12 replies to this topic

[Keffer]

Guys I'm returning to the game after being gone since before the clans were added and ECM changed, I have reviewed several posts and still have a few questions I would appreciate any guaidance you may be able to give before I spend any cash.

1. Expereince last night - So far I'm using a Hunchback 4SP i think it is, ive bought double HS, 4 Med Pulse and 2 SSRM2, when I can get in close I do ok but more often than not even one on one with a equal mech kills me or its so close I'm a joke for the next mech that comes along. I'm to slow to catch smaller mechs and to small to fight heavies it seems. I'm sure my lack of expereince plays a big role as well. I'm assuming I need a XL engine to increase my speed, but is the extra vulnerabiltiy and cost woth it? I saw a few posts discussing it being cheaper to buy a whole new mech than to buy a XL engine, did i understand correctly? one post suggested purchasing a Griffin 3M and stripping the engine if i understood?

2. Next I tried a Awesome, which used up the last of the c-bills i had from before, one on ones went better but it was over the minute something small and fast got behind me. There is a lesson in this for me i am sure.

3. With this in mind for the weekend I think i want to purchase a fast heavy, or medium with good armor and AMS or ECM that has a lot of energy hardpoints and maybe a few for streaks. Any suggestions? Maybe a Grasshopper? Nova?

4. Sorry if i overlooked this in the new player forums but what is the benefit of the clan targeting computers?

Edited by Keffer, 02 October 2015 - 04:18 AM.

[EmperorMyrf]

Welcome back.

1. You can probably get away with using an XL on the 4sp but its usually not worth it. The build most guys use is a STD250 engine, DHS, Endo, 4ML, 2SRM6. That should give you a good amount speed, survivability, and firepower.

2. Awesomes can be tough to pilot well, just make sure you're sticking with the group so your team mates can watch your back.

3. If you're willing to shell out for clan tech the Timberwolf or the Mad Dog would fit the bill, though neither come with ecm. Another suggestions would be the Griffin, lots of laser and missile hardpoints and one variant does come with ecm.

4. Targeting Computers increase range, velocity, target data acquisition speed, critical hit chance, sensor range, and zoom.

Good luck out there.

[Nightshade24]

1. your build has 4 medium pulse lasers and 2 SSRM 2's.

a medium pulse laser does slightly more damage, DPS, and shorter beam length for more weight (for this case it's double the weight of a normal medium laser) thus it does suck up a bit of tonnage. I should also mention that tonnage (4 tons) could have went for 1 more medium laser and a bigger engine. I also should mention you got 2 SSRM 2's, an SSRM 2 is more heavier for the guidence system (streak) which allows it to lock on ,fire, and then forget. as well as high chance of hitting an enemy and follow the target but compared to a normal SRM 2 it's just heavier if you can aim well, SSRM's is typically good for when targeting faster mechs. Thus you do not handle yourself to well with the bigger folks with this.

overall your firepower is a bit low on your build, XL engine has trade ofs but if you can roll your damage you can avoid the ST destruction longer. Also an XL engine opens up tons that is often making you a colder mech as well as faster, more firepower, or both, which can be usefull, normally for a hunchback XL is a no no due to your hunch and the fact you can still fight with your head laser BUT the hunchback 4SP has smaller hunchies to basically non existance. so you can trade for an XL engine.

In this game you got this thing called quirks, they change some stuff but for inner sphere mostly adds structure/ armour and change weapon characteristic,

Quote

TORSO TURN RATE (YAW): 37.50 %
TORSO TURN RATE (PITCH): 10.00 %
ADDITIONAL ARMOR (LT): 12.00
ADDITIONAL ARMOR (RT): 12.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LT): 12.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RT): 12.00
SRM 6 COOLDOWN: 20.00 %
MISSILE COOLDOWN: 20.00 %
LASER DURATION: -25.00 %
MEDIUM LASER HEAT GENERATION: -10.00 %
ENERGY HEAT GENERATION: -10.00 %

This is the current quirks. Missile cooldown and SRM 6 cooldown stack, for 40% faster cooldown (aka fire rate, you fire 40% more faster) and also your medium lasers is 20% colder while your medium pulse is 10% colder as it isn't a medium laser.

HBK-4SP build is an example what you can do. it can hit much more harder and with speed tweak it can run 98 kph so in this instance at least you can out gun anything that out runs you.

This specific build is also quite cool (literally) and if you want you can remove some DHS and drop the artemis for AMS or something. some practice with the XL engine can help a long way.

