Sopa/Pipa, NDAA 2012, Patriot Act, Alien and Sediction Acts. Anyone else looking at this and get the urge to watch V for Vendetta?
First Amendment: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
I ain't gonna say that your feelings are an overreaction, because... they're not. It's important to get angry about crap like this, because anger=involvement, and that's how democracy works or does not work - if people don't get involved when bad things go down.
But historically, governments have ALWAYS sought more power, and the good thing about our form of government is that it tends to defeat and destroy bills like this - if not immediately, then down the road.
We have had MUCH worse laws on the books in the past, and far more terrible excesses taken by our government in the past - read up on some of the crap done during the 1960s, or even the actions taken by Lincoln during the Civil War, or the internment of Japanese-American citizens during WW2 (the government sent a young George freakin' Takai to an internment camp!) to get some historical perspective.
Yes, it's a bad bill, and yes, it should go down in flames, but much worse has happened in the past. Our country isn't going to hell in a handbasket; it's just that there are some bad eggs in the government, just as there always HAVE been, and just as there always WILL be.
I ain't gonna say that your feelings are an overreaction, because... they're not. It's important to get angry about crap like this, because anger=involvement, and that's how democracy works or does not work - if people don't get involved when bad things go down.
But historically, governments have ALWAYS sought more power, and the good thing about our form of government is that it tends to defeat and destroy bills like this - if not immediately, then down the road.
We have had MUCH worse laws on the books in the past, and far more terrible excesses taken by our government in the past - read up on some of the crap done during the 1960s, or even the actions taken by Lincoln during the Civil War, or the internment of Japanese-American citizens during WW2 (the government sent a young George freakin' Takai to an internment camp!) to get some historical perspective.
Yes, it's a bad bill, and yes, it should go down in flames, but much worse has happened in the past. Our country isn't going to hell in a handbasket; it's just that there are some bad eggs in the government, just as there always HAVE been, and just as there always WILL be.
You forgot the Alien and Sediction Acts
You're right of course, and I wish more people would have the sense to see things this way. Bad bills go through government, and sometimes they even become law, but it doesn't mean the universe is going to unravel, or our society implode. We're too smart for that, so as a society, we tend not to cling to bad decisions.
That's probably why, in almost every way possible, our society is better than it's ever been. The US today is better in every way possible (sans some environmental damage ) than it was a century ago, and a century ago, it was better in every possible way than it was in 1800.
In 2100, I imagine the same will be able to be said as compared to today.
You are right we are smart, but that doesn't mean we won't do dumb things. Hitler rose to power through ignorance and hate and let me tell you every genocide starts with a label.
You are right we are smart, but that doesn't mean we won't do dumb things. Hitler rose to power through ignorance and hate and let me tell you every genocide starts with a label.
Four posts in and Godwin's Law comes knocking at the door huh? If we want to go by strictly what was set down by the constitution and it's ammendments how about we toss out everything the government does for us now that isn't technically in it. Let's see how much we can cut spending by doing that.
From someone in the UK, you're not alone. There's all sorts of nasty back-room laws being drafted in almost every country around the world to benefit the greedy few.
You are right we are smart, but that doesn't mean we won't do dumb things. Hitler rose to power through ignorance and hate and let me tell you every genocide starts with a label.
Hitler rose to power for a lot of reasons. The single biggest was because France and England hung the entire first World War around Germany's neck (even though they had nothing to do with starting it), and then demanded crushing war indemnities, which, combined with the Great Depression, turned Germany into a living hell. It was the perfect environment for nationalism to flourish.
Hitler was very smart, because he attracted followers by making sure they got treatment they couldn't get anywhere else. Youth who joined the Nazis got jam, butter, luxuries you couldn't get anywhere else (probably cost the Nazis a fortune), but the result was that the ranks of the party were soon burgeoning.
Basically, he took advantage of a combination of economic hardship, bad treatment by the international community, fear over terrorism, it was a myriad of problems, which I won't go into detail with here. Hitler also wasn't taken as a serious threat by the existing government. They threw him in jail, and then let him go like 6 months later or something.
Today that just wouldn't happen, for all sorts of reasons. The conditions aren't nearly desperate enough (believe me, life in the US is a cakewalk compared to post-WWI Germany), people are vastly better educated, access to information is better, and frankly, our government is set up a little better.
Problems we have, but our political system has really survived a lot rather unscathed.
