113 replies to this topic

[Kurayami]

weapon itslef is fune. unjam is kinda too fast. it often unjams in like 2 seconds while patch note stated 3 to 5.

[ian davion]

I use them in pairs and they and the unjam is way to short. It is only a slight irritation when I play. The way it is now, I barely notice when they jam. With the way it is now, we wont be able to tell if they are doing to much damage with the really short unjam time.

[Roadbuster]

Raalic, on 21 November 2012 - 01:46 PM, said:

No, because using macros will give an unfair advantage. Macros are not a skill check. Dealing with or avoiding a jam midcombat is a skill check.

I agree that automatic unjam is the way to go, but there is no skill involved if your UAC/5 jams after the first shot.

[Urza Mechwalker]

use their power level changed NOTHING when comapred to Closed Beta. And They were not considered OP there.

THe thing is new mech toy makses peopel overuse UAC5. That wil lpass with time than you can evaluate it free of psicological pressure.

Hint that same ammount of tons in the form of 5 PPCs (in the other catrap) is as devastating as the UAC5

[Allekatrase]

Urza Mechwalker, on 22 November 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

use their power level changed NOTHING when comapred to Closed Beta. And They were not considered OP there.

THe thing is new mech toy makses peopel overuse UAC5. That wil lpass with time than you can evaluate it free of psicological pressure.

Hint that same ammount of tons in the form of 5 PPCs (in the other catrap) is as devastating as the UAC5

5 PPCs is just asking for an immediate shutdown. You'll get a nice alpha and then sit for a while, how is that comparable? Also, dps on the PPC is only 3.33 so 5 of them, assuming you could fire more than once, would still only be 16.65 dps. Less than two UAC/5s. It's the dps more than the alpha that allows the UAC/5 to chew through things so much.

Though I do agree most of the reactions to this are based on the fact that the change came at the same time as the first really viable ballistic focused mech variant was launched.

My guess is it's probably a bit too strong now and the jam length needs to be increased. People should be single firing it and saving the double fire mode for special occasions like last hits or emergencies.

[eR Spectre]

I don't have a problem with UAC5... I mean nothing against DPS and so... but do something with the shaking! When you are taking fire from CTF-4X with two pieces of UAC5 (or 4 AC5) you are dead because there is nothing you can do to return fire.

Edited by eR Spectre, 22 November 2012 - 01:37 AM.

[Zwietracht]

im sure pgi just try to balance the different weapon types. first lrm`s ... 2 dmg for a few days then back to 1.7 (?), after that ssrm w/o 100% hit chance and scattering.. some weeks later streaks gone back to previous status. now its time for the uac and i suppose there will be a dmg reduction or a higher jamming rate in 1 or 2 weeks. there will be actually also some modifications on the ssrm since atm the average round is a battle between a mixture of cats in all variations supported by mechs with ballistics hp mixed with jenners and here and there an atlas...

so i will enjoy the uac5 in my raven as long as possible.

[hashinshin]

The UAC5 gets less ammo per ton than the AC5, yet has to shoot it twice as much. Just to manage 2 UAC5 you need 8 tons of ammo. This makes them just under AC10s in terms of total ammo consumption in a match, and using just 2 tons of ammo per AC10 you'll last a lot longer than the UAC5.

Yes the UAC5 can shred through mechs that stand still, but even a small degree of movement makes you miss so many shots due to the fact its effectively a full automatic weapon that requires you to have 100% uptime on accuracy (read: impossible.)

It's a deadly weapon that is now on par with streaks, gauss, and medium lasers. We need MORE weapons to be on par with these, not the "you can use streaks, gauss, medium lasers, or you can be worse" we have fallen in to.

Now if you want to nerf streak guass medium lasers and UAC5 all in one patch I'm fine with that.

Edited by hashinshin, 22 November 2012 - 01:56 AM.

[Xeven]

DCLXVI, on 21 November 2012 - 05:37 PM, said:

There would be no noticible recoil on Heavy Mechs. Maybe anything below 35 tons might slightly feel an UAC 5 but not the Mediums and Heavies. We have in real life AC-130 aircraft shooting 105 howitzers with barely a shake while flying at 18000 feet in real life!

