35 replies to this topic

[grendeldog]

Hey there. So I have seen numerous threads suggesting that the pinpoint elite skill does nothing, and a few that say that the fast fire skill does nothing. The thing is that all these threads are from 2012 or 2013, so I don't know if they're relevent to the state of the game today. I did in fact 'use the effing search engine' as they say, but found nothing recent.

So to answer this once and for all: does pinpoint do anything? Does fast fire do anything?

And if pinpoint does in fact do something, my understanding is that it allows your weapons to converge at whatever you're targetting, so that if you have, say, 3 MPL in the torso and four in the arms, and your target is only 50 or 100 meters away, they all hit one component instead of being spread out over several. Is this indeed how pinpoint works, if it works at all?

Thanks a lot guys!

Edited by grendeldog, 14 April 2015 - 09:43 PM.

[Rushin Roulette]

That is how pinpoint shuold work... however, as the weapons follow the crosshairs andyways and shoot only where the crosshairs are, they already have 100% convergence without the elite skill.... so no, pinpoint doesnt work.

As for fast firing. I havent noticed if the weapons fire any faster, but I havent sat down with a stopwatch to time it either. 10% faster at a recycle time of 4 seconds for a Medium laser is 0,4 seconds, so they should be recycling just under half a second faster if anyone cared to time the recharge before and after unlocking the skill.

[Eximar]

Hover your cursor over the cooldown times on Smurfy and it will give you the cooldown with fast fire completed.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Fast fire works (it had been disabled in the past due to ghost heat issues I believe). Pinpoint does not since all weapons converge immediately.

[Ialdabaoth]

Solution: bring back knockdown, replace Pinpoint with 'Stability' which reduces knockdown chance by 50%.

[Corbenik]

All I know is whenever I get the PP skill it makes my AC rounds get to the target faster than if I dont have the skill.

[Banditman]

Corbenik, on 14 April 2015 - 10:40 PM, said:

All I know is whenever I get the PP skill it makes my AC rounds get to the target faster than if I dont have the skill.

This is how bad information gets started. Pinpoint has nothing at all to do with AC velocity. There are mech quirks for that, but the pinpoint skill does absolutely nothing in game, and the devs have said as much in the past.

[Corbenik]

Banditman, on 15 April 2015 - 04:42 AM, said:

This is how bad information gets started. Pinpoint has nothing at all to do with AC velocity. There are mech quirks for that, but the pinpoint skill does absolutely nothing in game, and the devs have said as much in the past.

Its just what I see all the time for the longest Before and after I buy that skill, and I only started to pay attention since everyone has said it does nothing. so then what makes them goes faster after I buy that skill? happened with my IS and Clan mechs all the time. since most I use run the AC and i notice a difference. also before all that quirk BS too.

Edited by Corbenik, 15 April 2015 - 08:03 AM.

[xMintaka]

Corbenik, on 15 April 2015 - 08:02 AM, said:

Its just what I see all the time for the longest Before and after I buy that skill, and I only started to pay attention since everyone has said it does nothing. so then what makes them goes faster after I buy that skill? happened with my IS and Clan mechs all the time. since most I use run the AC and i notice a difference. also before all that quirk BS too.

Your information is still incorrect.

Edited by Lunatech, 15 April 2015 - 08:19 AM.

[Modo44]

Pinpoint is not doing anything since at least 2013. Fast fire was off and on when it caused issues with AC2 ghost heat. You notice differences depending on where exactly you aim while firing, since it can significantly alter weapon convergence.

[Kin3ticX]

Dont worry too much about what pinpoint does. Just get all your elites to have speed tweak, double basics(cooling and handling), and eventually the master slot.

[JC Daxion]

pin point does nothing to speed up the arm/torso cross hair? the arms are always on the same spot, but put a large laser in an arm, and then one in the torso you will see them lag behind on convergence, does PP do nothing to help that? I could swear it does, but perhaps not.

[grendeldog]

Thanks for pinning down what works and what doesn't (or has no meaningful effect anyway) guys!

Kin3ticX, on 15 April 2015 - 08:34 AM, said:

Dont worry too much about what pinpoint does. Just get all your elites to have speed tweak, double basics(cooling and handling), and eventually the master slot.

Yeah, speed tweak is always first, and then fast fire. Even if pinpoint does nothing meaningful, it's still obviously worth it for mastering the chassis - this for the double basic skills moreso than the extra module (with two other mechs of the same weight class).

