184 replies to this topic

[xMEPHISTOx]

Mott, on 10 January 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

And yet it's an approach that MANY are taking; he is not an anomaly. Which should lead anyone to realize that there is a pretty serious underlying issue.

You repeatedly saying there isn't an issue, doesn't change the fact that there is. The proof is in the fact that many come here to share their displeasure. Your claim that those people don't exist is instantly debunked the second anyone reads through any thread, anywhere in these forums.

It is not that these issues do not exist it is that to many are unwilling to spend the time to learn and find the resources to help them improve, the outright laziness and ezmode expectations astounds me.
It is difficult...and that is a good thing.
I tire of all the ezmode bs games that take no real effort or skill to be good. This new age BS that everybody is a winner is bleeding into games and it makes me sick. Take the time and effort and you will learn, and acquire the skills and knowledge that makes a pilot good.

[Osric Lancaster]

xMEPHISTOx, on 10 January 2014 - 03:08 PM, said:

It is difficult...and that is a good thing.

Weeelll. . . yes and no. Skill based difficulty is a good thing. Dropping a new player into Terra Therma in a new SHS 'Mech is not. Hell, I know what I'm doing and it's still an arse pain having to either dump an unrecoverable 1.5 million into a grind 'Mech or cram it with ten plus tons of heatsinks if I want to be able to both walk and shoot in maps like Terra Therma. The grind tree to elite out a 'Mech doesn't really improve game play or diversity because there's only one way to max out a 'Mech, and the advantage it gives you is significant.
I'd be fine if they adjusted the game mechanics to increase skill difficulty. Make skill trees branching and diverse. Make re-skilling more or less painless, but still XP consuming. Make it so you don't have a little red arrow pop up over a 'Mech unless you have it targeted or a friendly in range has a command console. Make command consoles let you and friendlies retain last known positions of enemies. Add in collisions and DFA mechanics. Make jump jets useful for midair directional maneuvers. etc. . . In other words, make the game more intricate and stimulate-y and less grindy with money and Xp sinks more diverse and less obvious.

[Average Pilot]

Shar Wolf, on 09 January 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:

Not necessarily, but consider which is more likely:
Someone who has played for less than an hour having seen and found all the bugs/features/lack-of-features that get complained about SO frequently:
Or an alt account of a disgruntled vet.

You will notice that the OP did not complain about the usual - which in my irritation at yet another similar thread (if barely similar) I missed out on.

You have my apologies Harvester - and welcome to the game. (should you be brave enough to stick around)

Shar... Much appreciated, and yeah, after playing some more and stewing on it overnight, I'm gonna stay. I've always been a fan of the BT universe, but I think I kinda let my frustration at the complex gameplay and being matched with obviously superior pilots with fabulous hardware get the best of me. I'd have replied earlier, but I used up my newbie posting allowance yesterday... So, I'll keep at it and get better the old fashioned way - practice, practice, practice. See you on the LZ...

[Void Angel]

Mott, on 10 January 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

And yet it's an approach that MANY are taking; he is not an anomaly. Which should lead anyone to realize that there is a pretty serious underlying issue.

You repeatedly saying there isn't an issue, doesn't change the fact that there is. The proof is in the fact that many come here to share their displeasure. Your claim that those people don't exist is instantly debunked the second anyone reads through any thread, anywhere in these forums.

I realize marketing doesn't always lend itself to strict adherence to the truth, but you should at least try to avoid straw man fallacies and unsupported generalizations. I've not said there isn't any issue - in fact, I've pointed out to another poster that there is. I simply object to your high-handed and unsupportable assertions that there's this huge, looming problem - that there HAS to be thousands of disaffected customers based on your astute sampling of fiver days of forum activity. Making grand pronouncements based on your unverifiable credentials as a font of "industry standard" rules of thumb isn't terribly convincing - as "anyone" of my own training will tell you.

I've also noted that you've been told people are posting on "newbie" accounts simply to create a negative impression in new players. I gave examples from my own experience - which you ignored. In more rigorous circles of thought, presenting false or disingenuous claims (you've been around since 2011; how are you a "recent newbie,") refusal to deal with contrary data that's presented to you - not to mention misrepresenting opponents' viewpoints through malice or lack of due diligence - is good reason to doubt the worth of your own views.

