Jump to content

Word of Blake Jihad


62 replies to this topic

#1 Catharsis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 112 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 16 March 2012 - 11:07 PM

I was thinking today...
Would it not be awesome if, down the road, when the Wobbies decide to go apeshit on the galaxy, ALL the players could organize, much like how the Clans started working with the Houses, and fend off an unstoppable horde of NPC Jihadists?

This would be pretty far down the road time-wise, and so it might be a great break from constant PvP to have an EPIC PvE battle for the HPG Network, Terra, and the whole galaxy?

I know this is the House Davion forum, but I cannot find a better place to mention this. The only page in the BT Universe forum is for Clan discussions.

So! Let me know your thoughts. Do you think the Word of Blake was a good plot point for the series canon, or did you find it a contrived way of adding a new dimension to the galactic conflict?

#2 LordDeathStrike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Merciless
  • The Merciless
  • 1,456 posts
  • LocationBanished from nearly every world of the Inner Sphere on suspicions of being an assassin.

Posted 16 March 2012 - 11:20 PM

this is like 20 years away in 1:1 timeline.....

#3 Catharsis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 112 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 16 March 2012 - 11:26 PM

View PostLordDeathStrike, on 16 March 2012 - 11:20 PM, said:

this is like 20 years away in 1:1 timeline.....


True, but we all know this game is going to be around for a hundred :unsure:

Also, I read several ideas across the forums about the devs accelerating the time scale every now and then in order to bypass a lot of the idleness that happens over the years. Battletech is the sort of canon that has A TON of stuff happen in a few years, and then nothing for a decade. B)

I think it is a decent idea, accelerating the time scale and then slowing back to 1:1 when something interesting pops up. This way we could get to major events like Tukayyid, Coventry, and the Wobbies.

#4 trycksh0t

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Elite Founder
  • 1,176 posts
  • LocationUmm...in a building..on a road. I think.

Posted 17 March 2012 - 12:45 AM

I'd be game. Anything that allows me to put Gauss rounds into WoB 'Mechs.

#5 LordDeathStrike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Merciless
  • The Merciless
  • 1,456 posts
  • LocationBanished from nearly every world of the Inner Sphere on suspicions of being an assassin.

Posted 17 March 2012 - 02:47 AM

i dunno, theres enough real jihad going on now that we dont need it in our fun games too..... when they wrote the WoB stuff in the 80s we werent engaged in mortal combat with a certain extremist religion that will fight to the last person big enough to carry an ak 47, now we is.

#6 Thorn Hallis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,902 posts
  • LocationUnited States of Paranoia

Posted 17 March 2012 - 04:28 AM

View PostLordDeathStrike, on 17 March 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

i dunno, theres enough real jihad going on now that we dont need it in our fun games too..... when they wrote the WoB stuff in the 80s we werent engaged in mortal combat with a certain extremist religion that will fight to the last person big enough to carry an ak 47, now we is.


Ehm...the World of Blake was introduced in the 90s, while the whole Jihad was created in the current millenium...

#7 Tadakuma

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 225 posts
  • LocationAdelaide

Posted 17 March 2012 - 05:29 AM

No, the Word of Blake Jihad is a horrible storyline. It reads like a bunch of sub-literate geeks got together and had a meeting to decide what the most "AWESOME" and "EPIC" events would be in the BT universe. Unfortunately they wrote a bunch of sense that makes as much sense as a Michael Bay movie.

In the space of 5 years they attack every major capital home world, destroy the Wolves Dragoons and take Hesperus. Meanwhile they're sowing weapons of mass destruction like candy seeds of destruction while causally committing war crimes and genocide across the inner sphere.

They do this without maintaining any real strategic position or real manufacturing base and using a bunch of second rate outlawed mercenary units who can suddenly stand up to units like the Wolves Dragons, the Northwind Highlanders or Kell Hounds.

I found the idea that they were able to take and hold Hesperus without controlling any of the surrounding systems for a period of years laughable. They did this while attacking Luthien (a world the Clans could take), Tharkad, Outreach and New Avalon. The most heavily defended worlds in the Innersphere are taken because it is some how "cool"

For those whoe aren't keeping track Hesperus is a world that contains approximately 30% of the Lyran commonwealths mech manufacturing capacity and is defended by a minimum of two mech regiments plus conventional forces. The nearby systems are heavily garrisoned and the forces are equipped with jumpships to enable them to reinforce Hesperus on short notice. It has never fallen once during the course of the Succession Wars, Clan Invasion or FedCom Civil War.

Some how the WoB is able to take this world with two Divisions, effectively two mech regiments. They attacked a heavily defended position with an abundance of assault mechs and did so with few enogh causalties to enable them to effectively defend the planet from counter attack.

Steiner military is renown of it;s understanding of logistics and manufacturing for strategic advantage, the idea that they would let a world that important to their military in enemy hands is laughable. Especially considering that these attacks are happening in isolation.

