18 replies to this topic

[Unkempt Oatmeal]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...411f9757b96fe86

I've been switching load outs quite often, lost a lot of cbills because of it. I really don't like PPCs. I seem to always die quickly. My matches usually don't last more than 2-3 minutes, Most of the time spent getting to the encounter, then die with in 10 seconds, whether or not I'm with a large group or by myself. I usually do 120-250 damage and get 0 kills.

[Koniving]

You've turned the only long range fire support Atlas into a brawler. Bad boy!

Here's a couple I've used in the past.

3 LL, Gauss, LRM-20

Stock yet not, twin ER LL, twin MPL, LRM-20, Gauss, plenty of ammo.

Not cheap to build but disturbingly effective (due to incredible cooling power).

And this is my current rig. I confess I made the same mistake. I'm a bad boy.


These are merely ideas. Of them, the "Stock yet not" is perhaps the cheapest fix you can get.

Edited by Koniving, 07 October 2013 - 10:03 PM.

[Unkempt Oatmeal]

Koniving, on 07 October 2013 - 10:02 PM, said:

You've turned the only long range fire support Atlas into a brawler. Bad boy!

Here's a couple I've used in the past.

3 LL, Gauss, LRM-20

Stock yet not, twin ER LL, twin MPL, LRM-20, Gauss, plenty of ammo.

Not cheap to build but disturbingly effective (due to incredible cooling power).

And this is my current rig. I confess I made the same mistake. I'm a bad boy.


These are merely ideas. Of them, the "Stock yet not" is perhaps the cheapest fix you can get.

But it has the most armor out of all current mechs. Shouldn't it be up close and personal?

[Koniving]

Joshman, on 07 October 2013 - 10:06 PM, said:

But it has the most armor out of all current mechs. Shouldn't it be up close and personal?

An Atlas in general, yes. But while there are some mechs that can be the "jack of all trades", there are some that are only good in specific roles.

The best examples are found in the Awesome line.

• The 8Q is best at direct-fire weapons -- mainly because that's all it can use.
  
• The 9M is similar to the 8Q, but it has to choose between boating 6 energy and 1 missile or only getting 4 energy and 3 missiles. Even then it makes a terrible missile boat.
  
  • In reality, the 9M can do anything the other Awesomes can do while going even faster. But ultimately it can't perform any specific role better than the original.
• But, the 8V makes a fantastic combination direct and indirect fire support mech.
  
• The Pretty Baby is a combination of the 8V and the 9M, with superior maneuverability and is the only assault mech that can climb 60 degree slopes (with a lot of effort in zig-zags and using its inertia.).
  
• The 8R and 8T despite looking similar, fit very different roles.
  
  • The 8R is better suited to rapid fire missile spam of either short or long range missiles. It sports a single arm with twin direct fire weapons.
    
  • The 8T is actually awful at rapidly spamming missiles and instead has very limited missile weapons while sporting two arms with twin direct fire weapons on each.

The lesson is that not every variant in a chassis is the same.

There are brawlers in the Atlas line. Sadly the K is the worst in this case.

Starting loadouts is a good indicator as to what the mech is capable of or meant to do.

• The Atlas D for example is equipped with lots of close range weapons and a single long range weapon. If I'm not mistaken it's 4 medium lasers, AC/20 and SRM-6 as its close weapons. Every single one of these has a limited range of 270 meters. Only its LRM-20 counters this, but its ammunition is severely limited. Thus the focus of brawling is pretty clear.
  
• The D-DC is actually a command mech.
  
• The Atlas RS as you may have noticed is a rather odd ball with its default loadout. But look at its hardpoints, with so many energy weapons on the arms (arms are often used to deal with lights), its reasonable to believe the RS is meant to escort the D-DC and supplement in anti-light defense while packing a punch hard enough to strike anything else.
  
• The Atlas K comes with the option to equip twin Anti-Missile Systems, meaning it's concerned against LRMs. It also packs exclusively long range weapons. Its hardpoints are also terrible for CQC. Those twin MPL on tabletop are actually rear-mounted and fire backwards and thus would have been useless in a brawl. What I picture is it escorting a couple of LRM-boats, able to fight off pests that come its way while still being able to hammer anything in the distance. The Atlas K's twin AMS combined with 3 AMS from 3 other mechs = LRM invincibility.

Although the concept feels abandoned, the game was built with "role warfare" in mind. The Atlas K is from that era in development. If you concentrate 90% of the armor forward and carry long range weapons you'll experience a completely different mech out of your Atlas K.