The Harvester, on 10 January 2014 - 04:18 PM, said:

Shar... Much appreciated, and yeah, after playing some more and stewing on it overnight, I'm gonna stay. I've always been a fan of the BT universe, but I think I kinda let my frustration at the complex gameplay and being matched with obviously superior pilots with fabulous hardware get the best of me. I'd have replied earlier, but I used up my newbie posting allowance yesterday... So, I'll keep at it and get better the old fashioned way - practice, practice, practice. See you on the LZ...

Don't forget to check out the help threads - or just post your own if you has questions. Like I said before, we really do want to help you out if you're gonna stick with the game. =)

[Average Pilot]

To all... Thanks for all the input, suggestions, and frankly, the call outs on me letting my frustration get the better of me. I had forgotten how long it took me to become a very proficient pilot in the old non-online MW games. So, as I mentioned to Shar (my original nemesis) above, I'm gonna keep plugging away at it and work to get a feel for the game and its play mechanics. I actually went thru a few more drops yesterday evening and finally scored a kill, so that was encouraging. It can be done!

Also to all the posters here... Now I definitely feel welcomed to the community, and I really appreciate that. I'll look forward to going downrange with some of you at some point, and I'll also look forward to seeing how the game continues to evolve since some of the folks mentioned things were still being developed.

Having said all that, I think I need to go blow some up some virtual stuff, so it's off to the mech bays... Keep your guns in the fight, gentlemen...

[Void Angel]

PS: the trial 'mechs now are all non-canon, upgraded designs - but they're typically designed to do one thing (the highlander is a jump sniper with ER Large lasers; actually not a bad 'mech for learning the chassis.) If you figure out what the 'mech designer wanted it to do, you'll be more effective with the mech.

[Mott]

Nick Makiaveli, on 10 January 2014 - 03:07 PM, said:

Except do we want the game dumbed down to the level of those who think 2 days is too much work to be a master of the game and have all options opened up to them?

I don't see game like that holding on to a demographic older than 6 or 7.

Nope, not at all. I quite enjoy how most of it is set up, and being a newbie the constantly delayed deadlines haven't affected me in any way, so i haven't built up the hate in that regard either that some have.

That said, I was quite disheartened by my first performances and had zero enjoyment in my first night playing - getting steamrolled time and time and time again, 2, 3 and 4 minutes into a match. Never getting a chance to learn or improve. And if i didn't know that the forums existed, to turn to for information, encouragement and general improvements... I may have just cut out and uninstalled.

And that's exactly what is likely happening with lots of players. Many people don't know the forums exist, or that there is a pretty awesome and active community here. And likely there are others who know it exist, but forums aren't their thing so they also don't visit to learn about how deeply gratifying this game will become if they just give it a week or two.

I just wish the game did a better job of feeding itself to newbies more accurately - be upfront "Want a challenge? We'll **** your brain and make you regret ever grabbing a mouse! Try us, and you'll be hooked" lol

Anyways, i'm not here to join in the voices who love to lambaste the product and the developers at every chance. I just find it pretty alarming that so many are quick to jump on anyone new who posts a disgruntlement.
Every point of view is valid, even if you don't agree with it.

[xMEPHISTOx]

@Harvester

Good decision and self reflection.
I would recommend downloading/setting up TeamSpeak 3 (http://www.teamspeak...?page=downloads) and jumping on either the Comstar TS server (na1.mech-connect.net pass- WordofBlake) or the NGNG TS server (ts7.gameservers.com:9196) as there are many there that are helpful and grouping with others increases the chance of success in battles which means more credits/xp.
Also look into possibly joining in on a 'clan'/'unit' to further exasperate the help and grouping. Not all units are about being highly competitive, many are casual as well, so it is not so offsetting as it may appear to join a unit.

Anyway, good luck w/your grinding.

[Silent]

AaronWolf, on 10 January 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

Don't know about you guy's, but I don't see the point in pointing fingers and being sarcastic anymore...

...I do see a point in posting pictures for my responses over typing anything out anymore!

Hey AaronWolf we aren't in KTown oh wait this is just how you normally post hahaha.

[War Beast]

Nick Makiaveli, on 10 January 2014 - 10:28 AM, said:

Thinned that out a bit, but what's left is a lot of false information.

Get a clue dude. You did nothing but change the wording of my statements then add in additional statements of your own choosing instead of replying directly to what I wrote.

You just kinda made up in your own head what you wanted to hear, then proceeded to respond to your own statements. Very sad really.

My points are 100% spot on. THAT is the experience you get as a newbie. Trying to reword it and pretend its not is just bull***t.

