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Why The Bad Reputation?


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#81 Chef Kerensky

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 05:18 AM

View PostMischiefSC, on 01 April 2016 - 08:18 PM, said:


All true.

1 planet per front. If attacker wins over 50% next planet is a defenders planet next phase. If defender wins next planet is an attacker planet and attacker/defender flip roles.

Cuts lanes in half, removes the "units attack pugs defend " crap, slows rate of world flipping, largely eliminates ghost drops because defending is what gets you an attack lane next phase. If worlds have MC value it helps prevent snaking tags.

Second, let people go loyalist but take "allied deployment" contracts. So NKVA wipes out CSJ, has only quiet fronts. Takes a 2 week deployment to FRR. They stay Kurita, earn Kurita ) LP but are based out of and use FRR lanes for 2 weeks and would make CW groups with FRR deployed units.

So populations can shift to active fronts without throwing out faction identity.

Boom. Better game.


I like these ideas but they won't fit into a tweet so I don't expect to see them come to fruition any time soon

#82 jaxjace

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 08:51 PM

View PostScifi Toughguy, on 02 December 2015 - 12:07 PM, said:

I have only been playing the game for a few months but one thing has stuck out to me (painfully) is the poor reputation Davion has as pilots and a faction. How did this come about and how can we change it?


Because since CW started anyone with any iota of skill has long since left that trainwreck of a faction. Populated by young children, and 50 somethings, neither of which are generally ever any good at the game, their pugs are willfully bad, their tactics ****, their mech building abilty is ****, they have never learned, and will never learn. OH and they tend to not like to actually fight the enemy, prefering to hide in a corner and play like a total *****. In short they suck, have never not sucked, and probably will continue to suck for a long while.

Add that into the fact that they are the "good guys" so many many people just starting out go with them which lowers their average skill and abilities.

They are the participation trophy mechwarriors who have just as much fun losing as winning.

View PostTheSilken, on 02 December 2015 - 09:29 PM, said:

The problem is that the core of Davion is made up of casual lore heads. Nothing wrong with that at all and many are very friendly players but unfortunately their skills are usually lacking compared to other faction's core players since they focus much more heavily on playing the game their own way (as opposed to playing the system) and/or roleplaying. The only way to change the perspective on Davion is if the majority of those players were to change their ways and start playing the game more seriously. Personally I like the Davion charm that these players have created, even if most are complete ****. Posted Image


this

View PostJavin, on 09 December 2015 - 03:48 PM, said:

I truly do not know why Davion has a bad rep. Everyone I meet is pretty friendly, willing to work together, and teach new players.


Teach them what? Davion has literally nothing to contribute in that regard.

View PostFobhopper, on 20 January 2016 - 02:54 PM, said:


And as for those who want to pitch a ***** about davion players using LRM's. LRM's are a damn good weapon system, and can be incredibly effective. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the weapon system itself. Its just not currently 'meta' because of how incredibly strong lasers are in comparison (and the really big problem of laser alpha's that everyone has been bitching about, but dont have an answer too yet), and the mediocre usefulness of AC weapons in comparison to lasers has left everyone and their mother ******** bricks if they see someone who isnt running 3-5 large lasers set to alpha.
As others have said, LRM's have a learning curve, which plateaus for a bit and then goes into a second curve. The first curve being in how to use the system the correct way so that you can consistently hit targets. Which plateaus into knowing which mech to target with LRM's (like not wasting LRM's shooting light mechs, and looking for heavier and slower mechs that will take the full volley like KGC's and DireWolf's). Which leads to the second learning curve of understanding all the maps and which parts of the map you can LRM and which (and where walls are that you missiles will just be a waste) and being able to blindfire missiles that can still hit targets. LRM's just have a steeper learning curve compared to other weapons which are pretty simplistic. Lasers just have to keep the target painted, SRM's and AC weapons need to lead their target by so much depending on the distance. LRM's have to worry about walls and other terrain, ECM, target deprivation module, and that makes it a difficult weapon to make good use out of.


either seriously ill informed or trolling or stupid.

Edited by jaxjace, 03 May 2016 - 08:59 PM.


#83 Karl Marlow

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 09:01 PM

View Postjaxjace, on 03 May 2016 - 08:51 PM, said:


Because since CW started anyone with any iota of skill has long since left that trainwreck of a faction. Populated by young children, and 50 somethings, neither of which are generally ever any good at the game, their pugs are willfully bad, their tactics ****, their mech building abilty is ****, they have never learned, and will never learn. OH and they tend to not like to actually fight the enemy, prefering to hide in a corner and play like a total *****. In short they suck, have never not sucked, and probably will continue to suck for a long while.