I should mention however quirks will be rebalanced soon and from the current looks no weapon quirks will be out anymore, however it doesn't matter to much as I used a build much like this before quirks came out!
Your current build if you want it to be all pulsy and streaks would be better on a different mech but if you wnat it on the hunchback you can go for a this HBK-4SP I just built... it doesn't use the focused quirks but still use the generic quirks. It hits harder with the lasers now and can catch up to the lights so it may be better to use against the smaller guys.

Hunchback as a rule of thumb often use bigger mechs and help them out so they do not take to much damage but dish out a lot, this is more true with the 4G, 4H, and the hero but the 4P, 4SP, etc also may follow a similar attack pattern. So going toe to toe isn't the best option with anything bigger then you but if you do end up in that situation try focusing your firepower to bring down the mighty foe.


2. awesome in lore is a PPC boat and is prone to being very week up close due to the fact it's sniper gear is not that good up close, because it's range and damage and heat is good at range compared to other waepons but up close 2 medium lasers for 2 tones, 2 slots, and much less heat does the same damage as a ppc at 7 tons, 3 slots, etc. So the awesome (quirks and lore and kinda MW: O ) is best at range, across all variants LRM's, PPC's, ER PPC's, and mixed ER/PPC + LRM builds work well BUT you can try your hand in with SRM/ Large pulse brawly builds, this mech isn't the best at brawling due to profile but some say it doesn't matter while due to it's profile you can easily turn at rather range or up close to take the damage to the arm. Light mechs is the bane of most bigger mechs as they can out manuver you and kill you if you are not careful so try to stick with the team.


3. Nova is a clan omnimech, omnimech rules in MW: O makes it a bit of a 'bad' mech, as you can not add endo steel or ferro fibrous, remove the jumpjets and some heatsinks, etc... BUT you can move your omnipods around, lets say you got the nova prime , 12 er medium lasers both arm stock so you got 12 energy hardpoints each arm. Well if you look at the nova D it has a ballistic in 1 arm, so you buy the nova D omnipod and put it on your prime, so now you got 6 energy and 1 ballistic and you can go with a build like 1 UAC 10, 6 small lasers. but you can also decide you want a missile hardpoint and 1 of the novas has 1 in the side torso so equip that and you got 1B, 1M, 6E, you can go with a build like 4 small lasers, 1 UAC 10, 1 SRM 6, but you also kinda want to lower your arm hardpoints for best use of quirks and stuff so you go for the nova S with 3 energy hardpoints and put 3 er mediums, 1 SRM 6, and a UAC 10 for eg...
Only place you can't change is centre torso, so if you got the nova S and get the hardpoints to get an AMS on the left and right torso that's 3 AMS.

Grasshopper is a bit fast but it is also big but JJ lets it to be agile... I need a bit more info though for what you want to suit you... However I should state in case you did not know that if you get 3 variants or alternate configeration (clan omnimechs) and get all the basic pilot skills you can get the elites for that mech which make you fire faster and move faster and so on and on. I should also mention getting all elites double your basics so you are colder, turn faster, etc...

I suggest tryign to elite your awesome or hunchback if you haven't done so. Hunchback can be a fast in your face mech but does require skill... Shadowhawk, Stormcrow, Catapult, etc may sound like mechs you may want but there is a Griffon out there with ECM that could suit you well as well as the soon for c-bills shadowcat in a few weeks... as I said, may need more info.


4. Faster projectile speed for Autocannons, Ultra utocannons, gauss, ppc, lower beam durration for lasers, higher crit chance for the weapons I listed, and I think some targeting speed related stuff, bigger the number more slots, tons, and effective it is. It isn't quite the most popular piece of the equipment but some use it.

[Keffer]

Thanks for the replies so far folks, a few follow up questions please...

1. When referring to "Elite" that means maxing out my skill tree for that mech right?

2. I have so far avoided AC/Gauss because of lag/internet/computer/old age cordiantion issues that sometimes make it difficult to stay on targets at a distance hence my preference to pulse lasers and SSRM's but I was wondering is a SSRM "Boat" feasible or recommended given the circumstances?

3. I lean towards also wanting the best possible defenses when possible, thats why i was asking for ECM and possibly AMS on the same mech but with enough speed to run for cover when needed. It dont sound like a targetting computer would help me out in my current situation.

4. On my current build, Hunchback 4SP i think, 4 med pulse and 2 SSRM, i would agree with the assumption that my firepower is a bit low, am I correct in understanding that the suggestion would be to replace the 4 med pulse with 5 med lasers and more heat sinks? how woudl this impact the "Ghost heat" i read about? What about going all SSRM to make targeting easier?

