45 replies to this topic

[Rikter Deth]

Had a bunch of one on ones today and noticed that Jenners pretty much dominate the light weight class with ECM ravens as a notable mention. Is there any statistical benefit to using a commando at all? Even the Hero Mech seems dumb. Looking for any info from veteran light pilots.

[L1f3H4ck]

Spiders are pretty good too, so you do see a lot of them. But that's because their hitboxes are about 2x3 pixels.

[Airu]

If pgi ever removes the stupid speed cap, then lighter lights would have a place, being faster than jenner, otherwise why have 19 alpha running at 150 when you can have 30 pts alpha running at 150... ECM does not really matter much lately as all streak boats have BAP and most lights die due lasers or balistics anyway.

[Training Instructor]

Current meta produced by PGi is Jenner friendly. to say the least.

[Oppresor]

The Spider is probably the only Mech that can go head to head with the Jenner at the moment. With luck this will all change when we get the Flea; I see the Flea as a Hunter Killer of Jenner's. Until then it's the ultra nimble Spider.

[Cybermech]

jenners are great till ye meet an assault who can aim

[101011]

Oppresor, on 28 September 2013 - 03:16 PM, said:

The Spider is probably the only Mech that can go head to head with the Jenner at the moment. With luck this will all change when we get the Flea; I see the Flea as a Hunter Killer of Jenner's. Until then it's the ultra nimble Spider.

As it stands the Jenner would rip apart the Flea. Same speed but with more firepower and more armor.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

ECM mechs are good for information warfare purposes, spiders are hard to core.

The commando makes a good mobile LRM carrier and if they ever fix SRM hit detection it'll be a good backstabber again.

[ICEFANG13]

SRMs are really important for light mechs, you cannot identify lights perfectly until SRMs are in a hit more state. That being said, there are a few things that are clear.

Without speedcap, Commandos, Jenner, Spider, Cicadas, Locusts would all go faster, good or not, this would be very bad for the Raven. Even the 3L would have a big problem there.

In the current state:

Raven-3L is the heaviest light mech that has ECM, it is mostly limited by its tubes and wonky SRMs (which will affect a lot of lights, from now on, I will simply says, SRMs). Raven-2X is literally worthless as a mech until it gets a higher engine cap and more modules. Its only value over the Jenner-K is that it can have a larger launcher, it really needs multiple buffs. The Raven-4X is unique in that its the largest light with ballistic slots, unfortunately this is a counter statement. Even with MGs, the engine cap is just too low to make use of them, leaving moderately effective, but outdone by other mechs, heavy ballistic Ravens.

The Commando will always have problems, it has low armor, and especially right now, has a SRM dependance. Basically with a good pilot, a Commando would beat a Spider in a very straight up fight, since the Spider cannot have the firepower of multiple SRMs, although the Spider is kinda messed up and so are SRMs. You can't really use any of them to great effect right now, but they do have arms over the Jenner. I suspect that as the game evolves we will see more Locusts, Fleas and Commandos realize that they can use STD engines. You see there is an advantage to these light light mechs, and that is, they need less engine to go faster. Even with a 100 engine, its still going what, 70? It will add a lot of ability to survive, especially if they adjust the hitboxes and make these three hard to CT, but easier to ST.

The Spider-5D is powerful with ECM and JJs. It is truly a competitive mech, even without its strange hit problems, it would do well at hit and run. The 5K has some real firepower from MGs finally, but other than that, not much. The 5V is pretty limited and not very good. One of the largest features that make Spiders good, other than JJs, which are very helpful on light mechs to live, is they have amazing hitboxes (they are also messed up, but). They can protect the CT, and have largish arms with small legs. Great hitboxes!

The Locust that I know of is probably worthless, the Spider-5K has it beat in pretty well every way.

The Flea has a lot of potential, however, it also can't go faster than 150 KPH without the speed cap and has less armor. The only way this mech could be good is if its small enough and the side torsos literally cover the CT from all angles and you put a STD engine in it. This is highly unlikely, even with MASC, it won't be good enough (you can do MASC, 5 Small Lasers, full armor, max STD engine in it though).