SeDevri, on 08 March 2012 - 02:23 PM, said:
go check out the site www.prisonplanet.tv trust me if you think your worried now, you'll be scared sick after seeing this ****.
Honestly, you needn't worry. I know a lot more about most of what Alex Jones talks about than Alex Jones does (not that that makes me unique; anyone who bothers to do any research does), from 9/11 conspiracy theories to his absurd notions on climate change. He's just a silly old nut
I recommend you critically look into his claims at some point; you'll find reality rather poorly reflects his notions. Extremists on both sides of the political spectrum are like that, probably because reality has a way of being somewhere in the middle.
Don't care, peaceful occupations won't change anything anyway. Did the USA become a country from peacefully occupying north America? Was ww2 won by peacefully occupying Europe? If the bill does pass I bet people will just stand by and say aww that sucks but do nothing about it.
LOL, I didn't ask for an essay I know the story behind Hitlers rise and the world wars. I simply wanted to say people do stupid things for many different reasons. For all it mattered I could have done a comparison with that poor sap that left the river gate open in Babylon, he screwed up big time. (probably drunk from partying XD).
Tsk Tsk Paul, you waskaly wabbat. We have viking mechs, all you can drink mead halls, and women with beards. What more can you ask for.
Its not as much anger as much as remorse. Anger solved nothing. I'm sorry to most of you who are my age, but my generation is kinda dumb and surprisingly lazy.. There is no point in getting angry at things like this.
Yes, there has been worst. But its that matter that society and the idealized populous is different then 40 years ago. We've had alot more social training. Remember the smarter someone thinks they are the easier they are to control.
My hope is they we make it past the last two generations of politicians. The fact that these people are voted in and write laws like this make me wonder.
I'm in the position of saying.... if they ever decide to act on these bills which ignore the highest law of the land AKA the constitution, then we might get put in a rather poor position in the future.
But we're nothing but numbers in a corporate fascism to them. We go about our lives. Be born, go to school, get a job until you die, (unless the baby boomers somehow don't kill retirement for the rest of us) Repeat after me; "I am free."
While you might argue we are; it is now illegal to be homeless, if you're not able to find a shelter, too bad. sleeping on the streets? jail. in the forest? jail. And god forbid you try to sleep in a public park. jail.
wandering at night because you have no where to sleep? oh hey its a vagrant. jail.
Try to seek shelter in an abandoned building? jail.
Forget your wallet with your ID at home? Jail and may be labeled a terrorist for not having your ID.
Keep a stockpile of food in your house in case of an emergency? Oh hey now you get to go to jail and might be labeled a terrorist for this too.
own a variety of guns? as above.
Keep more than 100 rounds of ammunition? above.
And now soon it will be illegal to protest near government officials. Thank you whitehouse tresspass law thing.
But hey it's not all bad news in this country, if you're a police officer you can handcuff a guy, push him to the ground, and shoot him in the back till he's dead and only get 1 year in prison.
Also, if you're caught hacking by the FBI, have your family threatened by them, cooperate with them, you'll only face a maximum of 124 years in prison.
-"I am free?" I think not.
While social change has been quite apparent in the USA, and by all accounts equal rights are becoming more and more a reality, there are still social bounds which state that an individual should act within a societal 'norm' and if you act outside the norm, say you're gay/bi/trans, or you find it entertaining to sing instead of speak, or perhaps you're a guy who likes pink, perhaps you just prefer to dance to a random beat, while out on the street, or merely add rhymes in sync, you can be labeled as an outcast and therefore are denied equality by those around you as we still have not achieved a truly open-minded, tolerant society. By all accounts, there are some 'psychological disorders' which I'm not quite sure how they are. Like those with ADHD for example. When most of them 'grow out of it by adulthood', then how is it a psychological disorder? Being more energetic than the norm is a disorder.
Or Aspbergers for another. While there is more for it in some cases, I know of cases where parents will have their children diagnosed with it for merely being more interested in social activity online rather than face-to-face, and getting welfare off of it.
Other cases are saying that it is a disease to have a different gender identity than what is your physical sex. Really now; so say my mind doesn't see me as male or female mentally or spiritually, does that automatically mean that OMG I have a psychological disorder and need treatment? Hardly. Given homosexuality is present in other mammals, and has been in human society since before recorded history, I highly doubt it is outside of what is normal in the animal kingdom. Yet still society is still shunning ****/bisexuals. And while strides are being taken for legal acceptance, western religions are still highly intolerant of it. As such the hatred and intolerance continues.