[Unkempt Oatmeal]

Koniving, on 07 October 2013 - 10:35 PM, said:

An Atlas in general, yes. But while there are some mechs that can be the "jack of all trades", there are some that are only good in specific roles.

The best examples are found in the Awesome line.

• The 8Q is best at direct-fire weapons -- mainly because that's all it can use.
  
• The 9M is similar to the 8Q, but it has to choose between boating 6 energy and 1 missile or only getting 4 energy and 3 missiles. Even then it makes a terrible missile boat.
  
  • In reality, the 9M can do anything the other Awesomes can do while going even faster. But ultimately it can't perform any specific role better than the original.
• But, the 8V makes a fantastic combination direct and indirect fire support mech.
  
• The Pretty Baby is a combination of the 8V and the 9M, with superior maneuverability and is the only assault mech that can climb 60 degree slopes (with a lot of effort in zig-zags and using its inertia.).
  
• The 8R and 8T despite looking similar, fit very different roles.
  
  • The 8R is better suited to rapid fire missile spam of either short or long range missiles. It sports a single arm with twin direct fire weapons.
    
  • The 8T is actually awful at rapidly spamming missiles and instead has very limited missile weapons while sporting two arms with twin direct fire weapons on each.

The lesson is that not every variant in a chassis is the same.


There are brawlers in the Atlas line. Sadly the K is the worst in this case.

Starting loadouts is a good indicator as to what the mech is capable of or meant to do.

• The Atlas D for example is equipped with lots of close range weapons and a single long range weapon. If I'm not mistaken it's 4 medium lasers, AC/20 and SRM-6 as its close weapons. Every single one of these has a limited range of 270 meters. Only its LRM-20 counters this, but its ammunition is severely limited. Thus the focus of brawling is pretty clear.
  
• The D-DC is actually a command mech.
  
• The Atlas RS as you may have noticed is a rather odd ball with its default loadout. But look at its hardpoints, with so many energy weapons on the arms (arms are often used to deal with lights), its reasonable to believe the RS is meant to escort the D-DC and supplement in anti-light defense while packing a punch hard enough to strike anything else.
  
• The Atlas K comes with the option to equip twin Anti-Missile Systems, meaning it's concerned against LRMs. It also packs exclusively long range weapons. Its hardpoints are also terrible for CQC. Those twin MPL on tabletop are actually rear-mounted and fire backwards and thus would have been useless in a brawl. What I picture is it escorting a couple of LRM-boats, able to fight off pests that come its way while still being able to hammer anything in the distance. The Atlas K's twin AMS combined with 3 AMS from 3 other mechs = LRM invincibility.

Although the concept feels abandoned, the game was built with "role warfare" in mind. The Atlas K is from that era in development. If you concentrate 90% of the armor forward and carry long range weapons you'll experience a completely different mech out of your Atlas K.

Thank you for the help.

[Modo44]

My standard Atlas K takes 3xLL+AC20, Endo Steel, STD350. Flank to your heart's content. You only have one missile slot, so if you must use it, stick at least LRM15 in it. You can add LRM15/20 by dropping the engine down to STD325, which is still reasonably fast. Do not put a Gauss Rifle in an Atlas. It will blow you up the moment you are found, because everybody always shoots the right shoulder.

[Unkempt Oatmeal]

Modo44, on 07 October 2013 - 11:23 PM, said:

My standard Atlas K takes 3xLL+AC20, Endo Steel, STD350. Flank to your heart's content. You only have one missile slot, so if you must use it, stick at least LRM15 in it. You can add LRM15/20 by dropping the engine down to STD325, which is still reasonably fast. Do not put a Gauss Rifle in an Atlas. It will blow you up the moment you are found, because everybody always shoots the right shoulder.

Hmm. So how about 3 ERLL, LRM20, and one of the AC's. Which is generally the best one? I know they have around the same DPS, except for the ac5 for some reason. And I've been told to avoid the UAC5 at all costs.

[Alistair Winter]

It's been a while since I played the AS7-K, but my money maker was always the one with 3 Large lasers, gauss and LRM10 or 20 (I forget which). But that was a long time ago, before gauss rifles exploded like hydrogen bombs and before they had to be charged to fire.

Today, I think new players should have something like this.
AS7-K - Homemade vanilla: STD300, 2 ERLL, 2Mlas, 1 LRM10+Artemis with 180 rounds, 1 AC10 with 60 rounds

• No XL engine, because no good players ever fire at your Atlas CT - they always go for your side torsos. Especially if you have a gauss rifle.
  
• Combination of AC10s and 2 medium lasers means that you have plenty of punch in a brawl.
  
