38 replies to this topic

[Sir Wolfenx]

If I had the choice between the two, joystick, or gaming mouse, which would improve my game?
Right now I have trouble using the arms, legs, and torso twists together with my current controls.

Sometimes I opt out of having mechs which heavily rely on arms to my tactical detriment.
Also have trouble using multiple banks of weapons. With two button mouse I only use two, maybe three for occasion weapons like missiles because key three is close to WASD. Also trouble sniping properly.

I was looking at something like this:
http://www.amazon.ca...ds=gaming+mouse

Verses something like this:
http://www.amazon.ca...ywords=joystick

Budget:

$25-$100 CDN.

[Petard]

Gaming mouse, forget joysticks for MWO, unless you use it just for movement, and use mouse for aim and torso.

Good Hunting

[Catamount]

There is no scenario in which a gaming joystick is going to give you any kind of a good time in MWO, much less a Logitech Extreme 3D (This would be somewhat less objectionable).

Get yourself a gaming mouse, something good from a proven brand. I like Logitech's new opticals, so my recommendation would probably be the G402 at your pricepoint.

[Sir Wolfenx]

Ok. I have no experience with "gaming mice".

How many buttons does a mouse need? Where are the best locations? G402 seems to have good response times.
Does the G402 have enough buttons? What keyboard buttons should I expect to migrate to the mouse?
Left Handed verses Right Handed Mouse? Does it matter?

I was thinking: DPI CHANGER.

Firing Weapons: 1 2 3 4 5 6
Push to Talk
What else?

Maybe
Toggle Arm aiming.
Toggle Cockpit look.

Surely an alternative MMORPG mouse I saw has too many buttons for MWO. Besides I do not play WOW.

I saw mice with weights in them for balance, why would I want to use that?

I've seen mice with 15000dpi. Is 4000dpi enough?

Edited by Sir Wolfenx, 08 April 2015 - 07:06 AM.

[CLANBOY FFI]

Corsair M65 Mouse for targeting and weapons, 3D Pro joystick for movment, JJ and other things,
This is a great way to play so worth saving up for.

[Catamount]

So here's my take on gaming mice. There are basically three broad categories of things to look for: sensor quality/characteristics, number of buttons, and features.

Your mouse in shooters must be, first and foremost, a good pointing device. In MWO it matters a little less than a typical "twitch" shooter (COD, CS, etc), but I've come to slowly realize it still matters hugely, because things like being able to pinpoint a small spot on the move during the entire cycle time of a laser are important. I would consider this the foremost consideration. Avoid laser mice if possible, and avoid mice that do things like angle snap or accelerate (ie all laser mice ). You do not need 10k+ DPI. You probably won't use more than 2000, and even that would be high, especially for MWO. You care about precision and accuracy, not the ability to twitch 300 degrees in half a second, which your mechs aren't capable of in the first place.

The next consideration for MWO is probably adequate buttons. As a long time Mechwarrior player I can say that few builds will ever require more than three weapon groups. Even three is usually something I only see for heat management reasons (eg three ERLL on the arms, separate them as 1+2 to avoid ghost heat and have a secondary weapon be group three). Mechs are specialists and should excel at firing a couple kinds of weapons, not packing on a gish gallop of disparate weapons that require six different groups. The Timerwolf may be the sole mech in my inventory that benefits, in one config, from four.

Keep in mind, too, you can only press so many buttons at once, and you only really need to mouse-bind stuff you need split-second access to in combination with weapons, for which you have only two fingers and a thumb (you know, for three weapon groups; see how that works? ). I have no bind for zoom, arm lock or cockpit view as keyboard binds work just fine for these and I need my mouse fingers for things that pew pew anyways. The only button I've gained recently in my configs are the sniper buttons (DPI toggles) that newer mice come with.

So with that in mind, I think all you need is:
Weapons: 1, 2, 3 and maybe 4
PTT
Sniper if supported (G402 has a dedicated button)

Anything additional is there because you have buttons to blow, not because it's necessary for increased combat capability.


Featurewise, a DPI switch or toggle is good for MWO, imo. Most buttons have an up/down switch or cycle button so you're covered there.


