58 replies to this topic

[Rotaugen]

Vassago Rain, on 17 January 2013 - 03:10 AM, said:

Atlas double-D.
Something like that.

Double Ds? Are they real or implants?

[Diomed]

All things being equal the team with ECM has a notable advantage. Period.

[CDLord HHGD]

In my experience in the software world, "Working as intended" also means "Sh*t, we don't know w.t.f. to do about it so we're gonna act cool until we come up with something."

I say we have a lot of smart people playing this game and if you have an intelligent idea, post it on the suggestions forums.

[Vassago Rain]

Rotaugen, on 17 January 2013 - 05:39 AM, said:

Double Ds? Are they real or implants?

Double-Ds are always real, no matter what.

To their owner.

[Soundscream]

Flit Asuno, on 17 January 2013 - 03:04 AM, said:

If garth is repeating some of the sentiments of the devs then I'll take those words with only a grain or two of salt. If he's speaking from personal experience? then I'm going to take it with a entire salt shaker's worth.

This is the same guy who claimed non engine DHS were 1.4 because he claimed to be able to core an atlas in the back with a jenner in 3 seconds.

Ok, I'm going to have to come to Garths defense on this one. I took the statement you're referring to as an obvious hyperbole, notwithstanding the right build with the proper shot placement could indeed core an atlas in about that time if it had the cooling to fire repeatedly. I've been a part of several gaming communities with sponsored forums, and I can't think of any one represenitive that has been as available as Garth is. I saw him quite a bit in Closed beta in game, he's always on NGNG and the Twitch.tv crew. He posts and updates what he can, when he can, and if you can't trust his love for the game and for us, then your a bitter person who isn't going to be able to handle life too well. Sorry, but I won't see a good guy trashed because you can't handle dissenting information versus your personal view of reality.

[RG Notch]

Vassago Rain, on 17 January 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

He could just post the actual numbers the server collects.

That's what I'd do.

And these people would believe that? It's all a conspiracy pal. What they see with their eyes, in the matches they play is how it is for everyone. And of course their recollection is perfect. Why would I believe numbers that don't fit what I "know"?
What you're talking works with rational folks not forum dwellers.

[Felix]

RG Notch, on 17 January 2013 - 06:12 AM, said:

And these people would believe that? It's all a conspiracy pal. What they see with their eyes, in the matches they play is how it is for everyone. And of course their recollection is perfect. Why would I believe numbers that don't fit what I "know"?
What you're talking works with rational folks not forum dwellers.

If garth posted the numbers no one would believe it. He is well known to be a lying troll.

If Paul posted the numbers I think they would get a fair shake ^.^

[Vassago Rain]

RG Notch, on 17 January 2013 - 06:12 AM, said:

And these people would believe that? It's all a conspiracy pal. What they see with their eyes, in the matches they play is how it is for everyone. And of course their recollection is perfect. Why would I believe numbers that don't fit what I "know"?
What you're talking works with rational folks not forum dwellers.

No, but it'd make him and me both laugh very loudly when crazy golds go 'no u!'

And I'd appreciate knowing what's popular, but I think I already have a good grasp on why and how.

[Vaneshi SnowCrash]

Vassago Rain, on 17 January 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

He could just post the actual numbers the server collects.

That's what I'd do.

That'd actually be nice, something fairly simple not much effort and can be automated with some simple scripting to build the webpage and throw it up. You could even have it in real time in the launcher (but that's not some simple scripting); be kinda nifty to see what's currently popular and bring along something else (or more of it).

[M4rtyr]

As far as the popular mechs go. there seems to be a fair mix in all honesty.

I would say on average PUGing I see maybe 3 ECM mechs perside and they are certainly not always 3L's. So its always obvious people are just being trolls or have no real perception of reality, just what they want reality to be.

I'm thinking there is a good mix of mechs, the ones I see the least are very much the Cicada and Dragon, other then those I bet the numbers are pretty equal.

[Inertiaman]

RG Notch, on 17 January 2013 - 06:12 AM, said:

And these people would believe that? It's all a conspiracy pal. What they see with their eyes, in the matches they play is how it is for everyone. And of course their recollection is perfect. Why would I believe numbers that don't fit what I "know"?
What you're talking works with rational folks not forum dwellers.

What are you on about? I'd be more than happy to see the real stats and, with enough effort, might just about manage to hold back my paranoid tears whilst doing so.

Criticising assumptions whilst making them. Skilled stuff.

Further - it's not like we're asking for the moon on a stick. I can log into HoN and see every game I've played since launch, the people in it, the heroes they picked and the items and stats they ended up with. It's good flavour and really not hard to achieve.

[Flit Asuno]

lordkrike, on 17 January 2013 - 04:59 AM, said:

FYI, with the right weapons loadout and a bit of luck, this is pretty trivial. Two rear center torso bursts with 6 MPL (on a JR7-F) can put out 72 damage in 3.75s. The first 28 points shred through the armor, leaving 44 damage for lucky engine crits. It's even easier if it's an Atlas-K (with an XL engine), since you can shoot him in the rear side and have damage left over for his friends.

Here's the problem though. He's using -that- as justification for not having 2.0 dhs outside the engine. How many doubles do you have outside the engine in a jenner like that? 1, maybe 2? At most 3.

How is 1.8 more heat dissipated in ten seconds (0.18 per second) going to make that build any more nasty/potentially deadly?

