80 replies to this topic

[SC1P1O]

I have played a lot of MWO, Recently, especially after the kodiak release, I have noticed something subtle changed. Maybe its also because I am in tier 1 and meet, on the whole, more competative players. But I think the problem goes deeper than that. I used to be able to use a decent variety of mechs and be competitive, be it jeagermechs, catapults, cicadas, or the like. Now I feel like if you dont run an srm heavy light like the oxide, or run a high alpha assault, medium. You can't really be competitive. Its crazy to go and start a fight with a kodiak 3 and in less than 5 seconds, you can have your left or right torso cored out. Oxides can shoot 4 or 5 alphas before heat even becomes a problem.

The problem is that the stacking of weapons and high alphas is favored and even the ghost heat does not really balance out this abuse. As a result, supper high alphas are the way to win, as apposed to smart play and good teamwork. I feel like MWO is turning into a COD like style of gameplay, losing the strategy in favor of who can alpha the fastest and core out the other player. i.e hide around a corner and watch siesmic, pop out put 70+ damage pop back. It just is slowly killing the game for me, I want to have fun and play a mech other then Meta, but if I want to win I have to use these builds (and to be honest winning is part of having fun), which makes me lose interest in the game, it loses its already dwindling complexity in favor of a low skill cap. Maybe thats the way the game is going, and people like me will just have to find a new outlet. I just hope that PGI seriously takes a look at these meta builds, and tries to add penalties for boating more that 2 of a weapon that has 400+ meter range and greater than 8+ damage.

What do you guys think, is the meta robbing the joy out of MWO for you?

[Zibmo]

I would have to say it's not the mechs, for me. It's the players. I am despondent over the lack of skill I see these days. In fact, I'm more than despondent. Aside from TTK being ridiculously low, the playerbase is actually getting worse. Sigh.

[Mystere]

To fight the "meta" yesterday, I brought out my Awesomes. Much fun was had.

[Fox With A Shotgun]

SRM jenners are already hard countered by good scouting and zoning. If they can get the drop on your team they're deadly, but otherwise they go down like any other light mech. A strong PPFLD alpha to the CT (they're still mostly CT after all) will easily blow one up, and staring at a firing line usually deters them; as does having Radar Deprivation beep whenever they're approaching an enemy they think is unaware.

As for high alphas, the problem is that most players tend to facetank damage instead of observing what the enemy has. Big alpha damage tends to be either short-ranged, very hot, or both. Black Knight got loads of MPLs? Don't walk into his sights. Go around or back off. Timber Wolf got loads of ERLL / LPL? Get the lights on the case to dance around him, making him throw half his damage into the dirt thanks to long burn times and slow traverse. Loads of SRMs? Kite. There are counters to them.

[SC1P1O]

I cant really tell with the players, although the skill gap is very high, even though the skill level is relatively low.

[Metus regem]

Due to my play-style of efficiently killing my target's, rather than being a damage hose, I'm down in T4, and I actually feel bad for the guys I fight as I am usually the one doing the lion's share of the killing (4-5 KMDD in my Warhammers), but since I favor PPFLD, I kill to efficiently, meaning the end match score punishes me with low scores....

[Darian DelFord]

JR7-D

"Alicia" strongly disagrees that the Oxide is the only Jenner that can turn a match.


An Oxide maybe able to shoot 4 to 5 alphas before heat becomes prevalent however they have to be within 75 meters to really do any damage.

Edited by Darian DelFord, 30 May 2016 - 05:47 PM.

[SC1P1O]

I agree that communication helps, but most teams you play with in a pug drop are not communicating, and the matches tend to be lop sided. One team clearly better than the other. So I would say that communication is a week arguement because you can not control in a random who will be on your team. As for the alphas, of course its not a good idea to poke, but with a 80 damage alpha from a kdk 3 you dont have time to torso twist, and if you do you lose the arm and the next 80 double tab goes right trhough the ct

Darian DelFord, on 30 May 2016 - 05:47 PM, said:

JR7-D

"Alicia" strongly disagrees that the Oxide is the only Jenner that can turn a match.


An Oxide maybe able to shoot 4 to 5 alphas before heat becomes prevalent however they have to be within 75 meters to really do any damage.

Also oxides are actualy best at 180m to face hump range, i have had games in oxides where its 4 - 5 kills 1k damage. you just have to wait for your two teams to engange and then have a field day coring fatties from the back

Edited by SC1P1O, 30 May 2016 - 05:56 PM.