The G502 is considered fairly widely to be the best general gaming mouse on the market (or at worst, in the top tiny few) as far as reviewers go, and I hands down agree. It's comfortable, its sensor is just objectively better than what you'll find elsewhere, it has a good button layout, it's a Logitech so it'll outlive you, and it covers a nice range of features (adjustable weight, mouse wheel smooth/click modes, sniper button, onboard profile switching, good software customizability including many sensor tweaks). It didn't seem like you were shooting for G502 price territory, ~75CAD, so I just bumped it down to its very slightly less-featured little brother. If you can afford a G502, then just stop thinking about mice and go get one, now Everyone will always recommend the gaming mouse they have, because... I don't know. So you'll always get rave reviews from individual forum users about this or that mouse. If you look through previous pages, however, you'll find the mouse that tends to come up the most is the G502, and before that, it was the G500 which became stupidly popular even with its inferior sensor (good features otherwise I guess?). Yes, I own a G502, but I'm not raving because it's "my" mouse; I specifically sought this out regardless of cost as soon as I could afford one with good reason, and you needn't take my word for it. The G402 is, of course, not as perfectly amazing, so maybe someone else has an equally good recommendation as Logitech's #2, but it's going to be at least as good as the next mouse over from any other company for MWO (for button heavy stuff like MMOs or MOBAs, maybe not).

Edited by Catamount, 08 April 2015 - 07:46 AM.

[Arle Vox]

Keyboard and mouse is the BEST way to go. Period.

The keyboard short cuts for controlling your mech are placed in intuitive and easy to reach locations on the keyboard (near W A S D for moving around), and you have functionality to change weapon groups on the fly with the arrow keys and right-ctrl.

Don't worry too much about DPI. If the mouse you get is labeled as a 'gaming mouse' then you needn't worry. 4000 DPI is more than enough for your purposes, and when you go pro you can get something shinier.

I use a Razer Naga mmo gaming mouse because it has all of the number keys bound to buttons on the side. Most of my mechs I can run with 2 or 3 weapon groups though, so I rarely use them. Left and right click are groups 1 and 2.

-> Chain fire is your best friend, group all of your lasers together, and then you can fire them one at a time (hit "Backspace" with the weapon group selected, select the weapon group with the arrow keys on your keyboard)

Edited by Arle Vox, 08 April 2015 - 08:01 AM.

[-Wulf-]

I use a Razer Taipan and BlackWidow keyboard. The posters up to the time of this post is right over 2000 dpi is very trite. mostly it seems you want 1000ms polling rate for percision tracking. I run my Taipan on 1800 dpi with 1000ms polling for MWO. Plus with razer synapse 2.0 you dont have to get a third party macro program to set the macro for UAC5's, Synapse 2.0 has macro feature built right in. So its a win win for you.

I tried the Joystick many times and its lacking in percision, shots are wild and not so much pinpoint. The mouse keyboard just makes things seem easier. As for a mouse, if in your shoes I would really research into what most people are using, the majority seems to be using a RAZER product. Even one of the other posters is using a Razer NAGA.

NGNG staff pretty much all use Razer Death Adder gaming mice and a Keyboard.

So for you id go for
http://www.ebay.ca/i...=item19fbd58a66
http://www.ebay.ca/i...=item19fa2ca0a6

there is the two most commonly used for MWO

Im not here to talk up RAZER products but when lot's of folks swear by them it may be worth looking into.

Edited by Falkwulf, 08 April 2015 - 08:51 AM.

[Catamount]

Razer mice are a classic gaming choice, and the Deathadder especially has been a popular mouse for serious gamers for a long time, but I think the eight year old mouse has been handily superseded by a number of newer offerings despite some sensor updates. There are simply cheaper mice with equal or better sensors, more buttons, more features, and not being Razer means they're probably better built

The Deathadder is 80CAD on up, including those Ebay offerings which have significant shipping and import charges. That's just too damn much for that mouse.

Edited by Catamount, 08 April 2015 - 07:20 PM.

[Celtic Warrior]

I'm using the JS linked below, not as good as a mouse but it works for me.


http://www.amazon.ca...3570681-4654004

[Stealth Fox]

Sir Wolfenx, on 08 April 2015 - 07:00 AM, said:

Ok. I have no experience with "gaming mice".

How many buttons does a mouse need? Where are the best locations? G402 seems to have good response times.
Does the G402 have enough buttons? What keyboard buttons should I expect to migrate to the mouse?
Left Handed verses Right Handed Mouse? Does it matter?

I was thinking: DPI CHANGER.

Firing Weapons: 1 2 3 4 5 6
Push to Talk
What else?

Maybe
Toggle Arm aiming.
Toggle Cockpit look.

Surely an alternative MMORPG mouse I saw has too many buttons for MWO. Besides I do not play WOW.

I saw mice with weights in them for balance, why would I want to use that?

I've seen mice with 15000dpi. Is 4000dpi enough?

I use a Razer Naga 2012, got the 'phone' side on it with the 12 key number pad on the side. its what I use for all my gaming, seems to work fine for me.