There is no reason that large task forces can't be mobilised to retake Hesperus because these operations aren't being undertaken as part of a larger operation. They're single point attacks.

It's as if the combined military know how of the innersphere was paralysed by a magic beam while the jihad was going on it doesn't make any sense.

Bear in mind that prior to this that all the major battles and operations of BT universe made sense, attacks took place over a broad front and had a strategic plan. Thing made sense, which the jihad doesn't.

I can honestly say that for me the Battletech timeline ends in 3062 (maybe 3067 if I'm feeling generous)

#8 Hartsblade

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Big Brother
  • 772 posts

Posted 17 March 2012 - 06:57 AM

Being an oldtimer, the Clans were bad enough. So please no WoB and please, please no DarkAge.

That being said, if the game is as awesome as I expect and I enjoy playing it, the introducton of WoB and/or DarkAge will not turn me away (just as the Clans didn't). I'll just keep plugging along and try to stay as close to being an old school IS 'mech jock as I can.

#9 Catharsis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 112 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:08 AM

View PostTadakuma, on 17 March 2012 - 05:29 AM, said:

No, the Word of Blake Jihad is a horrible storyline. It reads like a bunch of sub-literate geeks got together and had a meeting to decide what the most "AWESOME" and "EPIC" events would be in the BT universe. Unfortunately they wrote a bunch of sense that makes as much sense as a Michael Bay movie.

In the space of 5 years they attack every major capital home world, destroy the Wolves Dragoons and take Hesperus. Meanwhile they're sowing weapons of mass destruction like candy seeds of destruction while causally committing war crimes and genocide across the inner sphere.

They do this without maintaining any real strategic position or real manufacturing base and using a bunch of second rate outlawed mercenary units who can suddenly stand up to units like the Wolves Dragons, the Northwind Highlanders or Kell Hounds.

I found the idea that they were able to take and hold Hesperus without controlling any of the surrounding systems for a period of years laughable. They did this while attacking Luthien (a world the Clans could take), Tharkad, Outreach and New Avalon. The most heavily defended worlds in the Innersphere are taken because it is some how "cool"

For those whoe aren't keeping track Hesperus is a world that contains approximately 30% of the Lyran commonwealths mech manufacturing capacity and is defended by a minimum of two mech regiments plus conventional forces. The nearby systems are heavily garrisoned and the forces are equipped with jumpships to enable them to reinforce Hesperus on short notice. It has never fallen once during the course of the Succession Wars, Clan Invasion or FedCom Civil War.

Some how the WoB is able to take this world with two Divisions, effectively two mech regiments. They attacked a heavily defended position with an abundance of assault mechs and did so with few enogh causalties to enable them to effectively defend the planet from counter attack.

Steiner military is renown of it;s understanding of logistics and manufacturing for strategic advantage, the idea that they would let a world that important to their military in enemy hands is laughable. Especially considering that these attacks are happening in isolation.

There is no reason that large task forces can't be mobilised to retake Hesperus because these operations aren't being undertaken as part of a larger operation. They're single point attacks.

It's as if the combined military know how of the innersphere was paralysed by a magic beam while the jihad was going on it doesn't make any sense.

Bear in mind that prior to this that all the major battles and operations of BT universe made sense, attacks took place over a broad front and had a strategic plan. Thing made sense, which the jihad doesn't.

I can honestly say that for me the Battletech timeline ends in 3062 (maybe 3067 if I'm feeling generous)


I agree with a lot of what you said.
What I am suggesting is that the timeline should not HAVE to end for you in 3062!

The WoB storyarc really was not all that well thought out (sort of like the ME3 ending, eh? :D )
but I think the fundamental idea behind it is, in the least bit, an interesting break from the the IS and Clan infighting.
I think that if PGI introduced the WoB faction to the game, but then left the community to respond and fight back, we could create a branch of canon that shares some of the good elements of the WoB arch, while leaving us in control of the ultimate outcome. For instance, instead of having Hesperus fall, Steiner (under the command of human players) could successfully organize a counter offensive and push the Wobbies back off world. Of course, if the Steiner faction could not organize effectively in time, they would receive a heavy dent in their supply lines and potentially empower the WoB faction.

Do you get what I am trying to suggest? Or am I not making sense? Or do you not like the idea of changing canon, even if it is bad canon?

#10 Catharsis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 112 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:16 AM

View PostLordDeathStrike, on 17 March 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

i dunno, theres enough real jihad going on now that we dont need it in our fun games too..... when they wrote the WoB stuff in the 80s we werent engaged in mortal combat with a certain extremist religion that will fight to the last person big enough to carry an ak 47, now we is.


