27 replies to this topic

[Tam Wolfcry]

I've been trying to play my hunchback for a while now, and the right torso gets wiped out in seconds, regardless of my positioning to enemy mechs. Seems like even when my left side is turned to them, shots are hitting my right torso. Why the hell would you put in a mech that is so easy to disable?? Remove the damn thing or fix it. Asinine that every damn shot finds its way to the right torso.

[Zyllos]

This has nothing to do with hitboxes and everything to do with pin point convergence.

[AntiSqueaker]

Zyllos, on 22 January 2014 - 05:48 PM, said:

This has nothing to do with hitboxes and everything to do with pin point convergence.

True, but when the Hunchback has the largest hitbox disparity of *any* mech in the game (like seriously, the Hunch is almost as large as the CT!), it's going to act as a giant bullet magnet (Heck, the hunch even continues to the REAR TORSO and still counts as front torso). Pin-point convergence is (regrettably) here to stay it seems like, and the Hunchback continues to be treated like the red-headed step-child of the Mediums.

It should have been #1 to get a hitbox rework. No other mech in the game has close to the same giant "shoot me here to take out 80% of my firepower" sign. Just because a system is broken doesn't mean a mech should have to suffer above all others for it.

[Selfish]

If you're turning and shots are still hitting your RT you're probably turning too late. The way HSR works is that it 'rewinds' damage dealt, so if you face a player with a higher ping you need to twist before THEY take the shot on THEIR screen.

Take a player with a 300 ping and an AC/20. By the time you see him shoot, his shot has already been in the air for 0.3 seconds. It only takes ~0.4 seconds for his shot to hit you at 270m. The solution is you need to twist before he even takes a shot, and keep an eye out for high ping players every game.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

Hunchbacks suffer from too little armor, slow speed due to an XL being suicide, and being forced to drop with assaults who can discharge more damage in one alpha than the right torso can soak. I love running my hunchie and squaring off against other mediums. Heavies and assaults simply outclass the hunchback to the point of worthlessness.

Twisting in a hunchback is like a p@rn star in a china shop. She's still going to knock things over with her rack.

Edited by lockwoodx, 22 January 2014 - 08:33 PM.

[kesuga7]

Zyllos, on 22 January 2014 - 05:48 PM, said:

This has nothing to do with hitboxes and everything to do with pin point convergence.

i still find it easy to srm hunchbacks in kintaro though :{

love my still 4P regardless

Edited by kesuga7, 22 January 2014 - 09:15 PM.

[SkyCake]

hunch back is easily the best medium in my opinion... it takes some while getting used to torso twisting to protect that hunch but when you get the hang of it the mech really starts to pwn... smarter players will wait till you twist back exposing your RT to fire... so what i do in that case is deny them the torso and disengage... at which point they have two options, dont fire and i take no damage... or fire at my left side giving me clearance to use my AC20 again... either way i win... secondly... you definitely want to team up with something that will draw the fire.. the atlas is the perfect mech... the first thing i do when i get in a match with my hunchback is hit tab and look to see if there is an atlas on my team... when there is i get on his *** and i stay there.. i shoot at what he shoots at(if in range) and i get his back... i never leave him.. EVER! this benefits the atlas greatly, also drawing fire away from me allowing my hunchback to last alot longer in the match... if you happen to land with a decent atlas pilot its not uncommon to go the whole match unscathed while racking up a few kills and some nice damage...

[Josef Nader]

The hunchback is a fantastic medium. Stop running straight at larger mechs. Play carefully, approach from the flanks, and don't over-commit or you'll get melted in seconds no matter what direction is facing them. As long as you don't charge assaults and heavies, you'll do fine.

[East Indy]

Seconding the greatness of the Hunchback.

Move faster and play smarter. You're not in a Highlander anymore, Toto.

[Maxx Blue]

The 4SP doesn't have this problem, and the 4P's hunch is small enough that you can usually protect it pretty well. Heck, even the 4J isn't so bad after they toned down the whole 'tower of power' missile rack. Really it is the 4H and mostly the 4G that are problematic. The 4H at least has angles where you have a chance at protecting the RT, even if it is difficult. With the 4G there is, quite literally, NO direction you can turn that doesn't allow your enemy a shot at your RT.

The hunch on a 4G is high enough and far enough forward that it can be targetted and hit while you are perpedicular to your enemy, and as has been pointed out you can even hit the front, right torso from directly behind a 4G. They made the front torso hitbox cover most of the rear as well with the idea that you could strip almost all the armor off the rear and put it all on the front (I think I run either 2 or 3 points of armor on the rear RT of my 4G.) Unfortunately this also had the side-effect of making the hunch targettable from any angle, and therefore impossible to shield.

In general, the hunch isn't a bad gimmick. You protect your right side, or loose your weapons. You have that same problem on plenty of other mechs (Yen-Lo Wang for instance. and a bunch of the saber mechs) It's just that all those other mechs are able to use their off-side torso as a shield much more effectively. Right now the 4G and to some extent the 4H are just too easy to blow the hunch off of. I think they should consider sinking the gun box down into the torso more, and probably make it shorter as well. The 4SP, 4P and 4J I don't have a problem with (other than the slightly goofy new weapon art on the 4P!), but the 4H and especially the 4G could use some love.