[Sgt Minuteman]

Get the Thrustmaster T.16000m...by far best joystick out there for under $80 all day long and into next 10 years...lol no kidding it is awesome.. Even better than most $200 sticks . It has Hall Sensors so no moving gears or stuff that will break and it is by far way more accurate than any stick I have used. Superior to the MS Sidewinder Pro I used in MW3 and 4. Now, that being said, nothing beats a mouse for accuracy in aiming. I have the Logitech G502 and it has fully customizable setting, but out of the box it does just fine with DPI shift right next to mouse button one. Great for increasing Torso twist speeds for fighting light mechs. it also has 3 mouse buttons on the side which can be used for weapons groups but I don't use them i use the stick buttons for groups. Trigger = NextTarget, button 2 = weapon group3, button 3 (middle joystick button) =for jump jets, button 4 = weapon group4. My setup is exactly like Clanboy's pictured above, except my keyboard is in a pull out drawer under my desk that I use for misc stuff like Nightvision and chatwarrior.

The logitech G502 is a completely redesigned mouse with new optics engine and chip. Logitech quality went down after the G7 mouse. This is the by far best Logitech i have ever owned and i have owned all their gaming mice. In fact I was seriously going to swear off logitech permanently after my G600 mouse craped out after 6 months. My G502 has been flawless for over a year.

[darqsyde]

I'm going to second the Razer recommendation. However, and most importantly, a quality gaming mouse will be more useful for more games, and general use, than a joystick. An important thing to consider when buying a quality mouse is also the mousing surface it will be used on. Most modern mice shouldn't have any issues with most surfaces, but a good pad can't be over looked.

My opinion:
I'm currently using a Taipan(white), Nostromo and Lycosa keyboard. In the past I used a Deathadder(2012), but switched to the Taipan for more buttons. I prefer the shape and feel of the Deathadder, but the Taipan is slightly more functional. I use the mouse on a Rocketfish hard Aluminium pad.

If I was buying today, (and money was not an issue), I'd go for an Orbweaver Stealth, BlackWidow Chroma Stealth, and either the Ouroborus or DeathAdder Chroma.

Edited by darqsyde, 08 April 2015 - 08:25 PM.

[Sgt Minuteman]

Oh by the way the G502 has calibration sensors that let you use any surface for gaming.

[VXJaeger]

Never ever use joystick, it's just useless. Kb+mouse is the best choise.

[Tarl Cabot]

Visit a local computer store/Best Buy for hands on testing, literally. You can always purchase the product elsewhere. Some users palm their mice, others with their fingers but getting a mouse that does not fit your hand can be quite maddening.

[Rushin Roulette]

Tarl Cabot, on 09 April 2015 - 05:01 AM, said:

Visit a local computer store/Best Buy for hands on testing, literally. You can always purchase the product elsewhere. Some users palm their mice, others with their fingers but getting a mouse that does not fit your hand can be quite maddening.

Deffinitely this over any other recomendation.

First choose what your mouse should have as a minimum such as number of buttons.
Then from those mice hold each on in your hand as if you were using it at a desk, select the ones which are most comfortable and easy to reach buttons the way you hold the mouse intuitively (Also take into account the weight of the mouse, as some prefere lighter mice, others heavier or adjustable weights).
Once you have narrowed the mice down to comforatble and functional, then you can go by price and customer reviews.

I usually look at only the worst reviews to see if a pattern emerges. If 50 people write how absolutely fantastic a product is and that they have never had a better one in their life I usually take these as advertizing... if however 30 users say a mouse breaks down after 6 months of use or the left button unintentionally doubelclicks, then I know there seems to be a production problem with specific parts. If however 5 users have negative comments about random crap which doesnt interrest me (such as Software is dificult to install or mouse is too heavy [I tested teh weight earlier. so Im fine with that point]), then I tend to ignore these making the seleciton easier.

[Ozzy Stormlight]

i used to use a logitec 3d extreme pro...
but since i broke it (after 2 years of MWO), i had to find another solution for my gaming style.
I personally hate using the keyboard... but there is no better accuracy than the mouse.
SO... i hooked up my old Saitek x45 HOTAS... the joystick is cumbersome at best so it sits off to the side.. and thus i use the throttle for alot of functions ( targeting , movement, consumables, etc.), and the mouse for weapon systems.

took a little getting used to but well worth the gameplay

[Basskicker]

I bought a Logitech G502 at the beginning of the year and it performs very well in MWO. The only beef I have with it is I hit the DPI changer often when playing games.

My saitek x52 on the other hand does not perform very well for MWO. It is almost impossible to aim and move at the same time using arm mounted weapons.

[Napoleon_Blownapart]

i use just the throttle flom the tflight hotas x and the t16000m
and a trackball between them to help finer aim.