[Keffer]

Along the same line what determines the "quirks" and how/where can i find them out for each mech?

[Nightshade24]

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

Thanks for the replies so far folks, a few follow up questions please...

1. When referring to "Elite" that means maxing out my skill tree for that mech right?

2. I have so far avoided AC/Gauss because of lag/internet/computer/old age cordiantion issues that sometimes make it difficult to stay on targets at a distance hence my preference to pulse lasers and SSRM's but I was wondering is a SSRM "Boat" feasible or recommended given the circumstances?

3. I lean towards also wanting the best possible defenses when possible, thats why i was asking for ECM and possibly AMS on the same mech but with enough speed to run for cover when needed. It dont sound like a targetting computer would help me out in my current situation.

4. On my current build, Hunchback 4SP i think, 4 med pulse and 2 SSRM, i would agree with the assumption that my firepower is a bit low, am I correct in understanding that the suggestion would be to replace the 4 med pulse with 5 med lasers and more heat sinks? how woudl this impact the "Ghost heat" i read about? What about going all SSRM to make targeting easier?

1)

Skills on a mech has 3 tiers.
Basic
Elite
Mastery

getting all your basics implies getting all the first skills you can get for that mech in the basic section.
Getting elite is the 2nd tier, you need to get all your basics on 3 different variants of a mech to get to unlock these for your chassis, getting all elites doubles your basics effeciency
getting mastery implies practically getting all your skills but specifically the last one which gives 1 extra module slot
(module slot is a form of 'hardpoint' to a degree that doesn't take any weight, you acn find it in the modules tab for the mechlab. they weigh nothing and stuff, there is 3 types, weapon modules (increase range or fire rate of chosen weapon(s)), general (4x zoom, able to detect nearby mechs when they move if you do not move, loss enemy missile locks as soon as you break line of sight, etc)(and consumable is like airstrike, UAV, etc, the master slot you get can fit either a mech or weapon module)
To get master yyou need 3 mechs of that weight class to get elite. Meaning you can use the same 3 variants or if you got 2 other sets of mediums who got there elite and you sold the others after basics that works too.


2)

well to boat an SSRM 2's you probably need a mech with more then 2 hardpoints. note: not all AC's are built for range, AC 10 is more of a mid range weapon while AC 20 is a brawling weapon. I should mention that if it isn't lag but due to clunkyness or issues aimming only practice can help! if it's really lag then you may need to upgrade your internets as it would help everything overal


3)

I would think so too. Targeting computer is more of a passive offensive kinda thing, better for a slightly minimalistic approach to firepower, trying to make the stuff you got count more, which works better of bigger mechs but a spare ton and slot may be good for a targeting computer 1.

4)

Ghost heat for medium lasers for inner sphere is only when you fire 7 or more medium lasers so all 5 is still okay! to find more about ghostheat Smurfy has a chart of it here. http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/equipment scroll down till yo usee a chart with lots of green and orange/ yellow. A linked group means simular different weapons, for eg an LRM 10, 15, 20, can ghost heat if you fire those 3 at the same time. but if you say have an AC 2, an AC 5, an AC 10 , and an AC 20, you will not ghost heat if you fire all at the same time.Check the ammount of heat you get by quantity btw, sometimes it's just 0.9 more heat, other times it can be 10 more heat. 4 x SRM 6 being fired can be better then say 8 medium lasers. All SSRM 2's can make life easier for aimming but that does make your firepower potentual a bit lower, if you go with this equip a BAP and an AMS and go for a larger Standard engine then the best XL engine that I suggested because even with the biggest XL engine you got to much spare tons.

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 05:24 AM, said:

Along the same line what determines the "quirks" and how/where can i find them out for each mech?

howevering your mouse over them in the mech select screen I think, that or on the info card about the mech at the bottom when you selected a mech (you may need to hit expand), speaking of expand the mechlab has a collum and expanded mode, just an fyi, however expanded requires I think a decent resolution maybe. not quite sure

[NiuqOteen]

As others have said try to play to the Quirks on mechs

Lower the in game mouse sensitivity perhaps helps alot of ppl hold the lazers where they intend to aim.
Change the Zoom to one click for max zoom.

Smart movement helps with survival. Example when looking over a Hill if possible moving sideways as you crest the ridge may help spread lazer damage across arms and side torsos, instead of moving straight up and down.
Or Crossing an opening while firing instead of pop out fire then reverse.