Edited by Maxx Blue, 23 January 2014 - 07:42 AM.

[FactorlanP]

In my opinion, the secret to being successful in a Hunchie is nothing more than NOT being the scariest target on the battlefield.

When I drive my Hunchie, I always try to pair up with something much bigger, like a Highlander, Victor, or even an Atlas. I let the other guy attract the attention, then I put a few AC20 rounds downrange.

If I start to draw too much attention, I break line of sight and make a new approach.

[Josef Nader]

FactorlanP, on 23 January 2014 - 08:34 AM, said:

In my opinion, the secret to being successful in a Hunchie is nothing more than NOT being the scariest target on the battlefield.

When I drive my Hunchie, I always try to pair up with something much bigger, like a Highlander, Victor, or even an Atlas. I let the other guy attract the attention, then I put a few AC20 rounds downrange.

If I start to draw too much attention, I break line of sight and make a new approach.

This guy gets it. Nobody pays attention to the Hunchback when assaults and heavies are still around, much to their dismay when the hunchback kills them dead.

[Dan Nashe]

It really has nothing to do with hit boxes. I mean yeah they could make the hunch split damage with 5 locations, but that would be silly. Maybe make the right side of it the arm?

The problem is the giant hunch.
Although it is true that if you couldn't hit what you were aiming at because of convergence or cone of fire, peoe would have to aim center mass and let damage work itself out, but blaming mechanics for the hunchbacks problems is silly. The problem is that the ac20 art work from tt is ridiculous and the hback pays for it. Although they could stand to make it smaller...

[Selfish]

They could always add the damage mitigation effect of missile bay doors. Reduce incoming damage to the hunch by 10%. It's similar to the Kintaro's CT bay doors, except it would be the first time it's ever used for something non-missile.

[Michael Abt]

Josef Nader, on 23 January 2014 - 08:45 AM, said:

This guy gets it. Nobody pays attention to the Hunchback when assaults and heavies are still around, much to their dismay when the hunchback kills them dead.

And in my experience it is the exact opposite. Most of the time people switch target to me as soon as i show up in my Hunchie. They know they can kill my Hunchie a lot faster compared to having to chew through heavy/assault armor.

And yes, the size of the Hunch is a problem on some models. You may be able to protect it somewhat by torso twisting but the side torso is still easier to hit and therefore a lot more difficult to protect compared to other mechs. Furthermore, with so much high pinpoint damage flying around atm one small mistake and the Hunch is blown off.

[Jman5]

You have to frontload the armor on the Right Torso to an extreme. I'm talking 46/2 or 47/1. The hitbox extends the whole front and side and that is where you're almost always going to get hit.

That said, I do notice I'll occasionally get hit on one side torso and take damage on the other. I don't know if the hitboxes are a little buggy or if it's HSR like Selfish said.

With regards to focus fire, my experience is different from some of you. I get focused fired all day every day any time I'm engaged. It has become a running joke that as soon as I enter a firefight everyone on the opposite team stops shooting and focus fires me. In my opinion, people see hunchbacks as an easy kill or at least an easy target to disarm. Hell, I do it against fellow hunchbacks myself. On the opposite spectrum, lights are often the last mechs alive because they're hard to kill so people don't really try in lieu of other targets. I find as a hunchback pilot, you really have to stay invisible to the enemy and when you are seen, you'll probably want to briefly find cover before re-engaging.

Anyway, I do not think the hunchback is an easy mech to play. In fact it's often frustrating as hell. However, you can succeed with it if you play carefully and coddle your hunch like it's your first-born.

Edited by Jman5, 23 January 2014 - 10:33 AM.

[Jacmac]

Don't run an XL in a hunchback and don't pack all of the fire power in the hunch either. The hunchback has been out-classed for quite a while now, all of mine sit stripped down the the mech bay.

[Michael Abt]

Jman5, on 23 January 2014 - 10:31 AM, said:

(...)
With regards to focus fire, my experience is different from some of you. I get focused fired all day every day any time I'm engaged. It has become a running joke that as soon as I enter a firefight everyone on the opposite team stops shooting and focus fires me. In my opinion, people see hunchbacks as an easy kill or at least an easy target to disarm. (...)

In order to take advantage of that behavior one of my tactics is to do a drive-by attack on the enemy, knowing that there is pretty much always at least one person tunnel visioning me, and this way i drag them right into the focus fire of friendly heavies/assaults.

[Maxx Blue]

Jacmac, on 23 January 2014 - 10:36 AM, said:

...don't pack all of the fire power in the hunch either...

Easier said than done. Aside from the 4SP, every hunchback has one energy slot in the head and one in the left arm that can still be used if the hunch is blown off. That means, at best, you could put a medium laser and a PPC in there. The 4H, 4P and 4J all have their 'extra' weapon hardpoints in the RT. So, when you loose the hunch and the right arm along with it, you will loose all but two of your hardpoints, and one of those is in the head which really limits what you can do with it. Realistically, all you can do to preserve your damage output without the hunch is to put a single large laser or PPC in your left arm. Not packing everything into the hunch isn't actually much of an option.

Edited by Maxx Blue, 23 January 2014 - 12:35 PM.

[KharnZor]

The Hunchback makes a great bodyguard.