[Katface]

In b4 nerf

[Deadoon]

Xeven, on 22 November 2012 - 03:04 AM, said:

There would be no noticible recoil on Heavy Mechs. Maybe anything below 35 tons might slightly feel an UAC 5 but not the Mediums and Heavies. We have in real life AC-130 aircraft shooting 105 howitzers with barely a shake while flying at 18000 feet in real life!

The 130 does so with a massive recoil buffer and ramp to reset it's position the c130 also weighs as much as an awesome.

Edited by Deadoon, 22 November 2012 - 03:36 AM.

[Iron Hand]

The UAC 5 is fantastic! Don't nerf it because a couple of people say it is OP. all they have to do is go into the lab and slap one on their mech too and return fire. If you keep nerfing every thing because of a bunch of whiners then why don't you just only allow a Jenner and a small laser and that's it. That way it's even and FAIR (sarcasm) for everyone. Of course the game would be as boring as NASCAR has become.

[Mu]

The UAC5 is basically the only thing keeping this game from being nothing but streak catapults right now, although it's funny seeing them run up to me believing I'll go down faster than them eating 2xUAC5 and 2xAC2 in the nose.

personally I'd prefer if the default fire rate was the 'normal' speed and you had to double tap to get the faster speed and risk jamming. But it's not impossible to adapt, so either way is fine.

I want to give 4xAC5 a try though. I've been burning through my UAC5 ammo too easily even when almost all my shots hit...I routinely hit 750+ damage but the arm convergence issues mean a lot of that damage is spread out in ways I don't like.

[RacerX]

In my humble opinion I think the UAC/5 is a bit over powered for what it is. They hit hard, fast, and tear mechs up in under a minute. I've been playing with a Dual UAC/5 for a few days and I have to say that the GaussKitty debate is pretty much over. Folks are switching to UAC/5s because it makes this game more like a FPS.

In my opinion the firing rate is way too high. Where folks once complained about a 30 point Gauss Alpha I can now deliver at least twice as much damage in the same amount of time it takes for a guass rifle to reload. I think making Guass Rifles weak structurually while also introducing a fast firing high firepower weapon was a mistake. I suspect the devs will recognize this and put out a patch to balance the UAC/5 out a bit. Or reduce knock or something so that the folks recieving incoming fire have an opportunity to respond or at least give the UAC/5 boat a reason to duck for cover.

I do, however, really like the auto unjam. Thank you PGI for including this and removing the need to build special macros to unjam these guns manually.

[Codejack]

Deadoon, on 21 November 2012 - 11:06 PM, said:

An unjam button is ripe for exploitation with a dual uac build(one in each arm) I can bind them to my Left mb with my unjam being mouse 4 or 5 and having rmb as my backup lasers.

No, because you still have to change weapon groups; it would let people manually unjam a little faster than it automatically unjams, so you can either wait a little longer, or switch your attention to your weapon groups to unjam faster. I think that's fair.

Allekatrase, on 21 November 2012 - 11:29 PM, said:

No, I don't play streak cats, why is that relevant? They do 1.43 dps approximately and the most you can fit is 6 giving you a total of 8.58 dps for the whole mech. One UAC/5 has the same dps if double firing and more than half the dps while not using the double fire mode.

You are leaving out part of the dps calculation: How much you miss....

I brought it up because I have been playing with UACs on catapults, dragons, and now a cataphract since CB, and I have never done as much damage or had as many kills as with my streakcat.

Allekatrase, on 21 November 2012 - 11:29 PM, said:

And the jam mechanic is there exactly because the dps is so high. It's about twice what most other balistic weapons put out and more than twice what any energy weapon can put out. It's not meant to be double fired continuously, that's why it jams. If it didn't there wouldn't be any point using any other weapon.

Nobody thought they added the jam mechanic for the fun of it. The problem now is that you can have one match as damage king, and the next match both will jam on you just as you come around the corner on an Atlas; with the unjam being so long with no manual unjam, the weapon is dangerously risky to use.

