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Making Pugs Better


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#1 Bront

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 12:36 PM

PUG = Pick Up Group - IE, folks not in a premade group, or more generally, folks not in your premade group.

Sometimes they're random people who just started the game. Sometimes they're folks who simply like playing alone. Sometimes they're experienced players simply grinding up XP/CBills or who's friends aren't around. And yes sometimes they're folks who are simply not good at the game. PUG is sometimes thrown around as an insult. In this case, it was not intended that way.

No, this isn't about how we could balance PUGs to be better, this is about how you as a player can make a PUG better. As a community, it's our responsibility to shepherd new players and help make the player experience better on a community level. That means, when you PUG, do your best to help your PUG win or at least have fun.

1) Communicate - Sure, some PUGs will ignore you, but some pugs won't. Hey, if you're reading this and you PUG, hopefully you're one who does pay attention to chat when you can, so why not try to work things out with them. Even simple things like "LRM Boat, give me targets" can help.

2) Know a simply plan and suggest it. - We're not talking about organized advancing formations, but a simple "Any mech faster than 90 KPH head to X, everyone else head to Y, then the fast mechs join us at Y and we'll make a stand there" can do wonders.

3) Offer advice - Hey, we were all new once. "Hey, SRMs can't fire over 270M", or "LRMs don't do damage under 180m". Sure, you died if you're able to see that, but you'll help bring up the quality of play for everyone.

4) Stick around occasionaly - Sometimes you'll learn something. Occasionaly you can turn the tide in a battle. (I once directed a lance mate by spotting the shut down atlas on the grid for the final kill)

5) Make friends - Sometimes you can't drop with your preferred team, but that doesn't mean that you can't find some random folks to play with that you met in a PUG earlier.

6) Go with the flow - Sure a PUG plan might not be great, but sticking with them at least gives them a better fighting chance.

7) Stop griping - Complaining how dumb a PUG is isn't going to win you friends. We all know not every PUG player is going to be MWO gold, but complaining about your PUG while you're fighting along side them isn't good for moral, and you might even end up taking an "Accidental" friendly fire shot or two.

8) Don't get frustrated - It's ultimately a game folks. You get whipped, you tip your cap to the other team, and you load back up to do it again. You dropped on your least favorite map? Don't ragequit, as you're basically punishing 23 other players from a potential good match. Occasionally you'll find a gem of a PUG game.

9) Not all PUGs are bad - I have some epic PUG stories, and have had some incredible PUG matches, and not all of them were wins (My 747-750 Alpine loss a few days ago, or losing in a Stalker/Atlas duel where if I'd gotten one more shot off I might have won instead both stick out from a few days ago). Hang in there.

If you expect a PUG to be bad, and treat them like they'll always be bad, well, you'll probably find what you're looking for.

Edited by Bront, 18 September 2013 - 05:39 AM.


#2 Johnny Reb

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 08:57 PM

Nice tips but most pugs will never be here and go do a fast death, leaving us all closer to either winning or dieing.

Edited by Johnny Reb, 15 September 2013 - 08:57 PM.


#3 Alaskan Nobody

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:21 PM

View PostJohnny Reb, on 15 September 2013 - 08:57 PM, said:

Nice tips but most pugs will never be here and go do a fast death, leaving us all closer to either winning or dieing.





Better to try and earned the right to say he did (or at worst complain about it)....






....Than to not even have tried and still claim the above rights

Edit: Typo

Edited by Shar Wolf, 16 September 2013 - 03:21 PM.


#4 Bront

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:40 PM

View PostJohnny Reb, on 15 September 2013 - 08:57 PM, said:

Nice tips but most pugs will never be here and go do a fast death, leaving us all closer to either winning or dieing.

It's not the pugs that need this though. This is about us, as a community, trying to help PUGs be better.

#5 Blo0dGusHeR

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:42 PM

View PostBront, on 15 September 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

No, this isn't about how we could balance PUGs to be better, this is about how you as a player can make a PUG better.

1) Communicate - Sure, some PUGs will ignore you, but some pugs won't. Hey, if you're reading this and you PUG, hopefully you're one who does pay attention to chat when you can, so why not try to work things out with them. Even simple things like "LRM Boat, give me targets" can help.

2) Know a simply plan and suggest it. - We're not talking about organized advancing formations, but a simple "Any mech faster than 90 KPH head to X, everyone else head to Y, then the fast mechs join us at Y and we'll make a stand there" can do wonders.

3) Offer advice - Hey, we were all new once. "Hey, SRMs can't fire over 270M", or "LRMs don't do damage under 180m". Sure, you died if you're able to see that, but you'll help bring up the quality of play for everyone.

4) Stick around occasionaly - Sometimes you'll learn something. Occasionaly you can turn the tide in a battle. (I once directed a lance mate by spotting the shut down atlas on the grid for the final kill)

5) Make friends - Sometimes you can't drop with your preferred team, but that doesn't mean that you can't find some random folks to play with that you met in a PUG earlier.