[White Bear 84]

SC1P1O, on 30 May 2016 - 05:37 PM, said:

The problem is that the stacking of weapons and high alphas is favored . As a result, supper high alphas are the way to win, as apposed to smart play and good teamwork. I feel like MWO is turning into a COD like style of gameplay, losing the strategy in favor of who can alpha the fastest and core out the other player. i.e hide around a corner and watch siesmic, pop out put 70+ damage pop back.

Inherently the core problem with MWO gameplay; but this comes down to how the game is designed. You give players the freedom to make what they want, then when the chance to boat weapons for maximum firepower comes, that is what you get...

[Octantis]

Oxides have been around for ages as well as the builds. The current Jenner 2c and Oxide spam is a side effect of a strong Kodiak3. The paper to the Kodiak's Rock is a fast mech who can hit and fade.

If the Kodiak goes so will the Jenners.

That being said the game is in a pretty bad place at the moment. I'll take a week or two off and see if things have changed.

[Airwind]

wait till they release the mounted long tom. competitiveness will be back. 1shot everything.

[Chuck Jager]

White Bear 84, on 30 May 2016 - 05:57 PM, said:

Inherently the core problem with MWO gameplay; but this comes down to how the game is designed. You give players the freedom to make what they want, then when the chance to boat weapons for maximum firepower comes, that is what you get...

And then try to balance that with players who think playing football/soccer in a team sport on a muddy field without cleats is fighting the META. It is the bad builds and refusal to use mediocre options that also adds to the range between mechs and disparity in teams..

I have found the hard ways with sales that many times the fewer choices the better. You just need the illusion of choice. My experience not my real desire)

Edited by Chuck Jager, 30 May 2016 - 06:52 PM.

[Darian DelFord]

SC1P1O, on 30 May 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

Also oxides are actualy best at 180m to face hump range, i have had games in oxides where its 4 - 5 kills 1k damage. you just have to wait for your two teams to engange and then have a field day coring fatties from the back

At 180 meters the SRM spread is to large. The only thing you are going to hit are the Torso's and Arms, which is spread over 5 and 6 components if you count the head. You only core fatties from the back if they do not have situational awareness. Skill on Skill assaults win the majority of engagements.

The only reason the OXIDE does as well as it does is they attack when an enemy is distracted or makes a mistake which happens often. However the same can be said for most other mechs, that have a target that is other wise engaged with another.

[SC1P1O]

Yes, but the oxide alpha and quick rate of fire is what sets it apart, that with its low heat penalty for alphas makes it better than laser lights.

Also for any light on light fight, oxide will win 90% of time. It is I think one of the best light mechs in the game atm.

But I agree on the assaults, if they are decent. I kill oxides like cake with the kdk-3 one double tap and they are dead or very close to it.

Edited by SC1P1O, 30 May 2016 - 07:27 PM.

[Green Mamba]

Well if they would switch them to cbills instead of only just MC they would probably be inclined to balance them then

[MadHornet]

"Its crazy to go and start a fight with a kodiak 3 and in less than 5 seconds, you can have your left or right torso cored out."

I recently face tanked a fresh Kodiak that had 4 Ultra 10's. In a Centurion A. And won.

[MischiefSC]

Zibmo, on 30 May 2016 - 05:41 PM, said:

I would have to say it's not the mechs, for me. It's the players. I am despondent over the lack of skill I see these days. In fact, I'm more than despondent. Aside from TTK being ridiculously low, the playerbase is actually getting worse. Sigh.

No, the abject failure of Phase 3 for FW to be anything like the original promise plus PGIs perpetual apathy about making significant changes on anything but a 2 year cycle has gotten the bulk of long time players to more or less leave. They show up for league play and play in private matches but MWO itself is just a mech pack mill and PGI has spent years making it clear they lack either the skillbase or the drive to make a real game out of it.

So it's not that the players have gotten worse, just most the vets are leaving.

Wanna buy a mech pack?

[Nik Reaper]

You know what makes the Oxide so good? The missile quirks are good and all but that lovely +100% leg structure is really nice... so not only is it cool and burst-y it also has the combined leg HP of a medium mech and some smaller and larger extra structure on top parts.

So what is there not to like, they beefed it up to a medium with a lights movement profile and size... Oh and yeah it's on 50% sale, buy it now!

The whole thing is reminiscent of the Hugin before what ever happened to that mech...

Edited by Nik Reaper, 30 May 2016 - 09:23 PM.

[kesmai]

Still not as bad ad hexa ppc stalkers or the high times of poptarting.

[Mystere]

ARP Haruna, on 30 May 2016 - 09:46 PM, said:

Still not as bad ad hexa ppc stalkers or the high times of poptarting.

I have already seen people say otherwise, and you can include me with them.