chassis for about 14,000 GXP or so. I do this when I want to add a new mech to my deck for CW and don't have the time to grind out the mech XP to make it decent. The conversion price goes on sale now and again, I'd advise doing the conversion then and holding the GXP until you need it.

Edited by Khereg, 24 March 2015 - 07:51 AM.

[Voivode]

Both.

For standard mechs I have purchased almost exclusively with CBills as there really isn't much reason, besides impatience, to purchase those with MC.

Hero mechs, mech bays, and premium time are all worth some MC if you plan to play the game often and stick with it for a while. I've got two years in and still enjoy it so the investment in mech bays and hero mechs has been worthwhile from my perspective.

[Kyynele]

I have at the moment 159 mechs. I've bought the heroes with MC, Phoenix, Wave 1 & 2 packages with real money, and rest with C-Bills. The number also includes a handful of free mechs from events.

If you have somewhat lots of time to play the game, like I have had, premium time (30+ days) is likely much better bang for buck than buying regular mechs for MC, even if they're on sale.

I'd recommend trying to get as many mech bays from events as possible, they seem to be featured as a prize in most events. Mech bays are also very convenient for their MC price, and I'd personally rather buy new mechbays than sell mechs to make room for new ones. Especially now that we have quirks, a mech that's not that great today, might be god-tier in 2 weeks, and you can lose millions in selling and rebuying that mech. Been there, done that. Several times.

Going for IS mechs is likely going to be slightly more economical than clan mechs in the long run, since you can move those expensive engines to new chassises and variants, slightly reducing the costs along the way as your collection of engines and weapon systems and such grows.

If you buy XL engines, 255XL, 280XL, 295XL and 300XL are useful ones that go to many builds and are fairly optimal. You have to be bit cautious when buying those, for example 250XL weighs exactly the same as a 255XL, and is thus slower without any advantages whatsoever. The only reason to ever use 250XL on any mech is if it has engine cap exactly at 250, which is rareish. XL engines cost a lot, so later realizing you bought a bad one doesn't feel nice.

GLHF

[Tesunie]

Greyhart, on 24 March 2015 - 02:43 AM, said:

I have a couple of things to ask, but the main one is;

1. Do you find that you mainly use MC or CBills purchase new mechs?

As I figure it you get about 100,000 CBills per match and a reasonable Mech will be about 10 mil CBills.

This means at least playing a hundred games. Doable but is going to take some time. So do the majority of people buy with MC?

2. I am currently thinking of getting a mastery pack. Any suggestions for a new player on which is a good starting point. I'd prefer IS rather than Clan.

3. Is there any good basic guides to CW? Also do you really need to be in group / unit (forgotten the word for it that isn't clan or guild) or is simply PUGing viable. Is there any easy way to look at the various units out there?

4. How does the friends list actually work? I've seen it but seems like it is not the most integrated system.

1. C-bills. Always C-bills. Unless it comes as a bundle and I really like the mechs in the bundle (see Phoenix and Resistance mech bundles), I save my C-bills to buy mechs. (Sometimes I will buy the bundles to support the game and PGI, as I do like this game.)

2. Medium mechs are typically fast enough to forgive a positioning mistake. Same with some heavy mechs. If you are a new player, I'd avoid Assaults as if you get out of position, you are probably dead. Light mechs can be fun, but they can drop quickly sometimes leading to quick deaths. (I don't know what the current mastery packs are at the moment. The Shadowhawk is still a good deal if it's around.)

3. You can PUG in CW, but it's going to be rough doing so. CW is more intended as end game content, designed for the units in the game to have fun. If you want to seriously participate in CW, I'd suggest you join a unit for it. As far as looking for units, there was a subforum for recruiting, but I can't seem to see it anymore. Check out the CW subforums... Or make a new player help thread asking about joining a unit...

4. Friends list on the forums is just an easy way to be able to watch your friends here. In game there is a social tab on the bottom right of your screen (has what looks like several people standing together). With this interface, you can group up with friends, chat with them in game, etc. If you need farther help with this section, just ask.

Edited by Tesunie, 24 March 2015 - 08:30 AM.

[990Dreams]

I use MC if I have any (but I pay through Karma Koin usually), but most of my Mechs I bought with C-Bills.

[Sonny Black]

Koshirou, on 24 March 2015 - 02:53 AM, said:

1. Cbills only. I don't feel like spending hundreds of Euros on the game. I already spent more on it than I would pay to purchase an AAA title.