If you want to trade fire try to position so only one mech can shoot back.
Treat every mech as if its much much faster than you, plan your attacks accordingly
Torso twist to shield or spread damage. Fire Twist always expect return fire.


Beagle active probe
Helped me tons while learning the extended sensor range helped me see non Ecm'ed targets.

The HBK is a good mech to learn with imo.
The impressive twist helped me learn maps and common firing lanes. And bringing torso weapons to bear is much easier.
Just enough speed on the stock engine to keep up with the Assaults.
Smaller Size than many IS mediums

The 4sp just did not click for me, the idea of having to get within 260ish to bring full damage to bear was painful.
The 4p was super hot ran it with one LL to provide a long range option, enojyed this variant but had mixed results.
The 4J i found what i liked the LRM's let me project some damage across the field and the Medium lasers let me have some damage up close.
The ability to run upfront and not be too scared of early damage allowed me to vary my play stlye. Till i figured out what i liked doing. Knowing you can take a beating early and still do some damage let me make mistakes.
The 4G i skipped for similar reasons to the 4sp, I guess i like to have range when i dont have speed.

I Treat Lrm;s as a long range option, suppresion weapon.
Just dont be that guy hiding way in the back, behind a rock. If you end a match with full armor your being too passive.

Have to Pick some attributes to find a mech that fits as well.

How much Speed? i personally dont like anything under 70kph as an example. 85+ can be a real asset while learning.
Std or XL engine? I recommend Std engines while learning unless your in a light.
Jump jets?
Preferred fighting range?
Weapon system of choice?
How important is Torso twist speed/Angle ? going from a HBK to an Awesome as you know is worlds different.

Figuring out these things were the keys to more fun.

Edited by NiuqOteen, 02 October 2015 - 12:09 PM.

[Leone]

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

4. On my current build, Hunchback 4SP i think, 4 med pulse and 2 SSRM, i would agree with the assumption that my firepower is a bit low, am I correct in understanding that the suggestion would be to replace the 4 med pulse with 5 med lasers and more heat sinks? how woudl this impact the "Ghost heat" i read about? What about going all SSRM to make targeting easier?

So, this build you speak seems to be a dedicated light hunter. Pulses can be good, cuz quicker burn times means less damage spread and lights can spread damage like nobodies business. I've seen a locust stay engaged with multiple mechs for pretty much the entirety of a ten minute match cuz it was going up against almost all lasers. Also the streaks are a light response weapon. As for ghost heat, it takes seven medium lasers to trigger ghost heat, and inner sphere medium pulses never worry bout it.

The 'classic, Five medium lasers and dual srm 6 the variant sees alot is a mean brawler, a support mech meant to engage heavier opponents with longer burn times that can focus on slower mechs and large srm volleys to pepper larger mechs. Think about your play style when you design your build, do you like hunting lights for your team, or would your rather slug it out with mechs that outweigh you? Build accordingly.

Now, for light hunting, yes I could see slapping an XL engine in that mech, but, for Hunchbacks, that variant is the most standard engine friendly. With the weapons well spread out, rather than focused on one hunch, it still retains half it's firepower when you lose a torso. Food for thought.

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 04:13 AM, said:

2. Next I tried a Awesome, which used up the last of the c-bills i had from before, one on ones went better but it was over the minute something small and fast got behind me. There is a lesson in this for me i am sure.

Assaults are slow and vulnerable. Remember this when you drop in faster mechs and see your team leaving another assault behind. A little help can go along way when the lights come a callin'

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 04:13 AM, said:

3. With this in mind for the weekend I think i want to purchase a fast heavy, or medium with good armor and AMS or ECM that has a lot of energy hardpoints and maybe a few for streaks. Any suggestions? Maybe a Grasshopper? Nova?

My second favourite nova carries three ams, 4k rounds (two tons) there for, twelve er small lasers, and a flamer for playing around with. A mighty sixteen weapon payload for close in brawling specialized in hunting missile mechs and ambushes.

That said, while the nova is completely awesome and my favourite mech, think about your playstyle. The nova does a few things great, but even the storm crow can load twelve small lasers and an assortment of other gadgets. I believe I manged to load three Streak srm 6s on that crow, and while it tore through lights, and provided ample deterrent to heavy mechs with the lasers, it could only get two volleys off before shutting down. The five streak srm 6 is a better light hunter, and the twelve small pulse crow is a better assault hunter. Heck, even the Gargoyle can load up on twelve energy hardpoints if you get the right CT. If you wanna load up on energy weapons Clan style, the Timberwolf, Hellbringer, Cauldron Born, Nova and Gargoyle all go the same speed. The Storm crow is faster. 'Goyle and Nova have the least build options, Hellbringer has ECM, all three have the worst tonnage available due to lack of endosteel, and only Timberwolf and Nova can jump.

