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Ilithi Dragon

Member Since 24 Nov 2011
Online Last Active Today, 06:25 AM
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In Topic: Paging Karl Berg...karl Berg, Please Pick Up The White Courtesy Phone...

Yesterday, 11:12 AM

I am curious to know if there are any additional plans in the works to deal with the persistent pinpoint-alpha meta? I have some suggestions of my own (which I made here), but I would like to know if PGI is looking at doing anything more than, or different from what has already been done to counter that?

In Topic: Mwo Vs Pacific Rim Vs Star Wars Vs Star Trek

16 April 2014 - 05:53 PM

Oh, TNG/DS9 certainly did suffer from a fair bit of campiness that came along with the '80s and '90s, and they also suffered the limitations of the series formatting of the day - the main characters were ship's senior officers, but they wanted to do something that wasn't on the ship/that senior officers wouldn't do (such as the commando mission in TNG "Chain of Command", though that was more of a poorly-engineered excuse to have Picard captured than anything else...), but they didn't have any commandos/non-senior-officers on the cast, so they shoehorned the existing cast into the role, sometimes painfully so. VOY and ENT had slightly more flexible casts, but were severely hampered by the outmoded formatting vision that their exec producers had, and other producer/writer problems.


We do know that Starfleet does employ armor for security and combat forces, we do see it on occasion, but we rarely focus on those situations. Most of the time we see security personnel, they're performing standard Military Police/Master-at-Arms operations. Even today's militaries don't give such security personnel armor during their routine duties, and even though stab-resistant clothing is relatively easy to manufacture today, modern military duty uniforms are not stab-resistant.

In addition to seeing Starfleet employ body armor on occasion, we do hear mention of additional heavy equipment, such as personal shield generators, and we have occasionally witnessed various man-portable heavy weapons, from tetryon pulse launchers (shoulder-fired energy weapon capable of at least temporarily neutralizing energy weapons) to photon grenades (kiloton-range m/am mortars), with mention made of others. We are also given a few brief mentions of combat vehicles, from 'hoppers' (some kind of personnel transport) to 'assault skimmers.'

Then there's the fact that the standard Type-III phaser rifle is capable of putting out energies comparable to the main gun of a modern main battle tank. Modern sabot rounds for the M256 gun on the Abrams have kinetic energies of ~12 MJ, and a Type-III phaser rifle has been observed discharging continuously at an unspecified setting for over a minute at over 1 MW of output, with a fair probability that the weapon could fire in short bursts at much higher direct wattage, if not higher effective wattage due to the NDF effects of phaser weapons.

Other, non-Federation infantry weapons are reportedly capable of penetrating 4.6 gigajoule shields, though that particular Breen weapon was implied to be a heavier, anti-armor weapon, not a standard sidearm.

A more in-depth overview of what few details we have on Star Trek ground forces can be found here: http://st-v-sw.net/S...ml#Mobilization

EDIT: Besides, Trek's Hollywood combat tactics problems are hardly unique to that franchise. Pacific Rim, Star Wars, and Battletech all suffer similar problems (all mech weaponry, for example, would be out-ranged by every single modern artillery weapon, from tank guns to rockets, and many of their weapons would be out-ranged by some man-portable anti-armor weapons).

In Topic: Mwo Vs Pacific Rim Vs Star Wars Vs Star Trek

16 April 2014 - 04:30 PM

View PostStrum Wealh, on 16 April 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

Frankly, none of the Star Trek powers have any meaningful place in the conversation because none of them field any piloted ground combat mecha. :rolleyes:



If you're going for a purely ground combat fight, this is true, though Trek would probably still win a ground fight if included, given their advanced technology; they do have significant ground forces (heavy infantry weapons, armored cavalry units, artillery, etc.), we just never really see them much because the show focus is almost exclusively on the starship crews.

In Topic: Mwo Vs Pacific Rim Vs Star Wars Vs Star Trek

15 April 2014 - 07:13 PM

Posted Image

It's been reincarnated....


Nebfer's got the right approach, here, though not all of his information is accurate.

Assuming only official canon, not all of the EU fluff that clutters up some franchises, in a full-blown war scenario - for one reason or another politics have failed, conflict is inevitable, and barring the inclusion of any transcendent beings, like the Q, or the ascended Ancients from Stargate, etc. etc., Star Trek would win a war with any mentioned power, hands down.

Star Trek has, hands down, the superior space tech, and this is the most critical point.