JC Daxion, on 17 April 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

pin point does nothing to speed up the arm/torso cross hair? the arms are always on the same spot, but put a large laser in an arm, and then one in the torso you will see them lag behind on convergence, does PP do nothing to help that? I could swear it does, but perhaps not.

As far as I understand it, pinpoint would work as follows: imagine you're aiming at something 1000 meters away. Your weapons will be pointing at that spot. Now say an enemy crests a hill directly in front of your, only 50m away. You put your crosshairs over that mech and immediately fire. Now, your guns were set so that the beams would cross 1000 meters distant. The target is now only 50m away, so those beams hit far apart.

Pinpoint would act so that the time it takes for your beams to switch from crossing at 1000m to 50m would be reduced.

[Rebel816]

instead of the idea of pinpoint making the beams themselves line up faster like most people are mentioning, i think he was asking if it made the torso & arm reticles line up faster with each other. however i cant really think of a way to test this other than "Feel".

[grendeldog]

Rebel816, on 17 April 2015 - 04:35 PM, said:

instead of the idea of pinpoint making the beams themselves line up faster like most people are mentioning, i think he was asking if it made the torso & arm reticles line up faster with each other. however i cant really think of a way to test this other than "Feel".

Yeah, somebody said that it makes the arm and torso crosshairs converge quicker. But it doesn't; that is a function of arm pitch and yaw and torso pitch and yaw speeds (for example you'll see some mechs have quirks that make their arms or torsos move faster up and down or side to side - or both).

[Vlad Striker]

Convergence works like your camera autofocuse. When you shoot moving target then aiming point jumping from target to clouds behind target, from 200m to infinity. So weapon barrels turns not instantly but have some delay to change focus.

So you DON'T have pinpoint damage on moving target 'cause aim for each barrel have divergence from aiming point. This skill speed up convergence for each barrel to one point.

[TercieI]

TheCaptainJZ, on 14 April 2015 - 10:20 PM, said:

Fast fire works (it had been disabled in the past due to ghost heat issues I believe). Pinpoint does not since all weapons converge immediately.

^This

Ialdabaoth, on 14 April 2015 - 10:35 PM, said:

Solution: bring back knockdown, replace Pinpoint with 'Stability' which reduces knockdown chance by 50%.

Have to fix the rubber banding when two mechs get close before we can even remotely consider knockdown

Banditman, on 15 April 2015 - 04:42 AM, said:

This is how bad information gets started. Pinpoint has nothing at all to do with AC velocity. There are mech quirks for that, but the pinpoint skill does absolutely nothing in game, and the devs have said as much in the past.

Well, you're half right. Nothing to do with projectile velocity, but FF has been working for some time, see Paul's post here.

[TripleEhBeef]

Would be nice if Pinpoint got switched for, say, a 5% bonus to target info gathering time or sensor range. I know we have equipment and modules that do that job better, but at least it would be a beneficial bonus.

[grendeldog]

TripleEhBeef, on 18 April 2015 - 10:07 AM, said:

Would be nice if Pinpoint got switched for, say, a 5% bonus to target info gathering time or sensor range. I know we have equipment and modules that do that job better, but at least it would be a beneficial bonus.

I'd like that. I was thinking about modules, and I wouldn't mind seeing modules for either beam duration for lasers, or better yet heat generation for all weapons. I know that heat management is a skill, and an important one, but I would enjoy the flexibility that would come with such modules. You would have one more way to tailor your build - do I want more range, or a shorter cooldown, or less heat?

Or perhaps there could even be modules that affect torso twist range of speed. I'm not saying these would necessarily be more useful than the mech and weapon modules currently available, but I think the variety would be nice, especially for weapon modules. A third option besides range and cooldown would add even more interest to the game IMO.

[Tim East]

TripleEhBeef, on 18 April 2015 - 10:07 AM, said:

Would be nice if Pinpoint got switched for, say, a 5% bonus to target info gathering time or sensor range. I know we have equipment and modules that do that job better, but at least it would be a beneficial bonus.

It would be nice if pinpoint got switched with anything that actually did something. How about the old thermal vision?
Or maybe something that allowed your mech to step over any obstacle that was not taller than its knees regardless of said obstacle's hyper-steep angle of incline? Call it the "goose stepping" skill.
Or what about an information warfare skill that put mechs you could see but didn't target on the map/minimap, but didn't render them targetable for your allies, allowing them to see large concentrations of enemies without making scouting OP?

Or really just anything that actually did something. That'd be super.