[War Beast]

Mott, on 10 January 2014 - 12:15 PM, said:

Vets can harp all they want that new players who haven't played all their cbill/xp boost matches don't have a reason to complain (maybe it's true).

But that doesn't change the fact that there is a very major problem with new player disillusionment and people not enjoying the game early on. Entertainment is supposed to suck us in and make us want more.

MWO does the opposite - most people come here looking to rekindle past experiences with the BT/MW lore and community developed through table games, books, the cartoon series and other video games - and they get none of that from the current MWO. There's no MWO-run community warfare or leagues.

Next they're hoping for a great game that provides hours of fun... but instead get a game that absolutely punishes newbies for at least 50 matches... and more like 500 if we're totally honest.

Yes, the rewards ARE there - down the road - in the improved skills, and friends made, etc... but none of that is apparent to anyone who just downloaded it.

So (too?) many vets here wear the fact they've grinded through tough times like a badge of honour. And in many ways it is... but why in Thor's name would anyone WANT/support barriers to entry? We all love this property and want to see it live long and develop well... why encourage the chasing away of new players? The more who stick with it, the more PGI has to work with both in terms of our dollars spent, but also in negotiating power when it comes to getting funding partners and license holders to work with them.

I'm a marketer, and pretty damned good or I wouldn't be able to exist as one, and this developing & marketing team need MAJOR AID. When i first broke into the industry the rule of thumb was that for every upset client who let you know they were upset, you had already lost 16 silent sufferers.
In the last few years since the web has exploded with infinite choices for product and service suppliers... it's believed that ratio has ballooned to 1 complainer for every 80 (EIGHTY!) who never let you know they won't support you again.

The other side of the spectrum is 6 happy silent fans/supporters for every 1 that lets you know.

To put that in perspective... since i first visited these forums on SUNDAY, I have seen 4 posts from noobs who like the game and are happy with it and appreciate the support from vets (this is including my own post). Conversely, i have seen 13 upset and disgruntled noob posters who all complain about the same components.

Do the math (and assuming those marketing ratios are correct) you'll see that means there's only 24 happy players sticking around compared to the 1040 (ONE THOUSAND FORTY!!) unhappy players ditching the game after just a few hours.

Spot on. I've decided I'm going to give it til the end of the free premium time. Then I'm out. Based on all that I've read this game wont even start to make changes to MM till months after the UI20 thing next month. We wont see any meaningful changes till summer sometime.

So matchmaker gets to make nightmare experiences for new and old players alike for another 6 months.

[War Beast]

Mott, on 10 January 2014 - 12:38 PM, said:

No, I'm not.

As I explained quite clearly, i'm applying a generally accepted industry rule to a situation, using the exact number of pro/con posts I've seen in my short time on these forums, using the only sample population that makes sense - MWO players who express an opinion.

Sure it's a small sample size - i never said it wasn't. And maybe after 3 or 4 or 6 months it'll even out and I'll see 50% positive responses and 50% negative responses... but that'll still be only hundreds of happy players compared to tens of thousands of unhappy players.

It makes zero business sense.

The game has been "live" for 1.5 years now. I dont think things are evening out at all. In fact I'm sure if you were to do some post research, you find staggeringly sad numbers.

And just from a personal perspective I'm part of a local gaming club. Out of the 11 people who have tried it, NO ONE has stayed with the game. I'm the only current player. One other member still plays occassionally but is no longer "active". He's the one who got me to try it. And sadly based on my readings and my experiences, I'm going to break off and hope it gets better in a year.

So out of 11 players in my local circle who've spent time with the game - that makes 11 players who have stopped. 2 of us hoping for better developments. The rest were fairly pissy about the experience.

Those are sucky numbers too.

Edited by War Beast, 10 January 2014 - 10:24 PM.

[dangerzone]

Hey, Harvester. I see that you are fresh off the boat new, and I want to extend an open invite to you to join my Merc Unit. We are a bit small right now (9 active members). We don't care about skill, or if you're new to the game, or a vet...we just care about 3 things:

1.: You have common sense
2.: You work well with others
3.: You are not an *sshole.

We have skilled and unskilled players and we get along VERY nicely. I personally would not mind training you, and I know others in my unit would not mind either.

We DO have practices Tues and Thurs. 9pm EST, but we won't kill you or boot you from the group if you can't show up or prefer not to practice (although we do encourage it). We generally have at least 4 people on every night from 8pm to midnight EST.

