Jump to content

Ngng #105: Summary Of Russ Bullock Interview Part 2 Aired 3/20/14

News

203 replies to this topic

#1 Peiper

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Dragoon
  • The Dragoon
  • 1,444 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • LocationA fog where no one notices the contrast of white on white

Posted 20 March 2014 - 07:05 PM

NGNG #105: Summary of Russ Bullock Interview Part 2 aired 3/20/14

This is part two of two, originally recorded 3 March 2014, edited and released 3/20.
Original Podcast can be listened to here:
http://www.nogutsnog...p?topic=1847.0�


Tichorius, thank you for the brief summary to kick things off. This one was a rough one to get through. "But don't look back in anger, I heard her say..." -Oasis

Disclaimer: I do not work for PGI or NGNG, and while I attempt to stay informed like the majority of you reading this, I may make mistakes in my interpretation (which is in parenthesis.) [Any words in brackets are my editorial notes, and not the words of PGI or NGNG and are signed. - Peiper] This is not a word for word transcript; it is a summary, paraphrased and the like for maximum information sharing with minimal reading. I transcribe this for the hearing impaired, or those who are reading this at work or whatever and can't put on a headset/broadcast the podcast. -Peiper

Glossary:
Frankenmechs: A Frankenmech is what we have now. Inner Sphere mechs, tricked and kitted out the way we want them, often not resembling the original mech at all other than looks. Traditionally, a frankenmech is a mech built from corpses of several other mechs. In this case, it's putting in a different motor, changing the armor, the heat sinks, weapons, etc. until a mech no longer resembles, statistically and ability-wise, the mech that you purchased initially.
Omnimech: Clan mechs. All the mechs in the clan pack are clan mechs, and called omnimechs because in Classic Battletech, an omnimech could change out weapon/gear packages quickly and easily before dropping onto a planet depending on what battlefield conditions were expected. This was confused in MW4 with 'omni slots' or 'omni-hardpoints' in the mechlab. However, what we're getting with the clan packs are something in the middle and not really omnimechs at all, more like omni-franken hybrids. But I digress.

Duncan Fisher tries to explain that his mech is made of Awesome, and suggests that if you listen to NGNG, your mech might also be so cool. I disagree, not out of disrespect for NGNG, but because Duncan Fisher's mechs are awesome simply as a reflection of the power of his persona. Like Chuck Norris and John Wayne of Terra's Antiquity, there's no one quite like Ducan Fisher in all of the Inner Sphere. And remember: Duncan Fisher doesn't always drink beer, but when he does, he prefers the taste of Dos Mechies.

4:30 With private lobbies and the ability to finally run scheduled tournaments, streamed and backed up by social media, different competitive and other community groups will be looking for recognition from PGI for their efforts. Will there be any way PGI will endorse or cooperate in the sharing/supporting of these events? Russ thinks MWO is a very fun game to spectate, more than many other games. He'd like to see more spectator tools available for these purposes, but no current plans how how/when to develop/release them. Maybe prize money for some tournaments. The playerbase could grow based on the competitive scene – maybe not as big as DOTA, but definitely a lot of potential.
(Russ didn't answer whether PGI would support anything directly or through social media. He mentioned possible money prizes for tournaments, but was pretty vague with those words.) [I would think that any physical and/or cash prizes given out by PGI would be events controlled by PGI. They could give out cosmetic stuff and MC though, I'm sure, if they wanted to, right now for private tournaments/community events. If they have, I am unaware of it – and unless they have, I wouldn't get your hopes up! - Peiper]

10:00 Phil thanks Russ/Bryan/PGI for better communication, specifically through twitter. Examples: https://twitter.com/russ_bullock https://twitter.com/bryanekman [I used to go to Syllogy's upcoming content tracker for this stuff. -Peiper]

10:40 Jump Jet changes were across the board. Easier to see the effects on heavier mechs. Highlander/Victor torso rate changes were due to these assault mechs turning like lighter mechs, and moving WAY too fast for PGI's comfort. He thinks they were worried about the jump-twist combinations that allowed for Victors/Highlanders and jumping heavies to turn on a dime. Engine sizes still affect twist/movement speeds, but don't think of these things as nerfs: think of them as normalization. Making the mechs move the way they SHOULD move.

12:30 Tournament ideas: He talks about the faction based tournament starting in a few hours as a litmus test for faction based game play. [Faction = teams, right? -Peiper] (Your ability and performance as a lone wolf superstar in MWO will reflect on your faction. The top scorers will show which faction is best.) [I recommend playing one of the less popular factions for this event. You get prizes for being best in your chosen faction. It's not like winning for your faction is going to help your faction or team in any way...-P]
The other tournament will be a lance tournament. It might be 1-1-1-1, kind of a precursor to the launch module. [footnote 1]

14:50 Free for all version of the game via launch module possible? No, because everything has been based around team play [cough] that would require a bunch of new coding.