It is true that jihad would be a sensitive topic in this day and age, but BattleTech's universe has always been a reflection of human history. I think it would be unjust to ignore issues like religious fundamentalism because they are deemed too "culturally insensitive" or something like that.
And you know, even back in the 80s, the West had a rather biased view of Islam. Do you not remember True Lies's Crimson Jihad or Back To The Future's Libyans?

Eh, it is hard to discuss this issue without coming across one way or another.

Still, Battletech is a universe about Feudal societies and militaristic nations. It is a mature universe, that is well aged and enjoyed by a mature community. It can handle the topic of religious extremism, and could very easily do a great job of providing perspective on the whole issue.

#11 Jack Gallows

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 1,824 posts

Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:36 AM

Just like when the Clans hit, if the Wobbies attack (dear god I hate the jihad/dark age) we'll crush them all proper like.

#12 Strumtruppen

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • 50 posts

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:49 AM

If anything i would try to join the Word of Blake because i would love the idea of taking everybody on and besides.....
i do love me a good holy war. B)

#13 Catharsis

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 112 posts
  • LocationStrana Mechty

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:52 AM

View PostJack Gallows, on 25 March 2012 - 04:36 AM, said:

Just like when the Clans hit, if the Wobbies attack (dear god I hate the jihad/dark age) we'll crush them all proper like.


That is what I am getting at. We should be given a chance to prevent the dark age by crushing the Wobbies before they can screw things over!

#14 Johannes Falkner

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bridesmaid
  • Bridesmaid
  • 442 posts
  • LocationZiliang

Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:25 PM

The WoB would be almost impossible to really add to the MWO universe for the simple reason that the indiscriminate use of nukes would leave rather a large mess. Besides the number of simple questions that have already been raised about strategy and so forth. Not to mention which house atomics stockpile(s) they raided. The logic bomb inherent to the Jihad had a larger yield than any of the nukes they dropped.

#15 The Jade Phoenix

    Member

  • Pip
  • 10 posts

Posted 24 July 2012 - 11:37 PM

They could make it a raid!

#16 Guilar

    Member

  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • LocationPhilippines

Posted 25 July 2012 - 06:49 AM

Come to think of it, wouldn't MWO be a great opportunity to REWRITE history, particularly the WoB Jihad. I too hate what happened to the BT universe after the Jihad. It simply is impossible to grasp that an organization springs up with all power and might to disrupt the very fabric of society.

Let's enter the Clan invasion, FedCom civil war, up to the Capellan Xin Sheng with Gauss rifles and LRMs ablazin'! After that, it's all up to us...

By the way, wouldn't it be nice to have a grand strategy game of the BT universe? Just a thought...

#17 Harlock Fredrick

    Member

  • PipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 99 posts
  • LocationMissoula Montana

Posted 03 August 2012 - 03:56 PM

if they bring them in i would make every effert to chase down every WOB member >< even if it kills me over and over. ill be the thorn that never goes away!

#18 Ioun Stone

    Member

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts
  • LocationAlkaid, Skye Province

Posted 03 August 2012 - 07:29 PM

Technically they've already written the Dark Age novels for the post-Jihad setting, up to the year 3130. *sigh* It's as if with the HPG loss, they've attempted to make the setting more akin to Warhammer 40K in the making. Mind you, WoB had basically mech and personal infantry designs that were even light-years ahead of what the clans brought to the table vs the Inner Sphere. Plus, they controled communications. Without it, the few jumpships left were FUBAR'd with battleplans, etc etc. (yeah yeah I know armchair general-ing here.)

One thing that saddened me...I do wish they would have finally put in another 'species' besides Humans in the game. I realise that's more earth shattering, but it wouldn't have had to change much. Maybe it would have gotten the periphery states some power as they make first contact (one way or another.) And perhaps it changes the way mechs are designed, or the new friction beyond mere houses, or ex clanners.
The new species could even have it's own divided and fractured area of space, opening up a new deluge of factions making pacts. The possibilities would be almost endless, heck you can throw in a war or two for good measure without bringing all of space known space to it's knees.

Right, got off track there...
I personally don't have any of the Battletech Roleplaying game books (nort wargame books!) from anything past 3067-69, prior to the Jihad era. I've read up on it, but meh. I'm glad this game is currently in the cusp of pre-clan invasion myself. But if eventually down the line the years roll by, I'll have to finally admit Jihad and the Dark Age have and will happen.
Unless someone does a weird JJ Abrahms thing and 'reboots' Battletech? Hmm?

#19 Buzzkill72

    Rookie

  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • 8 posts
  • LocationHolland MI

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:08 AM

AHHHHHhhhhhhh Not the "Bloody Hand of Blake" as I refer to them :(

#20 ConnorMagill

    Member

  • PipPip
  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • FP Veteran - Beta 2
  • 34 posts

Posted 04 August 2012 - 06:17 AM

Like the idea but im a Word of blake loyalist sooo.........





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users