Add that into the fact that they are the "good guys" so many many people just starting out go with them which lowers their average skill and abilities.

They are the participation trophy mechwarriors who have just as much fun losing as winning.



this



Teach them what? Davion has literally nothing to contribute in that regard.

But how do you really feel?

Edited by ThomasMarik, 03 May 2016 - 09:02 PM.


#84 jaxjace

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 09:02 PM

View PostThomasMarik, on 03 May 2016 - 09:01 PM, said:

But how do you really feel?


That davions are casual and thats why they lose.

#85 Lyoto Machida

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 09:13 PM

View PostDevlinCognito, on 15 December 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

Unfortunately EVERY house had the misfortune to have players who resorted to such pathetic measures to 'git gud', so I dont think its that.

Personally I think the Davion reputation for being bad has just become a thing now. I've seen some cracking players flying the Sun and Sword as well as terrible ones .. exactly the same as every other faction. We do seem to have a huge amount of pug-les who never seem to have an interest in grouping up which I just dont get, the vast majority of folks who get on the Davion Hub are hugely friendly and normally extremely helpful to new folks, but pug-les are bad everywhere we just have more than the average.

I've been playing as Davion for years and will continue to do so no matter what some random stranger whos opinion I couldnt care less about thinks. When we win they'll be more gutted they got beaten by terrible players, and when we lose we'll do better next time.


Are Davion years like dog years? Only reason I ask is because it's less than 6 human months later and you're flying Clan tags...

#86 Lance425

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 11:36 PM

Devlin was not happy with the way things were going in his old unit. He decided to move on. No harm and no foul.

He'll be flying Kurita tags more than anything else. Which means I'll just get to shoot him in the ***!

#87 Appogee

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 11:49 PM

Simple explanation: Noobs choose Davion because 'Murica.

It's not any more complicated than that.

#88 ShinVector

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 08:31 AM

View PostAppogee, on 03 May 2016 - 11:49 PM, said:

Simple explanation: Noobs choose Davion because 'Murica.

It's not any more complicated than that.


I hear it was Hair Cuts and Hamburgers for some reason.

#89 DevlinCognito

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 09:08 AM

View PostLyoto Machida, on 03 May 2016 - 09:13 PM, said:


Are Davion years like dog years? Only reason I ask is because it's less than 6 human months later and you're flying Clan tags...


After 3 months of being fed ghost drops or rolling any Liao or Marik that deigned to show up I took the quiet time before the 'Saviour of CW That is Phase 3' to do a Mechbay tour, as once you hit Field Marshall there is little point in staying Loyalist if you can't get fights. I figured I'd try to find out why Davion is so hated. Transpired every Faction I went to had its fair share of bads, and the only one that even tries to organise itself as well as Davion was FRR. Kurita and Steiner were generally terrible (with the exception of COMA and LoDD who at least made the effort of using their Faction Hubs and puggle herding). I was going to return home when I got into a poker game with some bad sorts and woke up to find I'd accidentally signed up with 228 and they owned the pink slips to all my Mechs in exchange for a rotten hangover. Sneaky Mercs and their legalese!

View PostAppogee, on 03 May 2016 - 11:49 PM, said:

Simple explanation: Noobs choose Davion because 'Murica.

It's not any more complicated than that.


Which is annoying as Davion was originally written as Space Camelot. Give me spurs and swords over Interstellar tea and crumpets any day. You want Spez' 'murica, go talk to Marik.

#90 MischiefSC

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 12:54 PM

Hey JaxJace, look at the leaderboard. Davion units in the top two pages. How many of those vs any other faction?

HHoD drops more matches than anyone against actual units. TCAF was like 3rd until the queues got merged and terribad Davion pugs flooded back in to throw free wins at them again. Currently they ghost drop 60 v 12 for all of Euro and Oceanic ceasefire to pad those stats.

I get you're bitter but your assertions don't hold up against the stats. There's some solid units in Davion and they play live drops all day, every day, and win more than they lose. What sandbags Davion is the pugs. They're little pellets in a feeder tube waiting sorry someone to hit the bar. When units show up we do great - as the leaderboard shows and that includes the stats of individual members pugging.

When we don't have the lemming pug horde we win against everyone who shows up when we do. We just don't have 60 people on in Oceanic/Euro.

We do have 1euro unit, 31HR. All they play pretty much is TCAF. They'll be in the top 2 pages, what are their stats again? How many members are doing that?

Davion already has enough creepy ex stalkers. Don't get on that boat.