Even if we were legally free, we still are not free so long as our neighbors won't allow us to be as such.
One last bit;
[color=#000000]
Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by a difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be deprecated.[/color]
[color=#000000]
GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Sir Edward Newenham, Oct. 20, 1792
However [political parties] may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion.
GEORGE WASHINGTON, Farewell Address, Sep. 17, 1796
[/color]
[color=#000000]
Government is not reason, it is not eloquence, it is force; like fire, a troublesome servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action.
GEORGE WASHINGTON, attributed, Upton Sinclair's The Cry for Justice
A people contending for life and liberty are seldom disposed to look with a favorable eye upon either men or measures whose passions, interests or consequences will clash with those inestimable objects.
GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to General Thomas, Jul. 23, 1775
It is a maxim, founded on the universal experience of mankind, that no nation is to be trusted farther than it is bound by its interest; and no prudent statesman or politician will venture to depart from it.
GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Henry Laurens, Nov. 14, 1778
Let your heart feel for the afflictions and distresses of every one, and let your hand give in proportion to your purse; remembering always the estimation of the widow's mite, but, that it is not every one who asketh that deserveth charity; all, however, are worthy of the inquiry, or the deserving may suffer.[right] GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Bushrod Washington, Jan. 15, 1783
Observe good faith and justice towards all Nations.[right] GEORGE WASHINGTON, Farewell Address to the people of the United States, Sep. 17, 1796
LocationLooking for hidden caches, within the BT Novels™
Posted 09 March 2012 - 01:19 PM
Shrekken, on 08 March 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:
From someone in the UK, you're not alone. There's all sorts of nasty back-room laws being drafted in almost every country around the world to benefit the greedy few.
Ahhh, england, and the rest of it too. Shakes head. You think things are bad, they have kids calling on their parents to the SocialServices for jokes the kids started. Can't even have a water fight in the garden without the SS knocking on the door the next day, police in tow. This is from experience. I lost count of the number of laws they broke that day. Thankfully it was a one off, but you hear stories you know. Then it happens to you. Shakes head.
And that's just on the social level. The things going on in government. There's a reason they call it politics.
Poly - Many, Numerous.
Tick - Blood sucking creatures.
Do a little fussion dance, ala DBZ, and you have Politics.
Sopa/Pipa, NDAA 2012, Patriot Act, Alien and Sediction Acts. Anyone else looking at this and get the urge to watch V for Vendetta?
First Amendment: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
The safeguards put in place by the people whom built our countries. IE, the US Constitution, so many bills have been passed that give the govt the ok to ignore it and do what they want anyway. This is exactly what the constitution as put in place to prevent, because, as im sure you've noticed, when they skip the constitution to put in new laws, all of the laws that are put in are ones that restrict personal security, privacy and freedoms in the name of national security and "anti terrorism"
Did you know that Australia has a constitution? I did not untill about 1 year ago. That is how "hush hush" it is over here. I've taken the test and asked randoms if they think Aus has a constition, most laughed and said no that's what the US has, only a few said yes we do.
Did you know that they've recently passed a law over here that allows the Govt to steralise kids, within a 48 hour period, without the parents consent? If the child mentions it to the parent, and the parent inquires as to what the hell is going on - they're told to get lost unless they're a qualified psych.
http://www.naturalne...n_children.html
Yes yes, most of you are probably thinking "Well retards shouldent breed anyway" - thats how the law starts. Exactly like SOPAA. "This law is purely to protect copyrights and intellectual property!" - you watch it get used to censor alternate media, anti govt-propoganda sites (This would be Ron Paul sites, or did you think they were joking when they called him "Dangerous" to "Their Establishment"?) Oh, just a note, did you know the punishment for downloading 1 pirated movie under SOPAA law's would give you more jail time than a Rapist? Totaly justified, right? (/end scarcasm)
Now for the hard stuff.
Did you know in Nazi Germany they put Flouride in the water supply to make the prisoners more docile. Not less aggressive so to speak... just.. uh.. Lethargic? ITs hard to explain, i guess the best way is, if the water was not flouridated, you americans would have run you're own govt out and forced and entire new fill for them even considering to sign that SOPAA bill, and others (such as the one that allows the US to detain indefinately, their own citizens, and torture them if they think they're a terrorist. oh, if you have more than 3days supply of food in you're house, you're a potential terrorist too, so that means they can do it to anyone they damnwell wish as the "whos a potential terrorist" indicators apply to 99% of the entire worlds population. Did you know that disagreeing with Government also puts you on the terrorist list? )
Look at us all today, a good 80% of the world's water supply is flouridated. Look at the horrors being committed across the world by governments? And look at how noone is doing anything about it.