CLAN INVASION

15:40 Clan reinforcement pack/other clan mechs on horizon? For now, no, not discussing it. Special situation for the Phoenix package. When the Phoenix packs were selling so well, they decided to throw in the last two just to allow people to complete the collection. He wouldn't rule out a reinforcement package. Phoenix was a 'moment in time' where clans will have ongoing releases post-clan mech release.

18:00 Planning anything special with kicking off the clans? “Yeah, no, that's a good question, I think, uhm. Absolutely there's plans, but ah, I guess it has to be around, you know, like an event. It's so much work and effort to get these things released, of course, but the team's gonna be so busy, you know, just getting this patch out on time to make sure everyone has their clan mechs.” He then goes on to talk about a 12 v 12 tournament (see part 1) that he's hoping to maybe run in May before the clan pack release. It's always iffy to do an event the day of release because so much is going on at once. [footnote 2] If the 12 v 12 tournament in May works out well, maybe they can do an Inner Sphere vs. Clan tournament shortly after clan mechs are secretly delivered into our inner sphere hands pre-invasion.

Phil points out that it's unrealistic to have a bidding system, stars vs. lances, etc.. into this game.

20:15 Russ points out that clan mechs shouldn't impact pug play in any major ways. Omnimechs will ideally be no better than our frankenmechs. You can't segregate clan and inner sphere mechs in public matches. Just like what we have now: faction specific mechs being played by members of all factions, one big free for all mix up. It'll be the same with Omnimechs as with every other mech.
In private matches, anything goes.

22:30In FACTION play, Piranha will create the rules. That's where you're faction will mean something. Clanners will have to be clanners, and use clan mechs and IS will use IS mechs and “get involved in those battles and situations of rules and roleplay.” [And us mercs? Black Market? Omnimech factories on Outreach? Come on, spill it, Russ! -Peiper]

23:20 Look at future matchmaking in 3 balloons. One is pug play (what we have now). One is private matches. One is faction warfare.

24:25 Russ confirms mixed Omni and Frankenmechs mixed on the same team in pug drops.

27:00 If clan mechs prove to be better than inner sphere mechs after all, there is an ability with their matchmaker to treat clan mechs as 5 tons heavier, as an example, so matchmaker will try to pad the IS tonnage to fit with the number of clan mechs opposing.

28:40 Clan mechs will be released two per month. (Unlike Phoenix mechs)

29:10 Russ says that Clan tech doesn't translate well from novels to the game, just ask Robert Jordan. (Does he mean Thurston or Weissman?) He says they don't translate into a mechwarrior simulator. [Oh, is someone developing a Battletech simulator? Oh, wait, this is mechwarrior. Damn... -Peiper]

30:00 I am very confused. Sean and Russ are talking about Battletech and Mechwarrior Online.
Sean suggests that PGI is using some of the 'checks and balances' built into Battletech for their implimentation of Omnimechs to balance things out (engine sizes, armor types, fixed heat sinks, etc). Russ thinks this will bring them much closer to balanced out in this game. Comparing previous Mechwarrior PC games and Classic Battletech. You'll have to listen to this conversation yourself. [Footnote 4] Sorry I couldn't translate this section any better.

32:45 Russ brings up a question for them to ask Paul: will there be a toggle in the premium windows to allow or disallow clan tech?

34:00 Sean says more immersion, like ejection seat animation. Russ says he wants to see steam in the cockpit and shattered windshields.

35:00 Thank you's.

36:10 Russ walked by an engineer's workstation and saw a mech crushing trees. This is a first step, not mech collision yet, but a step toward.

37:00 Russ is asking himself what people really want more after launch module:
A. Community Warfare
or
B. Collisions, other parts of the game polished up first, knock downs, SRM fixes, UI 2.0/mechlab improvements.

39:50 show end and thank yous.

Footnote #1 Cool! I guess they're going to clone this lance tournament and previous ones we've run just like it. Thanks for the credit, PGI! Now, maybe you'll look at our model and make a TEAM event where we can play for our FACTIONS? I'm not tooting my own horn here, so much as pointing out that PGI is WAY behind the community in these ideas, and it would be nice if they acknowledged our hard work, because we've been working hard to keep the community together DESPITE all of their actions discouraging team play over the last couple years. Thinking of Corporate Warfare, Steiner vs. Wolf events, FRR's lance tournaments, etc... I'm happy PGI is catching up, but we'll have community warfare long before PGI ever gets around to coloring the little planets different on the star chart. It's aggravating to think that the community will be in competition with PGI for the same content, when they could have been working with us all along. -Peiper

Footnote #2 You know, like having a 'Clan Invasion' without the option of invading or defending anything or going 'live' with a game that's not finished. One step at a time. Eventually we'll fill in the blanks like the ability to drop in teams, private lobbies, faction play, planetary capture, all those 'pillars' thingies that they talked about that make up an online Mechwarrior game.