• 60 rounds of ammo for your AC10 means you'll almost never run out of ammo
  
• Artemis isn't very important, but I had 1 ton to spare and it was the best option, because there's no room for more heatsinks. You could replace Artemis with a second ton of LRM ammo.
  
• Full leg armor, no chance of ammo blowing up
  
• 4 different weapons, which is kind of hard to use. May want to group AC10 together with Medium lasers

For a rich, experienced player, I think the best build may be something like this.

AS7-K - Zeus - XL350, 3 ER LL, 1 Gauss rifle with 40 rounds, 1 LRM10 with 180 rounds

• Very fragile due to XL engine and gauss rifle, but the big XL engine makes you fast enough to avoid some damage by using cover and/or torso twisting.
  
• Super deadly at long range. Use ER LLs in combination with gauss rifle, so you're charging your gauss while firing your ER LLs. Beam duration is 1.00 second, gauss charge time is 0.75 seconds
  
• Only 3 different weapon groups, easier to use.
  
• Low leg armor, but gauss ammo doesn't explode and no one will be aiming for your legs when you have a gauss rifle.

[NRP]

An Atlas is probably the hardest mech to solo PUG. Even an optimized build will be rendered ineffective more often than not depending on the luck of the draw with your team's composition and skill. If you intend to play this game solo and you want to drive an Assault, choose one of the smaller, faster ones (preferably with jump jets). They can pack just as much firepower, but are more maneuverable so you'll survive longer. I know it's counterintuitive, but that's just the way the game plays.

[Modo44]

Joshman, on 08 October 2013 - 02:38 AM, said:

Hmm. So how about 3 ERLL, LRM20, and one of the AC's. Which is generally the best one?

If you want ERLLs, take an AC5 as a backup, with more heatsinks for sustained lazor fire. Personally, I tend to stay away from ERLLs on Atlas builds, preferring more reasonable heat to range. With Endo Steel, you can fit an AC10. By downgrading to 2xML in the CT, you can even take an AC20. One LRM20 is a backup weapon on an Atlas, hence low ammo. You can take more ammo if you downgrade to LRM15. That last build is currently on my Atlas K.

[muskrat]

Salute Joshman
I Run this for My Atlas 7-D works on the 7K as well

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7a34463b323330b

Bow
Muskrat

[Bront]

I've worked with a few Atlast-K pilots, and always suggest this build for mid-long range fire support.

Atlas-K, STD350, AC10 /w 3 tons of ammo, 2x AMS /w 2 tons of ammo, 2x ERLL (Arms), 2x ML (CT), LRM10 /w 1 ton of ammo (For harrassment).

It's maneuverable for an atlas, has good range and can protect other LRM/Fire Support team mates, and doesn't suffer up close.

[Koniving]

Bront, on 13 October 2013 - 07:22 AM, said:

I've worked with a few Atlast-K pilots, and always suggest this build for mid-long range fire support.

Atlas-K, STD350, AC10 /w 3 tons of ammo, 2x AMS /w 2 tons of ammo, 2x ERLL (Arms), 2x ML (CT), LRM10 /w 1 ton of ammo (For harrassment).

It's maneuverable for an atlas, has good range and can protect other LRM/Fire Support team mates, and doesn't suffer up close.

Fast. Hot(ter than I'd like). Though the ammo placement strikes me as odd. Might try it though with my own arrangement.

[Bront]

Koniving, on 13 October 2013 - 07:28 AM, said:

Fast. Hot(ter than I'd like). Though the ammo placement strikes me as odd. Might try it though with my own arrangement.

Yeah, place the ammo to your liking. I was playing with it enough that I didn't bother putting it in the correct spots. You can swap the ERLLs out for LLs if you want to run cooler.

Edited by Bront, 13 October 2013 - 08:09 AM.

[Danial Wolf]

I quite enjoy the K STD 300, 3 x LL, 1 x Gauss and 2 AMS.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d1a06949669f71b

My best result with the K

[Wrenchfarm]

Somehow the Atlas-K became my most used mech (since the stats wipe anyway). Maybe it's because I love dual-AMS after the buffs, maybe it's because I'm a hipster. In any case, this is what I use, and it's served me reasonably well. As you can see from my stats, it's not terribly great, but it isn't a total deathtrap either.

325STD gives decent speed while still mounting the heavy Gauss, LLAS, and extra AMS. IMO, running an XL in an Atlas is suicide - irresponsible to your team even. It takes a tank and turns it into a rusty jeep, you WILL be killed faster than any other Atlas, especially if you are packing a Gauss.