2. Can't comment on all of them, but for one I would not take the Dragon pack. It's missing the best Dragon variant (1N). The Raven pack looks pretty solid since it contains two chassis you will want to keep (Huginn and 3L), so if you like light Mechs that should work.

3. Not aware of any guides. Joining a group helps a lot, but only if you are actually coordinating on TeamSpeak. House Kurita has its own TeamSpeak server for this purpose, and I assume other houses do as well. This is also the best way to learn, since there is really no introduction or tutorial for CW provided by the game. TeamSpeak groups are going to have experienced players who can clue you in.

4. The most integrated system, it is not indeed. You can only add friends manually by clicking the corresponding button and typing in their names.

Lots of guides

Spike Brave has IMO one of he best.

[Zookeeper Dan]

The only time I have to play is an hour or so between when the baby goes to bed and when I go to bed so grinding for C-Bills would take forever. Plus I'm enjoying the game, I don't mind supporting it with UD$ instead of going to a couple movies a month.

I bought a couple (C) 'mechs with MC, but I made sure to do it when they were on sale and only if they had expensive XL engines that I can switch around. I got a 300XL with the Jenner F(C) and the 255XL in the Shadowhawk 2H(C). These are used in a lot of builds. Other then that I bought the Urbanmech pack when they were offering 3 promotional mechs to go with it. What a deal!

Once I did that initial investment I've found that just by playing to get XP to upgrade mech skills I'm earning enough C-bills that I won't have to spend MC in the future.

[Elizander]

Both for me. I bought mech packs, the occasional standard variant or two when I was too busy, but I also grinded out my two Atlases, my dragons and a bunch of other mechs.

[Koniving]

Greyhart, on 24 March 2015 - 02:43 AM, said:

I have a couple of things to ask, but the main one is;

1. Do you find that you mainly use MC or CBills purchase new mechs?

As I figure it you get about 100,000 CBills per match and a reasonable Mech will be about 10 mil CBills.

This means at least playing a hundred games. Doable but is going to take some time. So do the majority of people buy with MC?

A lot of things determine your earnings. My earnings without premium time or a hero mech can be up to a little over 200,000 (150,000 to 179,000 on average, with lows in the 70,000 to 127,000 range). However I do a number of things to maximize my earnings. You get paid for finding targets, for marking targets for missile bombardments, for staying with your lance [need all 4 in proximity though], for staying around allies, for assists (just hit every enemy once before they die to net this one), many things. Saving other players is a HUGE payout, as are defensive kills (easiest to acquire on Conquest, kill things while defending a capture point; even if you don't do the kill yourself if you hit it within 10 seconds of it dying and you're near a capture point, cha-ching!)

I mainly use cbills for my typical acquisition. I only use MC for Hero mechs. Which they do help when you're pressed for time and need a payday. I'm also guilty of getting mechs through the pre-release program.

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2. I am currently thinking of getting a mastery pack. Any suggestions for a new player on which is a good starting point. I'd prefer IS rather than Clan.

That is a solid jumpstart into the game. I see you're looking into medium and heavy mechs. Sadly I'm unfamiliar with them as I got my 170+ mechs in other ways. So one second.

Hard to say, my favorites of the bunch are in the Stalker, Orion, Highlander and Blackjacks. Stalker and Orion would be the most forgiving in terms of a new player learning the game.

Stalkers are incredibly tanky since when they lose a side torso, a huge amount of surface area becomes a 50% damage reduction (this is true of all mechs but for Stalkers it is huge, like gigantic). The way they walk also makes it nearly impossible to focus their center torso if they keep their speeds up in the 60s. My Misery. My Stalker. More of said Stalker. Roflwalkers.

Orions are like mini Atlases with enough speed to get the heck outta dodge when you need to. So basically an Atlas that you can make a mistake in and still correct yourself. Here's the Orion K. Second match there he's supported by a Roflwalker.

My overall favorite mech is the Heavy Metal, which is the Highlander hero mech. Its hardpoint arrangement basically makes it a Victor at 90 tons instead of 80, and the perfectly even hitbox sizes allow it to take some surprising abuse. It's also a bit bouncy when it runs, which helps to spread damage a bit. Many build for high alpha potential, but I build mine for low heat and high DPS. Let other people shut down as you run circles around them and tear them apart limb from limb. Here's two examples. Commanding the team. Protecting an ally; anti-light, med, heavy.

