16 replies to this topic

[naterist]

Ok guys, theres a lot of smart and experienced people in these forums. I challange each and every one of you to create a set of strategies that are simple, and easily explained and easily remembered for FW pugs to use. In QP its easy to do a simple strategy n solo que, someone on HPG says "rush basement" and everyone knows what to do. They go to the basement, and gaurd the doors. Can we get several strategies listed here for PUGS to use in CW? Im hoping itll make pug matches more than just a speedbumb for units(cough, cjf, end cough).

[Marquis De Lafayette]

This is a decent idea, but would be quite extensive and not all good players would agree on any strategies recommended.

None the less I will add my 2 cents. They aren't all technically strategies, but should help new folks coming over from QP


1. Bring a deck that favors the map you are on: boreal tends to favor range, virtic favors cool builds, high mounts make life a lot better on grim portico (and everywhere really)

Unlike quick play where you are locked into what you are bringing, you can know the map you are going to and modify your deck accordingly. Just have a game plan going in as you often won't have long to modify.

2. Become familiar with some terminology regarding the maps: "wall of shame" on virtic for example. It doesn't take long and just ask other pilots if you don't know. Everyone has to learn this stuff sometime. Non-map related terminology is important as well. Things like "gen-rush", "split-push", "push out with wave 1 mechs" and "do not reinforce" are basic things to understand Map grid coordinates are used to direct more in FW as well. So it's important to pay attention. If you don't know any of these, again just ask. You might get a few eye rolls or a few comments over voip. But hey we all were new once.

3. Better to do a dicey strategy together than go your own way alone. There is a far better chance you will win doing something (you think is) stupid all together. The other team might be stupid as well, or you might have the element of surprise. Now if you do smart things together this mode is really fun. Teamwork is OP in this mode. This is far more team based than QP.

4. It's basic...(but I have seen folks who don't know): New players do need to learn where to shoot the gens and omega. There is a little box you have to hit inside of on the gens and omega is can only be hit from behind after the gens are already all down.

[MovinTarget]

Marquis covered a lot of great universally applicable points. I will add:

5. Even if you can't speak on comms for whatever reason please LISTEN to comms and if nothing else, stay with the group.


I will not beat this drum as angrily as some, but PLEASE don't bring LRM-focused mechs unless you:

1) Bring people that know they should be spotting for your (TAG/NARC/BAP/etc)
2) you bring plenty of backup weapons (and TAG/NARC/BAP)
3) know to stay with the group
4) know the map you are dropping on favors them (Boreal, yes! Grim Portico, not really!)

LRMs are an *awesome* force multiplier when the whole team is coordinated around them, but when you are on your own they are slow to lock, slow to kill and ineffective/less effective at <180m.

Like Marquis said, you get to know the map ahead of time, prep your decks for it.


If you can afford them, Seismic Sensor modules (with the Adv.Seismic skill unlocked) is probably the most valuable module. Period.

Finally, I know that some people simply feel that can't do more than pug drop FP and that's cool, but it gets WAY more fun and your success improves when you drop with friends.

Edited by MovinTarget, 30 September 2016 - 06:34 AM.

[xX PUG Xx]

Both Marquiss and Movin' have the general points and i have added a few more below. However each map has multiple options depending on defence, attack, organised opposition, Drop Deck compositions, and on and on and on. This thread could become very long

6. FOCUS FIRE: (helped by using or listening to VOIP or Teamspeak)

Learn to shoot what your allies are shooting at: there is a reason that 8-12 man premade group just destroyed your 'Mech in less than three seconds, they were focusing all of their weapons fire on you and that is between 300 and 500 points of damage. KA-Booooom!!

7. Don't go full Rambo:

There will be times, especially on an attack, that you will be required to "push" an enemy position and you will be exposed to enemy fire. However this should always be done with the team and not alone, unless there is no other option or you are about to die anyway. Running solo through the gate may feel like a "glorious charge" but in reality you will meet number 6 above and that 500 point alpha strike.

8. Be mindful of your surroundings:

This is a good general "skill" to learn whether you are playing QP or FP: constantly check your peripheral views (the extreme sides of your monitor screen) for movement, your mini map and even listen for movement (yes you can hear 'Mechs moving, jump jetting, charging their Gauss if you listen carefully).

The mini map and peripheral checks are also a good habit to reduce the chance of "blocking" a friendly 'Mech, either from firing at an enemy or simply moving around/back from a corner.

9. Knowledge is power:

Use the Training Grounds to look around the FP maps in a "safe" environment and with plenty of time to check out map grids, objective positions and possible firing lanes. Check for videos on YouTube/Twitch etc. showing possible tactics and effective builds for particular maps. Check out the community created CW/FP guides, some may be slightly out of date but will still give new players a good starting point for that knowledge base.

Edited by xX PUG Xx, 30 September 2016 - 07:04 AM.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Sub-point to #9:
As knowledge is indeed power.