We have our own website to which you can apply. It is a tad menial and we might be looking into other hosting choices.

I'm currently 21 years old and the co-founder for the group. We have two people who are 40+ and they are VERY friendly. We have some others ranging from 15yo to 20yo, but I assure you everyone is mature, loves MW and we all have a "rip snortin'" good time.

I'm really glad to hear you have chosen to stick around. I've been around since May 2012 in Closed beta and as of recently I am a Contributive Author for NGNG. (I write Patch Reviews for MW:O on NGNG's own forums. My first patch review should be finished by early next week).

If you wish to apply, you will have to apply on our website (We accept just about anyone, but still require applications), check us out over at: http://1alphard.guil...0&TabID=4201636 (I designed our artwork except for our website background)

If you want to talk to some of us on teamspeak where we hold our group drops and such, head over to the No Guts No Galaxy (NGNG) Teamspeak server at:
address: voip01.n1585.hypernia.net:9992
pw: mechwarrior
(To find our channel, scroll down past the NGNG Offices section, and into the "Merc Unit" section. We are below A.C.E.S. Look for "1st Alphard Legionnaires")

I'd love to see you become someone who can kick some shiny metal *** (lol), and become a skilled pilot.

Some info on our merc unit is as follows:

Quote

In the 3040's, several mercenaries found themselves without a goal in the current state of the Inner Sphere. As a result, they went to the periphery seeking to plunder the resources of many rimworlds to gain much needed supplies and mechs before returning to the Inner Sphere. After several run-ins with the MHAF, the Caesar offered them a long-term contract with the Marians. With several of the group's officers and personnel being former Marian Hegemony citizens, the agreement was made. The 1st Alphard Legionnaires were formed, a mercenary unit that would heed the call of Alphard when the Hegemony was in danger. Seeking out new pilots on its return run to the Inner Sphere, the 1st Alphard Legionnaires are now recruiting!Whether completely new to mech combat or a former mechjock from the days of the Crescent Hawks, the Legionnaires will be glad to have you!

If you would like to know a little bit about us, we are a canon-based Marian Hegemony mercenary group that is loosely based off of Ceasar Cohorts and McCarron's Armored Cavalry. We accept both new and veteran Mechwarriors and are willing to work with everyone to suit their needs.

I'll actually be on the Teamspeak server now from this point onwards for about another hour or two. Hope to see you on the field, 'Mechwarrior. Oh, and welcome to Mechwarrior: Online!



Edited by dangerzone, 10 January 2014 - 10:51 PM.

[Nick Makiaveli]

War Beast, on 10 January 2014 - 09:33 PM, said:

Get a clue dude. You did nothing but change the wording of my statements then add in additional statements of your own choosing instead of replying directly to what I wrote.

You just kinda made up in your own head what you wanted to hear, then proceeded to respond to your own statements. Very sad really.

My points are 100% spot on. THAT is the experience you get as a newbie. Trying to reword it and pretend its not is just bull***t.

Umm.....no I deleted some pieces of what you said. Scroll and re-read your own post.

Also, did you even read what I wrote?

The new player experience is not a walk in the park. If the player is stupid, foolish, or impatient, it's especially hard. The rest of us figure out what we did wrong and adapt.

Change is coming. Let's see what happens.

[dangerzone]

Nick Makiaveli, on 10 January 2014 - 11:00 PM, said:

Umm.....no I deleted some pieces of what you said. Scroll and re-read your own post.

Also, did you even read what I wrote?

The new player experience is not a walk in the park. If the player is stupid, foolish, or impatient, it's especially hard. The rest of us figure out what we did wrong and adapt.

Change is coming. Let's see what happens.

[SaltBeef]

The Harvester, on 09 January 2014 - 06:31 PM, said:

@Buckminster... Now that's actually a good idea. It would be helpful for me (and abviously for others) to have as you say a "trial mechs only" area so us new folks can cut our MWO teeth and start to build some actual skill instead of getting our guts stomped out every single match. I love the BT universe, the board game, and the older MW games (which I can't play any more unfortunately), but going up against the heavily experienced opponents really takes the wind out of my sails... I'll keep an eye on things though... Maybe they'll take your suggestion to heart and make a new pilot arena or something.