By the end of the TNG run, Starfleet ships were capable of traveling a couple dozen times lightspeed through unexplored space, and considerably faster in zones where subspace had been mapped. In official canon, Star Wars ships have only shown comparable speeds, at best (though their sustained speed seems to be higher than Starfleet's), and Starfleet is on the verge of developing slipstream drive (the Voyager crew was able to get it almost working twice, even with their limited resources and expertise; if the tech was not already being deployed on at least some ships by Nemesis, it would have been shortly), which is matched by only a handful of sci-fi powers (such as the Ancients, Asgard, and late-series humans of Stargate, and the intergalactic powers of the Andromeda universe). Starfleet and the Empire/Republic are both lightyears ahead of the other listed powers, and Starfleet has at least roughly comparable strategic maneuverability to Star Wars, while being on the verge of a major leap past what Star Wars can achieve.

Tactically, in a ship-vs-ship fight, Star Trek ships' maneuverability is so far ahead of anything else, it's no contest. Star Wars ships have been observed pulling, at best, a couple dozen g's. Starlfeet ships have been observed accelerating at thousands, if not tens of thousands of g's, and have demonstrated incredible maneuverability. They can outrun at sublight anything any other franchise listed can put into space, and fly circles around them at will.

Star Trek also has incredible advantages in weapons range and accuracy - with Trek ships routinely firing on and accurately hitting targets tens and hundreds of thousands of kilometers away, where as Star Wars ships have trouble hitting targets mere kilometers away, and have repeatedly been observed to have weapons ranges significantly shorter than visual range.

Star Trek ships would be able to keep Star Wars ships from ever getting close enough to see them, and accurately hit them from those ranges. Battletech ships also outrange Star Wars ships, considerably so, though BT ships are limited to only a few g's of acceleration, as they lack any kind of inertial compensation system.

Weapons-wise, not only are Star Trek weapons extremely precise and accurate, they are also extremely powerful. Starfleet ships in the TNG era are equipped with photon torpedoes, with a standard yield of 1-1.5 kilograms of matter and 1-1.5 kilograms of anti-matter (depending on the warhead generation), generating a blast yield equivalent to 42-64 megatons of TNT, and their shipboard energy weapons have been observed to have yields in the high TeraJoule to low PetaJoule range, with an exotic particle effect that can magnify the effective yield a further 1000 times or more (in TNG "Q Who?", the E-D's first shot against the Cube vaporized a small hole, that then grew at least 1000 times in volume after the beam fired, and Romulan and Cardassian disruptors have been observed decimating entire continents with single volleys).

By comparison, Star Wars weapons have shown gigajoule-range weapons yields for shipboard weapons, at best. Star Wars capital ships typically have a great many of these gigajoule-range weapons that are brought to bear on a target at a time, which maintain a steady output, so actual sustained firepower across the ship is probably in the high gigawatt to low terawatt range, but when a single Trek matter/anti-matter warhead can deliver 268 PETAJoules, or 268,000 TeraJoules of energy in a single, near-instantaneous detonation, well, "One photon torpedo oughtta do..." Even small Starfleet ships would be able to decimate the largest Star Wars ships with a handful of shots, at most, while Star Wars ships, assuming they could even score return hits, would take hours to break through a single Starlfeet ship's shields, let alone its armored hull.

Throw in Starfleet's ability to engage sublight targets while at warp, and Starfleet would decimate anything the Empire or Republic could throw at it before it could even fire a shot in return.

From there, everything else is gravy, because once you have control of the orbital space, it doesn't matter how many mechs or tanks you have; they can all be effortlessly wiped out in precision orbital bombardments.

Once all the heavy equipment has been knocked out, and any large concentrations of troops, the rest is just security, and with Starfleet's sensors, computers, and other technologies, insurgent forces from any of the other franchises would easily be found out and neutralized.

Or, if there is absolutely no reason to preserve the planet itself, a small fleet of twenty capital ships can blast the planet down to its nickel-iron core in approximately five hours.

In Topic: Paging Karl Berg...karl Berg, Please Pick Up The White Courtesy Phone...

14 April 2014 - 12:48 PM

View PostRebas Kradd, on 14 April 2014 - 12:43 PM, said:


Eh, it's important to the community and a subject Karl is very knowledgeable about...so why not?


Oh, matchmaking balance is certainly important, but there are many other interesting and important suggestions, etc., as well.