Or you could buy an Artic Cheetah and harrass enemy Assaults, but that's not c-bill friendly yet.

Keffer, on 02 October 2015 - 04:13 AM, said:

4. Sorry if i overlooked this in the new player forums but what is the benefit of the clan targeting computers?

Minor range, zoom and crit chance boost. Most pilots I know only grab one level of it.

~Leone, Blackhawk(Nova) Pilot Extraordinaire.

Edited by Leone, 02 October 2015 - 07:54 PM.

[Keffer]

Thanks everyone for the feedback, i got to play several hours this weekend and came to the following conclusions. I was doing this all wrong lol!

1. No matter how much I tried i didnt really end up enjoying myself in the style I have been trying to play. The laser boat and my lack of cordination and internet/computer was getting so frustrating I was ready to give up, SSRM helped and was alright at hunting lights when I could catch one. I was averaging 0 kills and 2 assists a match, damage around 100

2. On a hunch I tried switching out all my SSRM's for LRM 10's and butt loads of ammo, and amazing to myself started to live to the end of the matchs by hanging back, my stats changed to 1-2 kills, 5 or more assists and damage aroudn 250 ish. I stripped out my lasers to add a probe and Artemis

3. next I set my graphics down to the minimums and I tried one of the trial Ravens out, 2 ER large lasers and speedy, ECM I think but not sure, again did much better when I stayed back and waited for a mech coming straight at me, got about the same stats as my LRM boat. So i thought, it would be awesome if i could combine the LRM's and the ER large lasers


So now that I have found a play style I'm enjoying I am looking for a recommendation on a IS and Clan mech that can support a mix of ER large laser for direct fire, a minimum of 2 LRM 15's with Artemis, and have enough speed to stay at long range and enough tonnage to allow for around 5 tons of ammo. Of course now that I am enjoying myself I would like to jump into this mech asap and play more so if it can be done under $30 in cash would also be a good thing as this weekends experments cost me everything i had saved up.

[BeaverOnFire]

I went through the same thing in the beginning, searching for the "right" mech while wasting all my cbills on new mechs. The thing is, it´s hard to find a mech that performs well on basic. (referring to the skill tree)
So i would recommend to stay with one chassis (the hunchi is a good one), find different builts + the right engines and elite them. After that you will recognize an performanceboost.

If you stay with the hunchi, you need three different chassis and three different builts, which is a pretty expensive route to take but in the end it is worth it.

What helped me in the beginning was this site mastering different chassis:

http://metamechs.com...chback/?lang=de

I´m no hunchi expert but an xl engine seems to be important.They are expensive but sooo worth it in the right meh!

[Rogue Jedi]

for IS your only real optios are the Catapult C1
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e745d0c6bf813f2
and the Battlemaster,the 1S
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5ecde441df95371
both can do what you want, most other Mechs cannot mount that weapon loadout with the speed you want

for the Clans there are many options, pretty much any Clan Mech bigger than 50 tones can do that, the best would probably be Stormcrow
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c1e7f7b43e8d83f
Mad Dog, and Timber Wolf, both of which have something close to that as there prime variant stock builds

[Jody Von Jedi]

If you want a speedy mech with LRMs and lasers, I recommend the Trebuchet. I run the 3C just as you describe, but with ML instead of LL and only a single LRM15.

The nice thing about the TBT-3C is it's engine cap of 390! For a 50 ton mech, it's incredibly fast, 123kph with a 360xl. I've chased down many lights with the 3C.

Here is how I run mine.

[Elizander]

If you want a fast SSRM boat then get a stormcrow with 5x SSRM6. Mad Dog can bring 6x SSRM6 with the proper omnipods.

Fast ECM Heavy would be a Hellbringer or CTF-0X (CTF can't bring missiles but has decent energy points).

Gauss is one of the best weapons in the game. I suggest you learn it.

If you want a fast SSRM boat then get a stormcrow with 5x SSRM6. Mad Dog can bring 6x SSRM6 with the proper omnipods.

Fast ECM Heavy would be a Hellbringer or CTF-0X (CTF can't bring missiles but has decent energy points).

Gauss is one of the best weapons in the game. I suggest you learn it.