My suggestion was to lower to ROF and the auto unjam timer, and add just an unjam button that you can switch weapon groups and hit; it would still be distracting (which was the point of the unjam mechanic, right?), but only slightly faster than just letting it unjam itself (so the people who can't figure out macros or how to use mice with more than one button don't get offended).

Mu, on 22 November 2012 - 07:11 AM, said:

I want to give 4xAC5 a try though. I've been burning through my UAC5 ammo too easily even when almost all my shots hit...I routinely hit 750+ damage but the arm convergence issues mean a lot of that damage is spread out in ways I don't like.

That's my current 4X setup; if for no other reason than you only need one kind of ammo

[Garth Erlam]

Am I in the right place? Positive comments on a change?

That said, glad to see people liking the UAC-5. I still maintain it's the second best single weapon system in the game currently (after my lovely medium lasers )

[Sprouticus]

Iron Hand, on 22 November 2012 - 06:58 AM, said:

The UAC 5 is fantastic! Don't nerf it because a couple of people say it is OP. all they have to do is go into the lab and slap one on their mech too and return fire. If you keep nerfing every thing because of a bunch of whiners then why don't you just only allow a Jenner and a small laser and that's it. That way it's even and FAIR (sarcasm) for everyone. Of course the game would be as boring as NASCAR has become.

Wait, so your logical argument is that UAC5's are fine because everyone can use them? Really?


UAC5 are CLOSE to fine, but its a bit too much. Lower the recycle time to match the Ac5 and see how that goes.

Garth Erlam, on 22 November 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

Am I in the right place? Positive comments on a change?

That said, glad to see people liking the UAC-5. I still maintain it's the second best single weapon system in the game currently (after my lovely medium lasers )

I think the vast majority like the unjam. As for the DPS....well you might want to tweak that a bit.

[Garth Erlam]

I think we'll probably lengthen unjam time somewhat, maybe increase the chance of a jam. Not too much though.

Frankly, the UAC-5 was the most underrated weapon we had for MONTHS. I had a successful Dragon build (back when it was declared they were 'useless') that was centred around a single UAC-5. Sometimes I almost miss that Mech...

[Mr 144]

Garth Erlam, on 22 November 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

I think we'll probably lengthen unjam time somewhat, maybe increase the chance of a jam. Not too much though.

Frankly, the UAC-5 was the most underrated weapon we had for MONTHS. I had a successful Dragon build (back when it was declared they were 'useless') that was centred around a single UAC-5. Sometimes I almost miss that Mech...

Agreed, but just a smidgeon...no need to swing the nerf bat hard on this one (I'm looking at you, LRM rollercoaster)

I have no problem rewarding the patient shot to avoid the jams altogether, but you do have to keep in mind tonnage, ammo, and the inherent 'misses'. It's quite the commitment to go UAC/5(s) and trade far superior alphas for the DPS gain when everything is factored.

There's always the downside that someone building for high alpha's will simply blow off the offending appendage before that DPS is useful. That's my way of dealing with streakcats, get in close (ambush), and a 50+ alpha to knock off an ear. I suspect once things calm down a bit, that similar methods will be employed against the phract. A certain centurion arm comes to mind as well. FotM, albeit a good one IMHO, but still...not without checks and balances provided by other builds.

Mr 144

Edited by Mr 144, 22 November 2012 - 10:48 AM.

[Boozifer]

Seems that the "...maybe increase the chance of a jam. Not too much though." option was to - in my opinion - smack it silly with a nerf bat increasing the chance of jam 2.5 times what we had (according to game files - source: http://mwomercs.com/...78#entry1473478).

Could be just me of course, but going from an average jam of once every 10th double-shot (10%) to once every 4th double-shot (25%) has very much of your aforementioned "LRM rollercoaster" written all over it.
We should probably rename it "weapon balance rollercoaster" or "PGI's FOTM-whack-a-mole extravaganza"... ok, "LRM rollercoaster" rolls easier off the tongue though, I'll grant you that.


Too bad. I enjoyed the increase of dakka in the game, even if it meant having to play more carefully around the ballistic mechs. (I still preferred my SRM/LL AWS-9M personally, but it actually sounded like a battlefield out there, which was nice)