Look at how they are becoming "Masters of our Food"
How the "World Health Organisation" is filled with Mosanto, and other food giant ex-employee's that funnily enough, pass laws that allow their previous companies to get what they wanted but were denied earlier.
A good example of this is "Pink Sludge" - They're now putting in laws that means they dont have to label, what foods contain GMO, what foods contain that "Pink Sludge", and Neotame/Aspartame. Knowing exactly what is in you're food is becoming a crime.
"Dont Question, Just Obey"
Another example of this is GMO food. GMO tests on rats have shown by 3rd generation of eating GMO only food, the rats loose their reproductive capacity entirely, their organs fail early and their lifespan is more than halved. Thats us in two generations, folks! If the people of the world continue to allow themselves to be bent over the knee of world govts.
Another example is the Carbon Tax. Look at Australia. Our biggest mining industries have allready up and sold all of their alliminum plants to Chinese buisnesses. Aussie buissnesses have worked out - to mine Alliminum, with the new carbon tax - they would only JUST break even. The overseas owned mining buisnesses are EXEMPT from the mining tax. For Aussies out there- now you understand what the big Overseas land grabs were a bout shortly after they annouced the Carbon tax, yes?
The world is going down the ******* in the name of Greed and Power.
The people are dumbed down, today's schooling system moreso resembles a Jail than a learning centre.
Know every product you buy is designed to fail so you have to buy another? The very first pair of Nylon stockings ever made, they tied them together, then to the front and back bumper of two cars. The first car was able to tow the 2nd, using Nylon stockings as the rope, all the way down a street. They then removed the Nylon Stockigns from the cars, untied them, and showed it to the public again. No tears, it diddnt even look like it was warped from stretching.
Now look at Nylon Stockings today - they stretch and tear like they're realy made out of wet paper towel. Why are products designed to fail? Because if they do not, the company that makes them doesnt get enough money. So to make money, they need to design products that fail, products that are only usefull for a short time before they're outdated with something "better" that just happens to do the exact same thing. This trend started when they first invented Light Bulbs, by the way. http://en.wikipedia..../Phoebus_cartel So, the now, less frequently heard words from our elders that "Things just dont last like they used too" is so true, its not funny.
Thats why i like to think of 2012 as not a doomsday year, but a year of change.
Its obvious to me that more and more people are... "Waking Up" and realising that there is alot more going on, than the crap their spoonfed by TV and Magazines. More and More people are becoming Polliticaly active, wanting their voice to be heard because they're sick of it being blatantly ignored in favor for decisions/laws that favor big corporations rather than the Countries actual Citizens.
I personaly believe things will intensify. Once the carbon tax fully comes into play here in Australia im willing to bet money on the fact it wont be long untill we have a Revolution. I realy dont think most of the population here realises how much its going to impact everyone. Power bills are set to rise 15%, and thats not couting the little price raises you normaly get 3-5 times a year saying "due to increased infastructure costs were increasing the tarrifs by 2% kthxbai" Now add this same increase to food, rent, everything.
the Australian People are going to be put into poverty by the Carbon Tax, while overseas interests are free to come in and do everything that we wont be able too (due to carbon tax costs) for no cost, then sell us stuff back for inflated prices purely for more profit.
When peoples quality of life is hurt so much, it becomes a "Animal pushed into the Corner" situation. it will only be so long untill we lash out, go enough is enough, and make a stand.
But, like history has shown us many times - what can be done, or put in place, to prevent the same things from happening yet again? Its never a quick process, its a process that takes deccades of new laws being passed that all contribute to the same thing (Look at the US and Aus's laws over the past 20 years and all the changes, especialy ones that impact personal freedoms, privacy and security, and you will be spending the next hour pulling you're jaw out of the ground)
So.. please do continue talking about real issues to you're friends, and family. The more people that are aware of what is going on, find their voice, and say no, the better.
Our futures, and childrens futures depend on us taking Action, rather than wondering if Charlee Sheen will be on the rebound, or what suit Lady Gaga will wear at her next concert, or cheering like a ****** when Obama got the "Noble Peace Prize".
"Comprimising you're personal freedoms and liberties in the name of security..... means you deserve neither"
3
) than it was a century ago, and a century ago, it was better in every possible way than it was in 1800.