Put together another old computer!! There are plenty of parts stil out there! I just built another one and just finished MW3, Pirates moon, Mechwarrior 4 , Black night, and am currently working on the mercinaries campaigns. Love the solaris matches. When I was out in the single player mission MW4 mercs (Kell HOUNDS) with my 7 other lancemates, we would asbsolutely destroy a mech in 2 or 3 seconds with attack my target command. This game is very tough on noobs and does not have the feel of the older mechwarrior games, and since it is an online only you are at the mercy of the server gods. Once you unlock the arms , get cockpit view, and hide and shoot alot, hide shoot, hide , shoot the game needs improvements but you will get used to it. I do think MW4 and MW3 were sweet to play. If those games had these graphics it would be perfection.

[SaltBeef]

Just for sharts and giggles I did my Atlas D-DC builds in MW4 and was able to get more streaks on them it kinda felt the same so the atlas's are close in MWO. Duel LBX 10's duel, ER large lasers, streaks. I had to use clan streaks in MW4. Even did the RS-(c) with the guass, I like the guass in MW4 much better unlike the Bombast Guass in this game. If you have the inner sphere pak you can build hunchbacks. Catapults are way different.

Edited by SaltBeef, 11 January 2014 - 03:26 AM.

[Average Pilot]

Hey all... Just thought I'd update you on progress. Figured out how to spend the c-bills I'd been earning and picked up a Quickdraw that I've been tinkering with the loadout on. Still under the learning curve a good bit in terms of maneuvering for combat effectiveness. Found the MWO youTube channel, so I did some learning there. Discovered how to use weapon grouping today, which is coming in handy. Still seems like opponents can put an awful lot of steel on me before I can respond with effective fire, so that's still a point of frustration. I've stuck mostly to energy weapons for simplicity's sake, but I think I'm gonna have to branch out to missles & ballistic weapons to get some reach. Mech movement is getting more second-nature, so more progress there. GXP comes excrutiatingly slow, so it seems like it'll be forever before I can start to reap any benefits there (I just cracked 1,000 GXP after 57 matches, and you have to be in the several thousands before you can use them if I'm interpreting things correctly in the interface... sheesh).

Anyway... Hanging in there and getting seat time, which is what gets things better. Will check back in later. Hope to see some of you downrange...

[luxebo]

SaltBeef, on 11 January 2014 - 03:24 AM, said:

Just for sharts and giggles I did my Atlas D-DC builds in MW4 and was able to get more streaks on them it kinda felt the same so the atlas's are close in MWO. Duel LBX 10's duel, ER large lasers, streaks. I had to use clan streaks in MW4. Even did the RS-© with the guass, I like the guass in MW4 much better unlike the Bombast Guass in this game. If you have the inner sphere pak you can build hunchbacks. Catapults are way different.

While off topic, if you had Mekpak 3.1, you could have access to the K2, the Warlord (dual gun rack Atlas), Hunchback IIC, and a bunch of other mechs. Plus, the hardpoints are more variety packed, so that means more hardpoint configs, like Awesome being able to fit 4 ER PPCs.

Edit: While GXP is slow in earnage, MXP is decently fast. MXP is mech only, and placed with the XP you earned, while GXP is like a fraction of that.

Edited by luxebo, 14 January 2014 - 09:45 PM.

[Azgrael]

The Harvester, on 14 January 2014 - 07:49 PM, said:

GXP comes excrutiatingly slow, so it seems like it'll be forever before I can start to reap any benefits there (I just cracked 1,000 GXP after 57 matches, and you have to be in the several thousands before you can use them if I'm interpreting things correctly in the interface... sheesh).

Hey Harvester,

Great to see you're sticking with it man.
I don't know if you know this, but just in case you don't here goes nothing: GXP is general experience, it can be used to unlock modules or proficiences on any mech. While in a match, you will also earn XP, which can only be applied to the mech that you dropped in. You can easiely see that in the "Pilot lab" -> "Mech Trees", then just navigate to your machine. Those proficiencies will make your life a lot better. Like I said, don't know if you knew this or not, not trying to insult you or anything.

Hmm, it just occured to me: If I'm not mistaken, trial mechs no longer generate XP, so the above will only applied if you've bought your own machine, and played with it.

Also, if you're looking for some company in game, someone to show you the ropes (most of which are hidden unfortunately), just send me a pm, and we'll see what happens. Don't let my post count fool you, I'm spent more time in this game that I'd like to admit.

Hope you stick with it a bit longer, I'm pretty sure you'll come to enjoy it.

Cheers,
Azzy