29 replies to this topic

[Evil Ash]

In one of the videos we were told of a few game play modes that would be integrated into the game. My question and idea is: would there be a way to target a house/clan on their territory, attacking in a sabotage style hit and run. (One or so lance of attackers vs One or so lance of defenders) in a hit and run game play style. Success would mean hurting the attacked house's munition availability, defeat would mean well... defeat. If the community can build onto this idea, that would be great, feel free to share your thoughts.

(I had checked the forums using the fabulous search button, but I didn't find any thread about it and I didn't find anything in the FAQs)

Edited by Evil Ash, 28 March 2012 - 05:23 PM.

[100mile]

If you are in jump range i would think it would be possible...but if you are hitting someone on there territory their response shouldn't be limited to what you attacked with but what they have available...and actually i would think this type of warfare would be integral to the game..of course if you engage in this type of warfare you need to be ready for consequences and reprisals that may seem out of hand...

[Evil Ash]

I based this idea off the sabotage missions in the other games, you're right of course, and also the possible gain of resources for weaker houses neighboring the reigning super power would make sense.

[El Loco]

Raids are an integral part of the BT universe, especially after the 4th Scuccession War. As such, they should be an integral part of MWO as well! There are hundreds of worlds along the borders of all the houses/factions, all of them are viable targets. Hit and run attacks without provoking a full blown war is just what the IS needs

[Evil Ash]

Exactly my point.

[Seabear]

Given the state of affairs in the border marches during the timeline of the game, this is the type thing I think we can expect, a continuing low level of thrust and counter-thrust in the soft areas with small gains made by small units.

[Hawkeye 72]

I like this idea. Raiding for supplies, resources, trade, etc. would be a fun dynamic. I still want to be able to launch a full scale invasion of a planet as well. So lets expand on this:

Maybe if you attack with x number of units, then if
x < 1 lance then its a supply raid (weapons, ammo, cbills- just earn cash and possibly salvage. This can be matchmaking too.)
1 < x < 3 lances then you have the opportunity to inflict major installation damage (mech factory, weapons depot, dropship, etc.) This is also the max. no. of players in a match.

Now if you declare a larger assault force then its for occupancy of the planet. You must declare the number assaulting merc/house units. (Suppose a minimum of a battalion). At this point the engagement is limited to the assaulting forces and the declared defending forces on planet at the time for the duration of a few hours. During this time no other forces can join the fight. The units involved compete in a series of engagements. Now after the given time there are three scenarios:

a ) the invasion is either declared a failure and control remains the same
b ) the invasion is successful and the planet changes control
c ) stalemate, at which case the invasion is open to all players for the next 3 to 4 hours. Players declare a side and join up. If the necessary objectives are not conquered, then the invasion fails. The time delay reflects that reinforcements to a major engagement never arrive immediately

This style of play does one of several things:
1) Allows for planets to change owner
2) Encourages player cooperation and structure to merc units/houses
3) The battalion minimum prevents planets from changing hands several times a day, as well as avoiding players and factions to have to grind out matches to win a planet (see Chromehounds Neromius war)
4) Larger merc units can claim planets for themselves that show favor towards a given faction if they wish.

Just an idea

Edited by Hawkeye 72, 29 March 2012 - 12:52 PM.

[mwhighlander]

Little skirmishes like these I would find myself enjoying quite a lot. It would also be quite interesting to those who choose the "defense" combat role (as oppose to offense or commander) where I could choose these types of matches to always work in my niche defending House Planets against raiders. Likewise, those who prefer "offense" can indulge themselves by constantly be going on raiding missions.

I don't know how exactly this could be implemented (maybe include as an option during "matchmaking" or which ever system they select) so that I'd be more likely to have to defend a military stronghold or supply base on a boarder planet...

...I forget what I'm really trying to get at here, so I'll just stop now by saying "I like the concept".

[Hawkeye 72]

mwhighlander, on 29 March 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:

Little skirmishes like these I would find myself enjoying quite a lot. It would also be quite interesting to those who choose the "defense" combat role (as oppose to offense or commander) where I could choose these types of matches to always work in my niche defending House Planets against raiders. Likewise, those who prefer "offense" can indulge themselves by constantly be going on raiding missions.

I don't know how exactly this could be implemented (maybe include as an option during "matchmaking" or which ever system they select) so that I'd be more likely to have to defend a military stronghold or supply base on a boarder planet...