Also, in two bursts of that I highly suspect you'd be shutdown after the second burst. Also, engine critting is actually exceptionally rare from what I've found. Unless of course I'm being pelted by a 4 machine gun spider. In which case crit-seeeeeking

[Flit Asuno]

Soundscream, on 17 January 2013 - 05:59 AM, said:

Ok, I'm going to have to come to Garths defense on this one. I took the statement you're referring to as an obvious hyperbole, notwithstanding the right build with the proper shot placement could indeed core an atlas in about that time if it had the cooling to fire repeatedly. I've been a part of several gaming communities with sponsored forums, and I can't think of any one represenitive that has been as available as Garth is. I saw him quite a bit in Closed beta in game, he's always on NGNG and the Twitch.tv crew. He posts and updates what he can, when he can, and if you can't trust his love for the game and for us, then your a bitter person who isn't going to be able to handle life too well. Sorry, but I won't see a good guy trashed because you can't handle dissenting information versus your personal view of reality.

This is like saying it's not safe to give people a hammer cause a guy could go out and beat a dog with it. It's a totally pointless statement.

I've already responded to lordkrike with this but I'll mention it again here. You'll at the absolute most have 3 DHS outside the engine on a jenner without compromising damage (which you need to core an atlas from the back in 3 seconds).

That's 0.18 heat dissipation per second different. 1.8 heat in ten seconds. That's not even the heat from one MPL assuming that's what you're cramming on there for maximum damage.

Sure, Garth is active and there is some good he's doing here. For me at least it's outweighed by his lack of professionalism and insulting attitude towards people with dissenting opinions. Especially in closed beta, which forums are now locked and unavailable for viewing. Something we actually predicted would happen.

I think this is an alright game, with a huge amount of potential, but from what I've seen of garth he's not a very good community manager when we've got information showing up on reddit, facebook, and other places before the official forums get it.

[Trauglodyte]

You could have Jesus (or Raptor Jesus, either works) make a post with 100% definitive facts and people would still call B.S. Ego just won't allow for people to be wrong because if they question the truth, then they in fact question themselves. Sadly, it even extends into video games.

[Flit Asuno]

Trauglodyte, on 17 January 2013 - 04:36 PM, said:

You could have Jesus (or Raptor Jesus, either works) make a post with 100% definitive facts and people would still call B.S. Ego just won't allow for people to be wrong because if they question the truth, then they in fact question themselves. Sadly, it even extends into video games.

The problem here is that Garth hasn't provided server numbers. He's just said "Trust me guys, I've seen the numbers".

[RG Notch]

Flit Asuno, on 17 January 2013 - 04:43 PM, said:

The problem here is that Garth hasn't provided server numbers. He's just said "Trust me guys, I've seen the numbers".

So you don't trust him to tell you the numbers but for some reason if he posted the same numbers you would trust them? Obviously he couldn't fake those numbers right? You can't post numbers on the internet that aren't true, I saw that on the internet.

[Trauglodyte]

Flit Asuno, on 17 January 2013 - 04:43 PM, said:

The problem here is that Garth hasn't provided server numbers. He's just said "Trust me guys, I've seen the numbers".

That's the point. The angry internet trolls think the devs are full of it because they post nothing. Then they don't post something but say that the numbers aren't that bad and are dropping off and yet the trolls say the devs are full of it. IF they were to post something, those same trolls would still say that the devs are full of it cause it doesn't match their anecdotal experience. So, at what point do you even both when the loudest people are also the most biased self entitled morons that don't even care about balance but just want what they want and how they play to be the best?

[Flit Asuno]

Trauglodyte, on 17 January 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

That's the point. The angry internet trolls think the devs are full of it because they post nothing. Then they don't post something but say that the numbers aren't that bad and are dropping off and yet the trolls say the devs are full of it. IF they were to post something, those same trolls would still say that the devs are full of it cause it doesn't match their anecdotal experience. So, at what point do you even both when the loudest people are also the most biased self entitled morons that don't even care about balance but just want what they want and how they play to be the best?

RG Notch, on 17 January 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

So you don't trust him to tell you the numbers but for some reason if he posted the same numbers you would trust them? Obviously he couldn't fake those numbers right? You can't post numbers on the internet that aren't true, I saw that on the internet.

Look, when you're making an assertion you want to see evidence/facts. Posting up server metrics or giving us access to server metrics (something that many other games do) is not that hard. Letting us see how popular a mech is in raw data.

You'd think the guy could take a screencap of the metrics and post them up or at least post them up here. If he actually provided numbers I'd be a bit more inclined to believe him. Definitely more than just saying "I've looked at the numbers guys, it's not the top 5 mech."

Trust me, I get that there are people who will still say he's lying or call ********. However, when you make a positive assertion you need evidence to back that up. Hopefully peer reviewed (hence why I want us to be able to see a page with auto-updating metrics). It's stuff that you see in games like LoL.

Also, having a dissenting opinion isn't trolling. Trolling is when you're trying to irritate someone by portraying a dishonest stance. Aka, you're saying things just to make someone mad or argue just to make someone mad. Disagreeing isn't "entitlement". As I said, I'm not just saying "Rar Garth bad. Garth PGI. Garth *******." I'm basing this off past behavior when I'm skeptical of claims. Especially the third person view debacle where in the course of a week they say third person is off the table. Then have a pod cast where they entertain the idea. Then once again say they're not going to do it.

Edited by Flit Asuno, 17 January 2013 - 06:28 PM.

[hammerreborn]

Inertiaman, on 17 January 2013 - 03:06 AM, said:

Awesome. They're on it. Super Solid!

I'd be interested to see what five mechs are beating the raven, specifically up until the spider release. Why not just tell us the most popular mechs weekly. That would make a nice dev post in and of itself. I really don't understand the continuous veil over things like that.

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__1680369

I have the Ravens at #5 behind Stalker, Atlas, Catapult, Cataphracts (in that order) but depending how they collect their data (subtracting trial mechs for example), the 5th is most likely the hunchback, surprisingly. If he did data after patch the 5th is almost certainly the Spider though.