Blackjacks are my favorite medium. Mini-Jagermechs. XL 180, some ultra AC/5s and a decent amount of ammo. Dakka. Don't know if I'd recommend them to start out, but gotta admit Blackjacks can be fun in two completely different ways. Fast. Slow.

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3. Is there any good basic guides to CW? Also do you really need to be in group / unit (forgotten the word for it that isn't clan or guild) or is simply PUGing viable. Is there any easy way to look at the various units out there?

There are. I'm sure suggestions will come in.

Do you need to be in one? No, not at all. Is it recommended? Yes. Even if just in a group of '2' people, wait times seem to be considerably lessened compared to just being by yourself.

There used to be "Outreach", but it got merged into Community Warfare. This helps. That'll help you find units -- or rather threads by units. Of particular interest if you get a chance to browse the CW threads, are the Kurita-Davion exchanges like "Peace Branch Offering, Olive Type." Some very humorous exchanges go on there; lots of fun semi-role playing trolling / propaganda / general laughs.

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4. How does the friends list actually work? I've seen it but seems like it is not the most integrated system.

Click on the three heads on the bottom right.
An assumingly blank list will come up. "Add friend." Type the name of someone you met. They will get a request. "Add request sent" if you got the name right, and "No player by that name" if you didn't.

After that it's your basic yahoo/skype style message box. Also gives other handy info like mech, and what they are doing. You can arrange to go into matches as a group and such with this.

Good luck!

[bossclan]

I agree with most of these posts that buying champions is silly with MC and that you should not buy regular mechs with MC unless of course its in a mastery pack.
I think the best deals are on the resistance pack and the clan wave 3 pack.
Free to play is a good option though as you can buy almost any mech in the game just simply by grinding out c-bills,you just won't be able to get hero mechs or champions unless there is a special event reward.

[HlynkaCG]

I use CBills almost exclusively, the only thing I spend MC on is Hero Mechs and Colors/Camo Specs

[grendeldog]

I think that it's reasonable to use both. I personally work for my money, and I save most of it because I don't have a consumer lifestyle to the extent that a lot of people do. So if I want to drop some coin on whatever interests me at a given time I'm not going to feel bad about that. I wouldn't recommend buying individual mechs though with MC, as packs seem to be a much better deal, especially when you count the mech bays, the premium time, etc.

On the other hand you've always got C-bills coming in so there's no reason not to spend them. In my case I decided I wanted to try out some of the mechs that are highly recommended but that aren't in the list of trial mechs, like the Hunch and the Jager. So I went ahead and got the Hunch mastery pack.

I do think that PGI really needs to put the clan mechs - at least the first wave - out as mastery packs on a per mech basis. Firstly, from their own point of view I believe people are more likely to buy when the cost is in mech credits instead of dollars or pounds, because it helps divorce the purchase from the idea that you're spending actual money. And second, I would rather be able to select what I prefer to pay for without going for $50 a la carte.

I'm personally saving up C-bills to finish out my Stormcrow trio for elite and mastery upgrades. After that replacing some weapons on my Timber and.customizing the Jager's engine and armaments.

Anyhow, ask yourself how long you think you'll be playing the game, and then how much that entertainment is worth. If it's worth a reasonable amount of cash, grab that amount of MC or the closest amount for sale. If not, grind those C-bills. While I've heard plenty of people claim that the game is designed so you much spend real money, I don't buy that argument when there's so much spent on things that don't impact gameplay. That's only my opinion, and you're welcome to come to your own conclusions, this is just my two cents.

[Zordicron]

I will respond to this with more than just tales of my 150+ mechs.

You are new. There are things you need to know, to be able to get a feel for the responses here.

I started, in early, early open beta, literally the night I stumbled across the game doing a nostalgic random google search for MW5. Things have happened since that time.
First, if I recall correctly, mechs were released more slowly, and not in bundles. No mastery packs, in fact (I dunno founders I wasnt here) Pheonix pack was the first actual mech pack for real money(not MC) that offered a lot of value. That started a trend, we got a pheonix reinforcment pack, clan pack(s) and now a resistance pack. very few new chassis have been released outside of bundle pre-order packs.

When I started, it was 8Vs8. When 12 vs 12 hit, c-bill earnings were "adjusted" and PGI in no uncertain terms told us we had been earning too much c-bills. Not too many felt a need to run premium time, but IMO that had a lot more to do with the fact mechs were released so much more slowly. But I am not going to get into that too much.

How do these things affect you, the new guy? you need to know these couple things, to put responses into perspective.