6) Go with the flow - Sure a PUG plan might not be great, but sticking with them at least gives them a better fighting chance.

7) Stop griping - Complaining how dumb a PUG is isn't going to win you friends. We all know not every PUG player is going to be MWO gold, but complaining about your PUG while you're fighting along side them isn't good for moral, and you might even end up taking an "Accidental" friendly fire shot or two.

8) Don't get frustrated - It's ultimately a game folks. You get whipped, you tip your cap to the other team, and you load back up to do it again. You dropped on your least favorite map? Don't ragequit, as you're basically punishing 23 other players from a potential good match. Occasionally you'll find a gem of a PUG game.

9) Not all PUGs are bad - I have some epic PUG stories, and have had some incredible PUG matches, and not all of them were wins (My 747-750 Alpine loss a few days ago, or losing in a Stalker/Atlas duel where if I'd gotten one more shot off I might have won instead both stick out from a few days ago). Hang in there.

If you expect a PUG to be bad, and treat them like they'll always be bad, well, you'll probably find what you're looking for.



You know what would make pugs better? If the game play was better. lol. Thanks for the pro tips.

Edited by Blo0dGusHeR, 16 September 2013 - 08:42 PM.


#6 Deathsani

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:45 PM

This is some great advice that I really hope some pugs take to heart.

#7 Training Instructor

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 09:05 PM

Also, newer players should know that the proper response to your opponents saying "GG", after they just steamrolled you, is to say "DIAF."

And if you're on the team that steamrolled the other guys, don't ever say "GG." It comes off as condescending.

#8 mongrel

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 05:57 PM

So please explain what the term Pug actually means? It appears to be more of an insult thrown around by some guy who already got himself waxed Then is blaims the "Pugs" on his team for his demise.

#9 Alaskan Nobody

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 06:56 PM

View Postmongrel, on 17 September 2013 - 05:57 PM, said:

So please explain what the term Pug actually means? It appears to be more of an insult thrown around by some guy who already got himself waxed Then is blaims the "Pugs" on his team for his demise.





P Ick
U p
G roup

Edit:

A random player game

He is blaming people he doesn't know for not being 'as good as he is'

Sometimes with reason, frequently without.

Edited by Shar Wolf, 17 September 2013 - 06:58 PM.


#10 Bront

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 05:37 AM

View Postmongrel, on 17 September 2013 - 05:57 PM, said:

So please explain what the term Pug actually means? It appears to be more of an insult thrown around by some guy who already got himself waxed Then is blaims the "Pugs" on his team for his demise.


Pick Up Group - IE, folks not in a premade group, or more generally, folks not in your premade group.

Sometimes they're random sheep who just started the game. Sometimes they're folks who simply like playing alone. Sometimes they're experienced players simply grinding up XP/CBills.

However, yes, it is sometimes thrown around as an insult. In this case, it was not intended that way.

I think I'll add that to the first post.

View PostShar Wolf, on 17 September 2013 - 06:56 PM, said:

He is blaming people he doesn't know for not being 'as good as he is'

Sometimes with reason, frequently without.
I'm not trying to blame them for being 'as good as me', I'm trying to make the PUG experience (that many folks here complain about) better. What I am assuming is that forum readers are either more experienced players, or are at least players looking to make their playing experience better.

Why complain about PUGs not communicating when you don't try yourself? Why complain about PUGs lacking a plan when you don't help make one? Why complain that PUGs don't advance position when you're unwilling to do it with them?

Edited by Bront, 18 September 2013 - 05:44 AM.


#11 capt hungry

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 06:05 AM

TIL - PUG = Pick Up Group. Thanks for the explanation Bront. I'd been wondering what PUG meant.

I spend most of my time playing alone and sometimes the team I am on works and sometimes not. As a PUG, I do try to communicate as best I can and support my team. It's nice to see someone spreading some positivity here!

Hope to see you all on the battlefield. I'll be the one with the big target on my mech!

#12 Appogee

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 06:19 AM

On Forest Colony:

''Don't go water, there's no cover, you will be LRMed to death, and they will cap.''.
''5 contacts in tunnel. Guys, please stop going water.''
''5 contacts on way to base. Please come back from water to base.''
''5 assaults at base. Please come help.''

/the half of the team that went water dies, I get killed trying to stop the base cap, any remaining players get steamrolled, and the other team - a premade - congratulate themselves on a 12-0 ''good game''.

I could tell you how this plays out on Alpine (''Please stop standing on the ridge, you are just getting sniped from higher positions'') or Frozen City (''Stop chasing the spider down to the ship, they are mostly in the tunnel'') or Terra Therma (''Don't all go block the one doorway to the volcano'') but you guys already know how each story ends.

In short, I have given up on trying to help PUGs. It rarely works. They generally ignore the advice and I either get forced to follow their stupid (lack of) strategy and try to do some damage before the team gets steamrolled, or I die alone because I have 10 enemies to take on solo.

#13 Bront

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 06:54 AM

Hey, it doesn't always work, but you can try. It won't be easy, and it won't always work, but it can.

