61 replies to this topic

[Quxudica]

I was considering dropping as IS this week as I greatly enjoy my IS mechs. Mostly my Jaegers and Wolverine, however it seems like Ammo based mech builds are at a huge disadvantage in CW compared to energy builds. Last week I dropped as Jade Falcon using energy builds and didn't often lose my second mech, typically keeping my first medium drop alive for half or more of the fight. Using my AC/5 WVR/JM6 it seems like I'll hit a point rather quickly where I am forced to either stand around doing nothing, or eject and credit the enemy team a kill.

Am I exaggerating the effect here or are ammo builds really as bad as they seem in CW? I realize in the fluff rearming a mech is not something that can be done in the field, but I almost wonder if that really needs to be available.

[FupDup]

Laser vomit.

[monk]

It's one of the downsides to how the mechanic works against the balance of the game. It's unfortunate, because it really does limit ammo based weaponry. It's rare to see in CW, for sure. It might be worth considering a method of resupply.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

I don't have issue with ammo based mechs. I roll three or four tons gauss ammo or two tons per AC (four for an AC20) and one ton per SRM launcher.

By the time I'm bingo'd out on ammo I've bingo'd out on armor anyways.

[Y E O N N E]

I run a BJ-1DC on defense. Ammo supply typically dwindles at a lower rate than armor supply. With 412 rounds to start with, the closest I've come to running dry is 86 remaining rounds, and that was in a close-quarters, pitched fight on Grim against CGBI.

And even if I did run out of ammo, that sextuplet of small lasers keeps the machine useful if the enemy is nearby.

[Eboli]

It is called balance, if you take a completely ballistics build you WILL run out of ammo, unless you die first. At least give yourself a spare ton or two and have a couple of medium lasers... If you don't make sacrifices expect the consequences.

Tough words but that is the current reality within CW.
Eboli

Edited by Eboli, 30 March 2015 - 09:54 PM.

[Elizander]

My Dual Gauss Ilya did fine! Of course I packed 110 Gauss slugs to go with it. Best part was I lived until I ran out and had to eject and got like 8 kills.

You can probably put at least 80 slugs on a Jager... I think.

Edited by Elizander, 30 March 2015 - 10:11 PM.

[Lugin]

Doubled armor (vs TT values), combined with 1.5x (AC, LRM), 1.25x (Gauss), and 1x (SRM) ammo (vs TT values) will do that.

[El Bandito]

Eboli, on 30 March 2015 - 09:53 PM, said:

It is called balance, if you take a completely ballistics build you WILL run out of ammo, unless you die first. At least give yourself a spare ton or two and have a couple of medium lasers... If you don't make sacrifices expect the consequences.

Tough words but that is the current reality within CW.

Fat lot of good a couple of ML will do against the enemy in CW due to long ranged pokes. Might as well bring 2 more tons of ammo for the Gauss/AC instead, and eject once it runs out.

Edited by El Bandito, 30 March 2015 - 11:19 PM.

[Elizander]

El Bandito, on 30 March 2015 - 11:18 PM, said:

Fat lot of good a couple of ML will do against the enemy in CW due to long ranged pokes. Might as well bring 2 more tons of ammo for the Gauss/AC instead, and eject once it runs out.

This is true. You'll end up with a gimped mech that will only benefit the enemy. You are better of getting loads of ammo and ejecting after dealing massive damage.

[Curccu]

Really bad? No, well maybe some builds....
Jager-DD with triple UACs is pretty awesome
Über Dragon-1N is semi OP
Jager-S with Dual gauss is good
Grid Iron is good
some mixed builds like hellbringer with ERPPC/Gauss is good
+ a lot more builds.

all of my full ammo based builds have damage potential between 1000-1700 and that is enough for each mech IMO.

[Deathlike]

This is generally a non-issue as far as I can tell.

Even the best dakka-Dragon user has enough ammo for a particular wave, and has a pretty good idea when his expiration date happens to be.

If you are not bringing enough ammo, you'll know it... but moreso if you used up all your obscene ammo dump... you probably had a good game going anyways.

[Virgil Greyson]

monk, on 30 March 2015 - 09:30 PM, said:

It's one of the downsides to how the mechanic works against the balance of the game. It's unfortunate, because it really does limit ammo based weaponry. It's rare to see in CW, for sure. It might be worth considering a method of resupply.

Why not let mechs with ammo return to the dropship for a resupply? Of course limit it in some way with a cooldown timer or something.

[meteorol]

6 tons of gauss ammo (for a gaussjager without backup weapons) is good for 600 damage. Lets say 450 if you shoot outside of the optimal range. 450 is 50% of damage an average IS player will deal with all 4 mechs. Sounds fine to me.

[NotSoCoolJ]

I tend to subscribe to the philosophy that lasers never run out of ammo. However, I do run a streak Adder in CW because of the light spam. It's handy on enemy pushes as well. Keep the enemy rockin with chain fire while the team is relatively safe from reprisal. It has the handy ability to solo pretty much any enemy it will face in CW if one tries to yolo in. Though, at the cost of 75% of it's ammo stores.

Ultimately, if you can put out 1k of damage or more to the enemy on a consistent basis, I don't really care what you use to do it with. It's not really hard to do that with four mechs. Ammo dependent or not.

[Amsro]

Yeah CW is more ammo dependent, adjust your builds accordingly, if you survive long enough to exhaust all your ammo you're likely winning the match and can afford to hold K and get another.

I prefer having a couple of large laser weapons to back-up my ballistics.

[sycocys]

Maybe a resupply consumable is a reasonable middle ground? 40k for a 25% resupply, but it locks you into place for 10-15 seconds making it a risky move in CW.

[Fubl]

I usually do decent with my Dakka Bringers. one is 2 uac5s with 7 med lasers the other is 3 uac2s with 5 med lasers as back up.

[zagibu]

Just don't peek and waste your ammo, go in guns blazing, drop enemies left and right until you are out of ammo, then brawl with your single small laser until they kill you.

[Johnny Z]

sycocys, on 31 March 2015 - 02:37 AM, said:

Maybe a resupply consumable is a reasonable middle ground? 40k for a 25% resupply, but it locks you into place for 10-15 seconds making it a risky move in CW.

Was thinking the same thing. Air drop. Mech has to go to resupply bot and stand in proper spot for resupply. The more SIM like the better.

Or resupply ship/hangar. Mech goes in, animation plays. Maybe even makes these destroyable.

Edited by Johnny Z, 31 March 2015 - 03:05 AM.