The Jenner-F is a monster right now. Good pilots can maintain its heat of 6 ML, and that makes it a more mobile and hotter pseudo guass cat thing. The K is usually considered weaker, but now that we have multiple good modules, it does have purpose. Seriously, I can't tell you how many Jenner-Ds I see with 4 lasers on it, or less, and I want to tell them, "use the Jenner-K man!" The Jenner-D is actually limited in that way, as you have to carry 2 missiles to make it worth it over the Jenner-K, and that means only LRM-5, SRM-2, SRM-4, and SSRM-2, two of those, and no ART. I've been using the JR7-D with 2 SRM-4 and I'm very good with it, I hope SRM detection gets better soon, because I'm amazing accurate with it, after playing it for so damn long.

[Oppresor]

101011, on 28 September 2013 - 03:19 PM, said:

As it stands the Jenner would rip apart the Flea. Same speed but with more firepower and more armor.

That's the problem; the Flea is faster but is currently restricted. If the Flea was given its true potential and maybe even MASC http://www.google.co....53217764,d.ZGU Then I have no doubt that in the right hands the Jenner would be dead.

[101011]

Precisely.

[A DRUNK GUY]

I Play with lights quite often and dont use Jenners at all, Personally I would take my Deaths Knell over a jenner any day. I will say that if you practice with and find the right loadouts other lights can be just as deadly.

[Sephlock]

ECM

[The Unknown Pilot]

The only drawback to Spiders, is compared tp other lights, they are considerably outgunned, flying be damned.

[DarkDevilDancer]

Thing is people can hit jenners, just tonight in tourmaline I fought a spider in my phract 3D I hit it three times with duel gauss and did zero damage to it and as a result it slowly burnt through my side torso and blew my gauss ruffle.

Jenners are fast agile and pack a punch but with no ecm and mostly working hit boxes it's not OP.

[TB Freelancer]

Cybermech, on 28 September 2013 - 03:17 PM, said:

jenners are great till ye meet an assault who can aim

Any high alpha build that can aim, but ballistics seem particularly effective.

Just came out of a match with several spiders and jenners. I took out 4 of them myself, legged them then destroyed them with an AC5 Ilya....

....you just gotta pick your shots instead of blowing your load and hoping for the best.

[Devil Fox]

Every light has a place, it's just finding one that works and meets your playstyle. I meet a great spider 5K player yesterday, easily 300+ dmg a game with it and the last to live, I've also played with great shot jenners etc. Myself, due to ping and hit reg find light's a touch more annoying to play because we're expected to hunt other light's... but dump me in a commando, give me working srm's and I'll go to town on the meaty stuff.

But there are only a few competitive variants, everything else is just leveling material.

Edited by Apostal, 29 September 2013 - 08:09 PM.

[Training Instructor]

The Jenner can twist so far that it can pretty much shoot a light that's right behind them. Combined with jumpjets and the ability to mount a big, low-weight alpha, and you have the best overall light.

The spider, due to it's hitboxes, is really good at annoying assaults and heavies. Other lights can line up enough straight on shots to actually take them out. I know, because I can kill spiders in my jenner or cicadas a lot easier than I kill jenners in my spider.

[BUDFORCE]

Spider = Lagshield = half team shoot spider, ignore other mechs, waste ammo/heat hitting it for 0 damage time and time again.

They need a fix, or removing until they can fix it, no other light has the problem, and I can hit all of the others just fine even at 150kph.

IMO they are ruining the game a bit for me.

[Risko Vinsheen]

DarkDevilDancer, on 29 September 2013 - 04:46 PM, said:

Thing is people can hit jenners, just tonight in tourmaline I fought a spider in my phract 3D I hit it three times with duel gauss and did zero damage to it and as a result it slowly burnt through my side torso and blew my gauss ruffle.

Jenners are fast agile and pack a punch but with no ecm and mostly working hit boxes it's not OP.

I've had more problems with not dealing damage to Commandos (A Death's Knell took 3 AC/20 rounds to the center torso, wasn't moving, still didn't even register a blip on my reticule) than Spiders. It is HIT DETECTION, not hit boxes.

Really wish people would learn the difference before they go pushing PGI into doing something like they did with the Raven's legs again. When I don't do damage to a shut down Atlas with an AC/20 at near point blank range, I don't blame it on the Atlas' hit boxes.

Edited by Risko Vinsheen, 29 September 2013 - 10:22 PM.