#91 jaxjace

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 02:46 PM

View PostMischiefSC, on 04 May 2016 - 12:54 PM, said:

Hey JaxJace, look at the leaderboard. Davion units in the top two pages. How many of those vs any other faction?

HHoD drops more matches than anyone against actual units. TCAF was like 3rd until the queues got merged and terribad Davion pugs flooded back in to throw free wins at them again. Currently they ghost drop 60 v 12 for all of Euro and Oceanic ceasefire to pad those stats.

I get you're bitter but your assertions don't hold up against the stats. There's some solid units in Davion and they play live drops all day, every day, and win more than they lose. What sandbags Davion is the pugs. They're little pellets in a feeder tube waiting sorry someone to hit the bar. When units show up we do great - as the leaderboard shows and that includes the stats of individual members pugging.

When we don't have the lemming pug horde we win against everyone who shows up when we do. We just don't have 60 people on in Oceanic/Euro.

We do have 1euro unit, 31HR. All they play pretty much is TCAF. They'll be in the top 2 pages, what are their stats again? How many members are doing that?

Davion already has enough creepy ex stalkers. Don't get on that boat.



Stats for the davions are really not that impressive even among the loyalist units. just looking at the faction leaderboard, Davion loses more than it wins. The individual pilots are not that much better. The lemmings as you said are honestly enough for me to say "NOPE" Dont even get me started on their LRM fetish.

#92 MischiefSC

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 03:49 PM

View Postjaxjace, on 04 May 2016 - 02:46 PM, said:

Stats for the davions are really not that impressive even among the loyalist units. just looking at the faction leaderboard, Davion loses more than it wins. The individual pilots are not that much better. The lemmings as you said are honestly enough for me to say "NOPE" Dont even get me started on their LRM fetish.


Like I said. You're way out of the loop. Faction stats plummeted when pugs were mixed back in - prior to that Davion was 3rd. Davion still has the most units as a faction in the top 2 or 3 pages. We're as well represented at a player level as any faction. We just have a lot of bad pugs.

I haven't seen LRMS on a Davion unit drop since I've been back.

Again, leaderboard doesn't lie. Given that we don't have ghost drops padding our stats the units on top of the leaderboard are there for a reason.

I get you had a bad experience a year and a half ago but everyone else moved on, changed, got better. You should too.

Edited by MischiefSC, 04 May 2016 - 03:51 PM.


#93 DevlinCognito

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 03:58 PM

I do need to ask, what exactly are you basing this opinion on? Do you use the Davion TeamSpeak Hub and drop with the regular organised guys? Do you drop solo and try to rambo it with 11 other guys who want to play a team based game mode without any inclination to work as a team? Or are you part of an organised unit visiting Davion that uses its own TS and picks up the odd Davion pug and just expects them to read your mind? I need to ask this as you will have 3 completely differing experiences depending on what box you ticked.

The guys who group up on TS (ts50.bargainvoice.com:7345 if I remember it right, though best to double-check it) are some of the most dedicated and spirited folks around any of the Factions. We used to regularly get roflstomped by full TCAF 12 man's, but people would just ready up and go again to try and do better, and we did get better. There you will find guys who group up every goddamn day, with dedicated DC and they do well with some damn good pilots. Most guys are friendly to new people, and they will encourage/beg new guys and unitless types to not bring Lurms while teaching them the basics, while not ostrasising those who do bring the more.. interesting.. builds.

Soloing in Davion is (like in every Faction) a lesson in increduality. These guys mostly have no interest in working as a team and I've seen things that I can't unsee there. However I saw my first LRM/MG Atlas in Kurita.. attacking Vitric.. as their last Mech. And my first ever LRM Oxide in FRR, so take from this experience what you will.

Dropping as a unit and picking up the odd Davion pug isn't exactly going to give you a good impression either. When playing as a solo with a decently sized team that isn't communicating with you I've seen most solos do their own thing so they aren't just used as pug armour by the organised guys.

If you aren't making the effort to find the decent players, don't expect to have decent games

As for the Loyalist units, all of the Davion Loyalist units barring HHoD are pretty small/not as active in CW (in my timezone which I can only base my experiences on) not helped by the fact that a good few dedicated units went on Mechbay tours and enjoyed the Merc dollar (looking at you HHPG and Cbr1!) so much they are still traveling. HHoD get a lot of stick, but as one of the most active and welcoming units in the game, you need to understand that not every 12 man you see wearing their tags is the same. They aren't elitist, new guys are actively welcomed, but don't think they are all shocking pilots as they have their fair share of guys who can shoot. You will often see bads crowing over beating a 12 man of HHoD, but they don't mention the times they got beat down by them, and speaking from personal experience it isn't uncommon.