The grind: I have I dunno like 158 mechs or something, and I sold a bunch of lights I had mastered for mechbay room(because rthey are cheepest to re buy and hence also lose the least when you take the hit on resale) I certainly did not get that on cadet bonus. I bought all the packs, except founders because I had no idea the game existed. So quite a few mechs I bought with real money. I own many of the heroes. Real money. I own a select few(c) mechs, some on sale, some were weekend event rewards, one for sure was a mastery pack mech. Real money. I bought an Atlas D, when it went on sale, like 2 months into open beta(or somewhere's abouts then) because I wanted an assault to call my own, and at the time it was Awesome, or Atlas, and damn, go big son! I have no regrets on that purchase.

i have bought many with c-bills.

What you need to know about this situation, and how it relates to you as a new guy- because I was around for so long, after a while, you end up with this massive stockpile of "stuff" from all the mechs you own, which means besides DHS upgrades, you can outfit a new mech to custom with inventory. New players- you wont have that pile of stuff. Buying a new mech, and customizing it, well, imagine that 10 million figure, say for a raven. Except I have the XL engine on hand, any weapon i want on hand, an ECM, BAP, AMS, whatever, even a pile of DHS to put in. basically, I buy a Raven, and upgrades, and that is it. No 2 million dollar XL engine, etc. new guys: you can;t. you have to figure 20 games to buy that engine. SO:

that is when you look at buying MC mechs, or packs. these guys spouting "never buy anything with MC" are either not considering how their costs are reduced, have bought packs and have a platoon of mechs at the ready, or are simply part of the "free" part of the FTP game. You must decide on your own how much you want to spend here, if you like it enough to spend more, or esseintially "invest" in things like mech packs etc. NOTE: it isn't INVESTING, though some feel entitled that way. it is simply grind reduction.


IMO, bottom line, if you love this game, can;t get into it enough because of mechbay limitations(and mechs in them) you should buy something. Mastery packs are the best value, even though only the hero is technically unavailable otherwise(champions are normal mechs with custom loadouts and XP bonuses) because essentially they are 50% off everything in them. You get a hero mech for c-bill bonus, a well loaded champion(usually) and a third variant for skill unlocks, along with premium time(more c-bills and XP, level that hero!) and the mechbays they go in. Buying a pre-order pack is a solid value also.

The game is on a whole different level of enjoyability when you have a stable of mechs to play, vs 3, and some money and "stuff" around to mess around with mechlab. If you decide to buy something, great! Don't just guess though, figure out "sorta" what you are after, and ask us here about reviews and playstyle advice for mechs etc.

Short, sort of related story time: My first C-bill mech- Cataphract. It was the newest heavy at the time(like brand new), one was a trial mech. Old timers might remember which it was....do you remember............... eh times up! the 4X. Dear lord, learning this game in a phract 4X before any kind of HSR. I wonder why i am such a decent shot now. basically, it was likely the WORST mech i could have chosen with cadet funds lol, at the time anyway, but I got it because i had trial mech XP for it and it looked cool and I liked running it. I did horribad for a while in it too, but it was Mechwarrior, so I didnt care. Essentially, if I had come here, I probably could have learned more easily, faster, and earned money faster too. You are on the right track by asking things here.


I hope that long text wall was helpful to some one. Basically, take some of the advice here with a grain of salt with the knowledge many of us old timers have a whole different perspective on what grinding money is about, and picking up a handful of mechs and goodies for some real money CAN make the game a lot more enjoyable when you are starting out.

[Ace Selin]

Buying a few Hero mechs (in different weight classes) is a great idea. The 30% Cbill bonus is nice in standard game modes & especially if you use a few in CW.

Jester, Firebrand are good CW mechs imo.

[Greyhart]

all of this is really good stuff.

I only really think the mastery packs or other things like that would be the things to purchase with MC.

Considering what I have heard here I think I will likely get the Stalker Mastery pack. As an assault mech would take the longest to get so would be most cost effective in time.

I really do like mech warrior games and find MWO to be excellent in the core game and therefore I am happy to support it with a bit of cash, but not a large amount as I don't have a lot.