Twin AMS with two tons of ammo. Extravagant maybe, but if you aren't taking advantage of the single unique trait of the mech, why even bother? Besides, twin AMS is actually pretty great right now. Not only will it knock a significant chunk of LRMs out of the sky, it will even knock out streaks and SRMs fired from further than about 100m. If the enemy if chain firing streaks, it will defeat them completely. A cloud of SRMs will still get through, but not all of them.

Think of it as a 3 ton investment in damage mitigation. Every missile the AMS knocks out is another 2.5 points of armor saved. In a missile heavy match, you can save literally tons of armor with them, lasting longer and giving you more time to deal damage.

Okay, the weapons are odd and I wouldn't blame anyone for criticizing them. A Gauss in an Atlas is a dicey proposition at best. But considering you don't have the SRMs or ballistic mounts to match other assaults in a brawl, the the dual-AMS already helps when hanging back a bit in LRM range, the Atlas-K does best at mid to long distance. No sense taking an AC20 only to get ripped up by a AC20+SRM18 or twin LBX D-DC, a dual AC20 Jagger, or a brawler Stalker.

The Gauss will let you inflict steady damage outside of the effective range of these weapons. But it won't win in straight up sniper wars with mechs carrying multiple ballistics or PPCs.

So try to get mid-range, where you can apply those LLAS. When the enemy gets closer, add in the MLAS. The Gauss, LLAS, and MLAS have a combined pinpoint alpha of 43 damage. The Atlas-K is no slouch when in the proper range.

The chest mounted MLAS also help when fighting stuff on elevations. They actually rest a little higher than the arms and clip against low obstacles less.

The LRM10 is frankly the best use for the single missile hardpoint. It isn't worth packing a single SRM6, and you probably shouldn't invest the tonnage for an LRM15 or 20 that will have to fire in a staggered burst. Use the LRM10 intelligently. Harass and heckle enemies that are behind obstacles. Use them to frighten mechs back in cover, the "MISSILE INCOMING" warning doesn't say how many are on the way after all. Use them when fighting mechs in the open around 200-500m away to add damage and flustering screen shake.

If all that seems more like theory crafting than actual combat advice, that's because it half is. I get some mileage out of the LRM10, but probably not enough to justify the 7 tons.

But there are precious few other options. Due to crit space and hardpoint limitations, it might be the best use of space. Ghost heat ruined the idea of adding a third LLAS to the chest energy slot - I'd rather be able to add the MLAS to an alpha than have an extra LLAS I have to concentrate on staggering or risk an overheat. As I said, there is zero point in bringing a single streak or SRM pack. And any bigger LRM pack is a similar waste of tonnage.

The Atlas-K is a problematic mech. I love it, I've done well in it, but I will never sell it as some underrated hero. It's a niche mech for weirdos.

As an aside, I personally like the fact that my build is essentially a downgrade of the SLDF version. Dropping the XL engine, changing out the ERLLAS for regulars, the pulse mediums for plain, and the LRM20 down to an LRM10 - only retaining the Gauss as the single piece of losttech.

If "muh lore, muh RP!" isn't a good enough reason for you to use a mech, don't get an Atlas-K.

[Sillen]

iirc - 4 x ML, AC20 3TONS, LRM15+ARTEMIS 3TONS, 2XAMS W/3TONS, Std 330

[Wrenchfarm]

Bumping to see if there are any other decent Atlas-K builds out there.

Don't let the big guy down.

[Blackadder]

The best build for a K, is the same as for a D, with 1 less SRM 6. due to having low mounted arm and center torso energy weapons, you have to expose yourself to really lay down signficant fire. if you want a direct fire longer range build, get an RS, mount a GR and 4 PPC/LL etc.

4 ML, AC20 or GR, 1 SRM/LRM, 2 AMS - 325 or 350 std engine, 14-16 heatsinks.

The problem with trying to use an atlas as a long range support build, is basically you minimize its most valued asset, its armor & ability to soak sustained damage, with torso twist. with a K, dual AMS allows you to ignore most missile fire, and get close. if you have a couple of fire support mechs, you can break out 500-600 damage per match pretty easy. You have seen these guys, the 2 atlas in the back lobbing LRM's or taking potshots, while your entire team gets chewed up, and they then complain about losing every match cause there team sucks, please don't be that guy.

The highlanders, jagermechs, stalkers are all superior long range weapons platforms due to higher mounted energy weapons in torsos & arms. The RS is the only mech with enough arm mounted energy points to be able to use angles to avoid exposing its entire torso & head when it wants to fire.

Edited by Blackadder, 24 October 2013 - 04:39 AM.