I find my PUGs are a bit more responsive, but I also try to be more positive. Watching a PUG stand in at a cap point trying to hold it for just a little bit longer knowing he was going to die because we needed him to (and I asked him to), was amazing, and though we lost (747 to 750), everyone had fun, and my only regret was that I hadn't tried to take the comms a bit sooner.

Also, sometimes some other pug takes lead, and I generally let them and help out. Even if the plan isn't great, if it gets the team working together, it's better than no plan at all.

#14 Alaskan Nobody

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 09:08 AM

View PostBront, on 18 September 2013 - 05:37 AM, said:


I'm not trying to blame them for being 'as good as me', I'm trying to make the PUG experience (that many folks here complain about) better. What I am assuming is that forum readers are either more experienced players, or are at least players looking to make their playing experience better.



I had not meant "he" you, but "he" the person mongrel said was using it as an insult, appologies if it came out against you >.<

#15 Bront

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 09:24 AM

View PostShar Wolf, on 18 September 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:



I had not meant &quot;he&quot; you, but &quot;he&quot; the person mongrel said was using it as an insult, appologies if it came out against you &gt;.&lt;
No offense taken :rolleyes:

#16 LCRacerX

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 09:58 AM

View PostAppogee, on 18 September 2013 - 06:19 AM, said:

On Forest Colony:

''Don't go water, there's no cover, you will be LRMed to death, and they will cap.''.
''5 contacts in tunnel. Guys, please stop going water.''
''5 contacts on way to base. Please come back from water to base.''
''5 assaults at base. Please come help.''

/the half of the team that went water dies, I get killed trying to stop the base cap, any remaining players get steamrolled, and the other team - a premade - congratulate themselves on a 12-0 ''good game''.

I could tell you how this plays out on Alpine (''Please stop standing on the ridge, you are just getting sniped from higher positions'') or Frozen City (''Stop chasing the spider down to the ship, they are mostly in the tunnel'') or Terra Therma (''Don't all go block the one doorway to the volcano'') but you guys already know how each story ends.


Here's a different POV. As a 100% solo PUG'er, I've seen the 4-man pre-made screw up the dynamic thinking they "know better" & go off doing their own thing. Meanwhile the "blob" heads in another direction. They often are the ones bitching about "PUGs" when they're eliminated by the other team's blob.

Even better, 2 4-man pre-mades & 4 PUG'ers. The pre-mades veer off different directions & the PUG'ers split up, too. Usually unevenly.

Pre-made != great players & PUGs != horrible players.

In fact - it's the matches that I suspect are comprised of entirely PUGs that I think are the most competitive. Mixed load outs, mixed experience levels, level playing field on communication - yea - those are the fun, dirty, rough-n-tumble battles that I enjoy.

It's a challenge. It can be frustrating. It can be really rewarding, too. I enjoy it.

#17 Appogee

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 10:49 AM

View PostLCRacerX, on 18 September 2013 - 09:58 AM, said:

Here's a different POV. As a 100% solo PUG'er, I've seen the 4-man pre-made screw up the dynamic thinking they "know better" & go off doing their own thing. Meanwhile the "blob" heads in another direction. They often are the ones bitching about "PUGs" when they're eliminated by the other team's blob.

Even better, 2 4-man pre-mades & 4 PUG'ers. The pre-mades veer off different directions & the PUG'ers split up, too. Usually unevenly.

Pre-made != great players & PUGs != horrible players.

In fact - it's the matches that I suspect are comprised of entirely PUGs that I think are the most competitive. Mixed load outs, mixed experience levels, level playing field on communication - yea - those are the fun, dirty, rough-n-tumble battles that I enjoy.

It's a challenge. It can be frustrating. It can be really rewarding, too. I enjoy it.

I want to play the game you're playing.

#18 Bront

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 11:00 AM

View PostAppogee, on 18 September 2013 - 10:49 AM, said:

I want to play the game you're playing.

It happens on occasion. And when i does, it's glorious.

#19 Alaskan Nobody

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 12:43 PM

View PostAppogee, on 18 September 2013 - 10:49 AM, said:

I want to play the game you're playing.


It is a fair amount of the reason I do not run massively competitive builds on my mechs - yes I lose a lot, but at what I assume is a the lower elo bracket (from my win/loss ratio dropping me, and the average skill I play with) most matches are fairly close ones.

#20 chevy42083

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 01:06 PM

Good tips.

I often try to start comms right off the bat (What's the plan? instead of trying to read the blob on the radar), or in a time of need. eg... last few to kill, but not showing on radar... "What's the plan", "anyone seen any"... at least I know if it's time to cap, what direction to go, are we spreading out or sticking together to raid the last standing Atlas at their base.

I too try to give as many tips once dead. I watch to learn, and watch to correct.

Guilty... I didn't know how to talk to my team ONLY at first, and therefore said nothing. That's when I jumped right in to see what it was like. I never did find a keyboard map showing what every key does, and constantly learn more things (like tab to see scoreboard). Things I didn't NEED, so I didn't look them up.





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