Set the game where you have a "character" in the game world. That character will always be present in some form on a planet (or orbit). Each planet has its own set playlists for skirmishes occuring on-world, like a raid. You can pick up these defense contracts, or hook up the the HPG link and find other contracts off-world to travel to. This will also work for when a battalion or regiment decide to invade a planet in my example above, ensuring there are defensive players on-world when the invasion strikes. The planets playlist would become closed to players on other systems for 3 hours during an invasion to determine the outcome.

[Vexgrave Lars]

What would you raid FOR though? Raiding implies the goal of aquiring, are you then suggesting that you could steal... mechs, tech, supplies, perhaps the things other people used real money to buy things with from the store?

That's scary but from the terms of combat, very realistic... I can smell the fear already, and hear the scamper of rats running.

OK let get on with the nuking of this one (I personally love the idea but). Who wants to be able to have their stuff ripped off?

[osito]

I wouldn't mind this idea taking root. I think quick raids can be quite fun. If this is implemented i see it as mostly a merc job though. Quick battles in and out is their is more their standard procedure. If i remember right mercs will have the border worlds and house units have the more inner worlds to fight over.

[mwhighlander]

Vexgrave Lars, on 29 March 2012 - 01:43 PM, said:

What would you raid FOR though? Raiding implies the goal of aquiring

You would simply Raid for the possesion of the planet, eventually. Say that every time House (A) players lead a raid on Planet (Y), the House (B ) in control would have to defend Planet (Y). After a certain point if House (B ) constantly losses the conflict, they would lose possesion of Planet (Y) to House (A).

Also, because it would be fun! The purpose of the game itself. Some player simply prefer to defend and other simply prefer to be on offense.

Edited by mwhighlander, 29 March 2012 - 01:47 PM.

[Vexgrave Lars]

mwhighlander, on 29 March 2012 - 01:47 PM, said:

You would simply Raid for the possesion of the planet, eventually. Say that every time House (A) players lead a raid on Planet (Y), the House (B ) in control would have to defend Planet (Y). After a certain point if House (B ) constantly losses the conflict, they would lose possesion of Planet (Y) to House (A).

Also, because it would be fun! The purpose of the game itself. Some player simply prefer to defend and other simply prefer to be on offense.

My point though is that if a raid is successful there should be a gain for the raiders and a loss for the defenders and vice versa. Whats on the table is not the act or "fun" reason to go raiding, I question how far are the spoils to go after such an act. Should the losses of the defender include the captured materials, game-store Items, that people put real money down for?

Perhaps the devs can put a "neutral" chip in the pot, like control of a Brian Cache or something which would be good enough.

Everyone looks for actions, I am interested in the results.

[Hawkeye 72]

Vexgrave Lars, on 29 March 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

My point though is that if a raid is successful there should be a gain for the raiders and a loss for the defenders and vice versa. Whats on the table is not the act or "fun" reason to go raiding, I question how far are the spoils to go after such an act. Should the losses of the defender include the captured materials, game-store Items, that people put real money down for?

Perhaps the devs can put a "neutral" chip in the pot, like control of a Brian Cache or something which would be good enough.

Everyone looks for actions, I am interested in the results.

Raids earn you a number of c-bills + salvage (if its included in the game) for both sides if successful. Attackers perks could be stuff to sell on the market, while losing could cost them heavier shipping costs on the return to their homeworld. Losing defenders will see an increase in weapons/ammo/supplies costs and repair costs on the planet due to the losses, while winning earns them cheaper costs due to the invading force having to abandon supplies in the retreat offworld. This would be a great way for houses to shell out contracts to mercs in order to soften up a planet before a larger strike.

OR leave raiding as a basic c-bill pot, and use this for quick/instant matchmaking. If players want more, they must involve themselves more in the game for bigger 8v8 or 12v12 matches.

[Vexgrave Lars]

Bueno! Hawkeye 72! Mucho Bueno!

[Hawkeye 72]

Vexgrave Lars, on 29 March 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

Bueno! Hawkeye 72! Mucho Bueno!

Thanks. I've had a decade to think of these ideas lol

Example contract (Attacker):
Planet: Prospernia
Faction: Federated Commonwealth
Shipping Limit: 1 lance
Objective: Capture or destroy LRM stockpile
Salary: 150,000 c-bills for capture, 100,000 for destruction
Bonus: 10 tons LRM ammo (if captured) + salvage
Expected resistance: Medium Draconis Lance

Attacker accepts.