#94 ccrider

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 05:17 PM

View PostDevlinCognito, on 04 May 2016 - 03:58 PM, said:

I do need to ask, what exactly are you basing this opinion on? Do you use the Davion TeamSpeak Hub and drop with the regular organised guys? Do you drop solo and try to rambo it with 11 other guys who want to play a team based game mode without any inclination to work as a team? Or are you part of an organised unit visiting Davion that uses its own TS and picks up the odd Davion pug and just expects them to read your mind? I need to ask this as you will have 3 completely differing experiences depending on what box you ticked.

The guys who group up on TS (ts50.bargainvoice.com:7345 if I remember it right, though best to double-check it) are some of the most dedicated and spirited folks around any of the Factions. We used to regularly get roflstomped by full TCAF 12 man's, but people would just ready up and go again to try and do better, and we did get better. There you will find guys who group up every goddamn day, with dedicated DC and they do well with some damn good pilots. Most guys are friendly to new people, and they will encourage/beg new guys and unitless types to not bring Lurms while teaching them the basics, while not ostrasising those who do bring the more.. interesting.. builds.

Soloing in Davion is (like in every Faction) a lesson in increduality. These guys mostly have no interest in working as a team and I've seen things that I can't unsee there. However I saw my first LRM/MG Atlas in Kurita.. attacking Vitric.. as their last Mech. And my first ever LRM Oxide in FRR, so take from this experience what you will.

Dropping as a unit and picking up the odd Davion pug isn't exactly going to give you a good impression either. When playing as a solo with a decently sized team that isn't communicating with you I've seen most solos do their own thing so they aren't just used as pug armour by the organised guys.

If you aren't making the effort to find the decent players, don't expect to have decent games

As for the Loyalist units, all of the Davion Loyalist units barring HHoD are pretty small/not as active in CW (in my timezone which I can only base my experiences on) not helped by the fact that a good few dedicated units went on Mechbay tours and enjoyed the Merc dollar (looking at you HHPG and Cbr1!) so much they are still traveling. HHoD get a lot of stick, but as one of the most active and welcoming units in the game, you need to understand that not every 12 man you see wearing their tags is the same. They aren't elitist, new guys are actively welcomed, but don't think they are all shocking pilots as they have their fair share of guys who can shoot. You will often see bads crowing over beating a 12 man of HHoD, but they don't mention the times they got beat down by them, and speaking from personal experience it isn't uncommon.
Who, us? We aren't dirty mercs, we're, uhhhhh, resistance fighters going where we're needed.



(Immediately looks over faction populations to see where best bonus is for next week's contract....)

#95 Karl Marlow

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 07:07 PM

View Postccrider, on 04 May 2016 - 05:17 PM, said:

Who, us? We aren't dirty mercs, we're, uhhhhh, resistance fighters going where we're needed.



(Immediately looks over faction populations to see where best bonus is for next week's contract....)


Don't forget Marik also provides space bacon in addition to bonus cbills.

#96 ccrider

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 07:16 PM

View PostThomasMarik, on 04 May 2016 - 07:07 PM, said:


Don't forget Marik also provides space bacon in addition to bonus cbills.

If you had Davion quality hair products to match the delicious bacon I'd never leaver the FWL.

#97 Triordinant

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 07:28 PM

Posted Image

#98 DevlinCognito

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 11:02 PM

Quiet CC! We dont want your type round here, fighting for money, messing up the place and hanging around all the decent bars! Get out of here you filthy Merc!

Fancy a pint?

#99 Karl Marlow

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 11:03 PM

View Postccrider, on 04 May 2016 - 07:16 PM, said:

If you had Davion quality hair products to match the delicious bacon I'd never leaver the FWL.
At the rate Davion planets are falling we probably have a surplus somewhere.

#100 MischiefSC

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Posted 05 May 2016 - 12:33 PM

View PostThomasMarik, on 04 May 2016 - 11:03 PM, said:

At the rate Davion planets are falling we probably have a surplus somewhere.

Pfft. To Liao ghost drops. We were handling both Liao and Marik at once until the decision was made to turn the pug tap back on to give you guys someone you could beat. Must have felt like a godsend when the queues were re-merged.

Mariks plan to conquer the inner Sphere by only leaving their drop zone against turrets is a bold strategy. I imagine the Marik command centers are full of heated debates on the best places to hide on every map and creating awards for those rare occasions one of their pilots gets more kills than their dropship does. A rare and special honor.





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