[GenghisJr]

If the mech can be bought for cbills, cbills. I do have a few hero mech and a lot of mechs ~90 . I use MC for mech bays, premium time, camo and colours. Camo does work, especially if you equip ecm or are under it. All my mechs run camo and custom colours. I go for military style camo and colours, maybe thats not your style.
But, I have never bought a mech for mc if I could use cbills to get it, although I have bought 4 clan mechs individually before they were available for cbills...in fact all my clan mechs were mc purchases like this.
I bought the resistance package to support the game which is the first package like this Ive bought, I would suggest buying mech bays to master a lot of chassis but do this one at a time to keep the progress fast

[The Basilisk]

>>1. Do you find that you mainly use MC or CBills purchase new mechs?
As I figure it you get about 100,000 CBills per match and a reasonable Mech will be about 10 mil CBills.
This means at least playing a hundred games. Doable but is going to take some time. So do the majority of people buy with MC?


-- I spent mainly C-Bills on Mechs with a few exceptions.
I made the fault to buy the Elite Founders package when MWO went Beta and got some MC with it.
NEVER EVER spend MCs on a Mech from a line of chassis where you did not at least finish the basics.
If you find yourself in a position where you get below ~ 120k C-Bills averange while pugging please refer to the many many guides out there. Koninving is one Name you could look for.
Since you are pretty new to MWO I would strongly recommend NOT TO drive meta chassis needing expensive modules and upgrades to funktion.
I also advise you NOT TO buy Clan mechs.
They are basicaly more expensive, more limited regarding customisation and you will have to buy additional modules to make many configs work.


>> 2. I am currently thinking of getting a mastery pack. Any suggestions for a new player on which is a good starting point. I'd prefer IS rather than Clan.

-- Don't.
First find the mech class ( light, medium, heavy, assault ) you are most comfortable with, then think of buying a hero variant of the chassis you like most in this class.
Heros will help you getting C-bills faster.
NEVER spend MCs on mechs you don't realy know.

>> 3. Is there any good basic guides to CW? Also do you really need to be in group / unit (forgotten the word for it that isn't clan or guild) or is simply PUGing viable. Is there any easy way to look at the various units out there?

-- PuGing in CW is quite depressing. First thing is, it will take lots of time to find matches as PuG ( at least thats my experience )
Second thing is the lack of coordination ( PuG Voip or no Voip doesn't realy matter if you meet a seasoned team)
Basicaly find a House or Merc Unit where you can tag along they will also teach you how to play.

>> 4. How does the friends list actually work? I've seen it but seems like it is not the most integrated system.

-- No it isn't.
Lackluster and technical inadequate UI, performance and unintuitive menues are a trademark of MWO.
Same thing as above.
I strongly recommend to find a unit with a form of voice communication to teach you advanced handling of the MWO client.

[Kyynele]

Greyhart, on 25 March 2015 - 01:35 AM, said:

Considering what I have heard here I think I will likely get the Stalker Mastery pack. As an assault mech would take the longest to get so would be most cost effective in time.

That's not automatically the way things go btw. For example, for a light mech to be decent, it's almost mandatory to get a large XL engine for it, along with full DHS, endo-steel and ferro fibrous upgrades. These cost a load of C-Bills. And for assaults in turn, you typically want a STD engine for better tankability, which is also much cheaper. You also pretty much never need ferro for assaults, and even having endo or not depends on your build.

For example a meta Stalker 4N (the best Stalker, not included in the pack), fully upgraded costs 12.5mil: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9eba26483698488

A meta Raven 3L, fully upgraded costs 13.2mil: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b8d692bbd26c9b0

[Rogue Jedi]

Greyhart, on 25 March 2015 - 01:35 AM, said:

Considering what I have heard here I think I will likely get the Stalker Mastery pack. As an assault mech would take the longest to get so would be most cost effective in time.

While an assault will usualy (but not always) be more expensive than a Light it is not by that much, maybe 2-3 million on average.
here is why

most Assaults will want 2-4 million extra spent on them after purchase to make a competitive build, that includes 1.5 million for Double Heat Sinks (compulsory for most Mechs if you want to be anywhere near competitive) Endo Steel Internals, possibly a larger standard engine, and modifying the weapons layout.

It is not uncommon for a Light to need 7+ million spend on it after purchase to get it properly upgraded (a big part of that cost is 3-5 million for an XL engine which can usualy be swopped between variants so is not required for every Light, but also 1.5 million for DHS as well as Endo Steel Internal Structure, Fero Fibrus armor and the costs of any new weapons or other equipment you want).

regardless of weight class total cost of a Mech does not change that much as the need for expensive weight saving upgrades (like XL engines) decreases as the Mechs weight increases

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 25 March 2015 - 06:13 AM.