Ask questions of good players & spectate on good players (after you are dead).

I dropped a bunch with the #1 ranked loyalist pilot when I was still relatively new in the game... Guy was/is a killing machine. So, I figured I better learn a few things from him.
You won't be able to emulate it all, but you will see how they get to better results by watching them and comparing vs your own play.

Also, ask about builds, decks and stuff as well if you have time in queue or in TS. Most good pilots are pretty good about answering questions.

[Bud Crue]

Not so much strategy as practical suggestions that have been beaten into me:

When someone says conga line the left gate gen, that means: Everyone...EVERYONE, goes in a line to get that left gate gen down. The point is to get the gate down quickly and share the damage. It does not mean let the two guys closest do it with no support. That leads to you being mechs down when you push through. That's way worse than if all of you are at 92% when you go through.

Also learn which gate is which (alpha, beta, gamma) and which is left right or center.

When someone takes the lead, just shut up and listen. If you start offering your brilliant suggestions be prepared to hear everyone else's too at the cost of having any leadership.

Pick two people to call targets (one is better, but hey). Call letter designation, type and if possible weak location. If 6 people are calling targets then you may be spreading damage at 6 different targets. That's bad. When the target caller calls a target...shoot at that target, not some other potential target.

If the lead calls for a gen rush on the third wave because you got your butts kicked the first to waves, don't stop to engage the baddies. You are losing, and you're losing because the other side has proven that they are better at smashing mechs than you. So now is not the time to convince yourself that this is your moment to shine. Just run and shoot em as you go by...but go by. Use arty strikes on turrets as they pop up and focus gens together.

I'm sure others have more.

edit: default command: in the absence of orders always regroup never reinforce.

Edited by Bud Crue, 30 September 2016 - 08:15 AM.

[MovinTarget]

Bud Crue, on 30 September 2016 - 08:14 AM, said:

edit: default command: in the absence of orders always regroup never reinforce.

OMG this this this! SO MUCH THIS!

Even if you see that there are still 6 guys inside on your team, the chances are that they will melt by the time you get to them. 90% of the time the defenders can reinforce faster and more effectively so unless there are only a handful of enemy left at the end of the game you will serve you team better by being part of a wave of 12 fresh mechs rather than throwing mechs away trying to "save" the last wave.

Edited by MovinTarget, 30 September 2016 - 09:15 AM.

[Memnon Valerius Thrax]

hurra, the 20th CW Pug Fred Guide in that Forum....... you guys know that nobody will play CW if PGI dont work at it?

[naterist]

I recently switched almost exclusively to FW since the event, so i believe that the above statement is untrue, it just needs people to be active in order for it to work well, maybe it could use some tweaks, but its a fun and above all, challenging mode.

One thing ive learned recently, its important that at least somebody call, it doesnt matter much who, even if its a persons first time, but a team of einstein individuals vs. A group led by dumb and dumber is going to be more fun and probably more likely to win if your on the team with a drop caller. So if no one volunteers, step up. Calling isnt much of a skill. You just gotta pick a position, decide when to yell charge, and call the groups targets 1 by 1.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Memnon Valerius Thrax, on 30 September 2016 - 09:34 AM, said:

hurra, the 20th CW Pug Fred Guide in that Forum....... you guys know that nobody will play CW if PGI dont work at it?

While we rightly bemoan experienced FW players leaving.. New players do join and I believe the community should do whatever we can to support new folks making the transition from quick play and so these topics need revival from time to time.

We do need new blood as inevitably some players will move on to other games no matter what PGI does.

[Davegt27]

someone started a thread on FW etiquette

when you first enter the que look at your team you want to know if there are any teams on your side
it might be a 2, 3, or more man teams

the proper etiquette is the team with the most members (unit tags) calls the shots that is the ones with the greater same unit tags will be in charge of the drop--you will follow there lead

if they defer taking command then it falls to the next highest number unit tags

so in the que never get tired of saying/typing "228 or PS, 313 do you want command for this drop"

the next thing in the que is to ask for the TS (team speak) address have a ink pen ready
even if you don't get on with them you want to book mark as many as you can (for later use)


the next thing is the order of the Mechs you drop with
we used to type bring your killers the first 2 drops, the reason we don't say heaviest Mechs is because some pilots are super good in lights and can really help the team even in alight but you really don't want more then 1 or 2 lights in the first two drops
same goes for missile boats
(we really don't want you to bring missile boats but understand some people have to try it for themselves)

for the most part bring your heaviest best mechs the first 2 drops
the reason for this is you need the armor and if you get behind on the Mech count its hard to catch up

after you drop you might hear "PS" you guys drop calling this match?
they will either say yeah we got it or they might defer
I will usually say something like I will be drop calling for this match

some teams wont say anything if I say I am drop calling and a team refuses to follow my commands I don't argue
I shut up and wait for the next drop

I never argue there is not enough time to argue if I get any disagreement I shut up and wait for the next drop

another bit of etiquette is the person that speaks up first gets to command or follow his plan
the reason is time--there is not enough time to discuss which way to go

I try to support the guy in command with a verbal "roger"
saying "roger" helps solidify command and tells others its ok to follow this guy

HTHs

[naterist]

That was THE most imformative wall of text ive ever read dave. Ive always kinda wondered about the drop order.