Server sends signal to Prospernia playlist and other close systems

Mercenary group on Prospernia scans playlist and sees this:

Defense contract
Faction: Draconis Combine
Intel report: 1 Medium FedCom lance
Objective: Defend weapons depot.
Salary: 200,000 c-bills
Bonus: Salvage + extra Faction points for Draconis Combine

Mercs accept. Raid fought.

Three outcomes
1) Fedcom capture weapons depot. Earn full contract bonus + 10 ton LRM ammo
2) Fedcom destroy weapons depot. Earn partial reward
3) Mercs successfully defend, earn supplies from opponents inventory.

In case (1) and (2), LRM costs go up on Prospernia and defenders have to pay repairs. Supplies on planet drop and decrease defensive ability versus a larger attack force. In case (3) attacking force has to pay for repairs and extra dropship fees for having to retreat off planet under fire. Defenders earn extra weapons and salvage due to hasty retreat of invaders, plus above-normal faction points for successful completion.

This works too so that there is extra incentive for raid contracts, while defense contracts pay more ensuring there will be no shortage of people looking for defense contracts. If everyone looks for defense contracts and can't find any, they must attack, so therefore the game naturally encourages players to attack, while also encouraging defense with a higher salary

Edited by Hawkeye 72, 29 March 2012 - 02:33 PM.

[Semyon Drakon]

Raiding is an integrsal part of Clan warfare as well, though they tend to refer to them as trials of possession. Example Clan jade falcon wants the blueprints for a new type of Omnimech. They then send a force, normally a trinary or trinary supernova to the target, issue the batchall and await the defenders force composition. They then bid among themselves for who gets to make the assault.

If the challenger wins, they get the prize, in this case the mech blueprint. If they lose they can't issue another challenge for those items, units, worlds etc. (See the Smoke jag attack on Wolcott)

So yes objective raids are a great idea. raids designed to hit an enemy unit in their base are called spoiling attacks and are a very sound strategy, provided you bring enough guns to do the job!

Semyon

[Austin Katan]

This is a good idea. As much fun as deathmatch and free-for-all are having other gametypes will do much increase the enjoyment of this game. It will also give it a longer life span.

[mwhighlander]

Hawkeye 72, on 29 March 2012 - 02:31 PM, said:

Defense contract
Faction: Draconis Combine
Intel report: 1 Medium FedCom lance
Objective: Defend weapons depot.
Salary: 200,000 c-bills
Bonus: Salvage + extra Faction points for Draconis Combine

Now see, if I saw something like this (MW2:Mercs style, god I loved that game) I would be accepting these contracts all day! One of the reason I loved MW:2 mercs so much. You got to choose what to get into and you knew if you did well you could earn some serious money.

[Opus]

Hawkeye 72, on 29 March 2012 - 02:31 PM, said:

Thanks. I've had a decade to think of these ideas lol

Example contract (Attacker):
Planet: Prospernia
Faction: Federated Commonwealth
Shipping Limit: 1 lance
Objective: Capture or destroy LRM stockpile
Salary: 150,000 c-bills for capture, 100,000 for destruction
Bonus: 10 tons LRM ammo (if captured) + salvage
Expected resistance: Medium Draconis Lance

Attacker accepts.

Server sends signal to Prospernia playlist and other close systems

Mercenary group on Prospernia scans playlist and sees this:

Defense contract
Faction: Draconis Combine
Intel report: 1 Medium FedCom lance
Objective: Defend weapons depot.
Salary: 200,000 c-bills
Bonus: Salvage + extra Faction points for Draconis Combine

Mercs accept. Raid fought.

Three outcomes
1) Fedcom capture weapons depot. Earn full contract bonus + 10 ton LRM ammo
2) Fedcom destroy weapons depot. Earn partial reward
3) Mercs successfully defend, earn supplies from opponents inventory.

In case (1) and (2), LRM costs go up on Prospernia and defenders have to pay repairs. Supplies on planet drop and decrease defensive ability versus a larger attack force. In case (3) attacking force has to pay for repairs and extra dropship fees for having to retreat off planet under fire. Defenders earn extra weapons and salvage due to hasty retreat of invaders, plus above-normal faction points for successful completion.

This works too so that there is extra incentive for raid contracts, while defense contracts pay more ensuring there will be no shortage of people looking for defense contracts. If everyone looks for defense contracts and can't find any, they must attack, so therefore the game naturally encourages players to attack, while also encouraging defense with a higher salary

That is BRILLIANT!

have a beer, our treat