[justcallme A S H]

naterist, on 30 September 2016 - 10:28 AM, said:

I recently switched almost exclusively to FW since the event, so i believe that the above statement is untrue, it just needs people to be active in order for it to work well, maybe it could use some tweaks, but its a fun and above all, challenging mode.

One thing ive learned recently, its important that at least somebody call, it doesnt matter much who, even if its a persons first time, but a team of einstein individuals vs. A group led by dumb and dumber is going to be more fun and probably more likely to win if your on the team with a drop caller. So if no one volunteers, step up. Calling isnt much of a skill. You just gotta pick a position, decide when to yell charge, and call the groups targets 1 by 1.

This is a brilliant thread on the topic


http://mwomercs.com/...best-practices/

[Albino Boo]

Two things to add.

1. Not all unit drops are good. Just because they have groups with units tags don't assume they will be better coordinated than average. If more than one unit is in there dont assume they even speak the same language


2. Unless you know you are better at trading than the other team dont poke. You can't break a firing line on the attack by poking at it. 12 mechs pushing stands a better chance of breaking a firing line than poking at them. On defence make them come out of cover and just run down the clock by waiting from them to poke you. They should get hit by more damage when they poke than by poking them. That last sentence was brought to you by innuendo, the game for all the family.

[RG Wolf Vickers]

If pick ups would just follow a few simple guidelines they as well as the team they are with would have a much more enjoyable game. Likely been mentioned but I will re hash the most important from my perspective.

1. Do not reinforce on attacks. Hold, outside the gate and out of sight of the gate. Don't think your large laser is doing anything helpful from 1800 meters.

2. Stick with the green dots on your cockpit map. When they move, you move.

3. Match your first drop with the rest of your lance. Lance mates all showing Timbers first drop? Get out of your Mist Linx.

4. If someone steps up to call drops follow along or call the next one. The Captain hindsight role, the endless pessimist role etc. are toxic, keep that to yourself and learn from mistakes.

Moving with the team, following along with group strategy is twice as valuable as your damage / kill output at the end of the match.

READ AGAIN- Moving with the team, following along with group strategy is twice as valuable as your damage / kill output at the end of the match.

Then enjoy a different style of game play where self preservation does not trump selflessness. Good luck!

Edited by RG Wolf Vickers, 05 October 2016 - 09:03 AM.

[naterist]

ok, ive come up with a solid strategy for defense that i think PUGs can use while pugging it.

THE GATE TO GEN DEFENSE
this strategy is very basic, easy for people to follow, and I think it would be effective. when drop caller says gate to gen defense, it means everyone goes to a point between the two gates, with the goal of trying to cover both as long as they can. when they die, instead of rushing off to the fight, respawns regroup in front of or around omega. the goal is to whittle down the opposing force from an entrenched firing line that can cover both gates, and after death, immideatly reforming a firing line. that way, even if the first wave on the enemy team breaks through our initial defense, thewyll be so hurt that they wont stand a chance against the second line of defense, due to them being whittled down and hopefully short a man or two at least, it will be 12(defense) vs. 1-11 hurt enemies(offense). and the defense line will be fresh.

thoughts, opinions, will it work?


edit:i see this working on larger maps like boreal vault, not so much hellebore springs or sulfourus rift.

Edited by naterist, 08 October 2016 - 12:45 PM.

[Marquis De Lafayette]

This basic idea is pretty commonly used on Emerald by both IS and Clan alike. The DC (dropcaller) in my experience calls the map coordinates and/or just says set up between the gates. It's really the "default" defense. You just have to be able to reposition to defend the gens quickly if they just run up one of the sides.. which is often the case. The guys who are last to die (and last to re-drop) can provide fire on enemies coming around the back in support of the wave 2 guys at omega or the gens. So, what you suggest works pretty well on this map.

On Boreal it is also used some. I used to see it more on the IS side, as the IS generally prefers shorter range engagements.. however, many IS assaults are too slow to get there before the clans get through, especially on counter attack defense when the gates are already open. I have seen Clan teams use the between the gates strategy on this map more of late, as they can get there with their faster mechs. However, it has been a mixed bag when I see this. The KDK-3 is a monster in the role of holding the gates at those ranges, but it also easy to focus down. This tactic does also give up the clan edge at range. . So, idk if I like it as well on the clan side on this map, which seriously favors range.

Like many things in this game execution and teamwork matter more than the overall strategy. Which is the weakness of PUG teams,even if they are made up of individually talented pilots. If you are going to set up between the gates you do need everyone's support to do it.