Footnote #3 It's PUG, not PUB Russ. Pick-Up-Group. A PUB is where you go to drink, or if pronounced differently, something else entirely!

Footnote #4 Here's what I hear: 'We are going to follow battletech values for our weapons as closely as possible, except for ghost heat.' We don't like that people are boating, and while we're going to keep allowing them to frankenmech entire companies of mechs (something you NEVER saw in classic battletech) we think that this is being abused and so we're going to penalize them for our letting them build boats. When you pick and choose whether to follow canon or not simply because it either backs up, or contradicts your plans, then don't get righteous about it. Like stock car races. Did you buy this car straight from the factory? No, then it's not stock. Don't tell me because it has a Chevy hood ornament that makes it a stock car... It might LOOK like a K2, but if it has gauss rifles it's NOT a K2. Ya dig? So now, Sean and Russ are talking about previous games trying to justify actions taken in this game, and it's all nonsense.

#2 DEN_Ninja

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Blade
  • The Blade
  • 1,097 posts
  • LocationCrossing, Draconis March

Posted 20 March 2014 - 07:23 PM

View PostPeiper, on 20 March 2014 - 07:05 PM, said:

http://www.nogutsnog...hp?topic=1847.0

I will be working to build up a summary tonight. This is acting as a placeholder/announcement for now to prevent multiple threads on the same topic and thus the ire of the mods. I'll take a couple hours to put the summary together, though.


Was about to do this.

Topics from Start To Finish

Competitive Play
Spectating
Assault Mobility Balancing
Private Matches; Free For All (Russ Made comment about how it wasn't a thought because MWO is a team game)
Lance Tournament/Company Tournament
Tidbits about Clans
Tidbits about Community Warfare
Clan Vs Inner Sphere Matchmaking; Realistic Approaches
Clan Vs Inner Sphere Balancing; Realistic Approachees
Tidbit Dropped; Tree's being knocked over; HSR Improvements;

Edited by Tichorius Davion, 20 March 2014 - 07:34 PM.


#3 Roadbeer

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Elite Founder
  • 8,160 posts
  • LocationWazan, Zion Cluster

Posted 20 March 2014 - 07:41 PM

Listened to to the first 10 minutes and how happy everyone is that this is now becoming an Esport :)

#4 p4r4g0n

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Knight Errant
  • 1,511 posts
  • LocationMalaysia

Posted 20 March 2014 - 08:09 PM

Two things struck me while listening.

<starts at 21:30> Public matches, Private matches and .... Faction matches? Has this been brought up before? This could explain all the missing critical issues / concerns I've noted insofar as CW is concerned . Russ' comments seem to imply that Faction matches will differ from the other two types which could mean no 3/3/3/3, group restrictions, etc although he doesn't outright mention any of these things. Doesn't seem to have attracted much comment or attention though.

<starts at 36:40> Russ actually asks for feedback on whether to get CW out on time or defer it for 2-3 months for polishing / tweaks / etc of the existing game elements already released. Community (or at least the forum community) needs to get behind this and gather a collective cohesive response.

<Edited for clarification>

Edited by p4r4g0n, 20 March 2014 - 08:45 PM.


#5 Wintersdark

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,375 posts
  • Google+: Link
  • Twitter: Link
  • LocationCalgary, AB

Posted 20 March 2014 - 08:47 PM

Yeah, faction matches where discussed under faction play at the launch party. It's the phase after merc corps - public but faction based play, allowing random public players to participate in community warfare.

I'd love to see a discussion about that bomb of a question, and a poll.

I honestly don't know what I think right now, very torn on it.

#6 Roland

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,260 posts

Posted 20 March 2014 - 09:22 PM

View Postp4r4g0n, on 20 March 2014 - 08:09 PM, said:

<starts at 36:40> Russ actually asks for feedback on whether to get CW out on time or defer it for 2-3 months for polishing / tweaks / etc of the existing game elements already released. Community (or at least the forum community) needs to get behind this and gather a collective cohesive response.

<Edited for clarification>

Lol... am I reading this right?
He's asking if they can defer CW for another two months, in order to fix other broken stuff in the game?

Does anyone really believe that CW is ever coming? I mean, honestly, I really don't at this point. It was promised to us as being right around the corner... BACK IN 2012. Seriously two thousand TWELVE.

It's just vaporware. They're just seeing how much money they can milk from folks before folding.

We can't even play in groups of 5-11 people, and we're supposed to expect that some kind of grand CW is going to come around? Despite them not having ANYTHING to show for what apparently is now YEARS of work?

#7 Deathlike

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Littlest Helper
  • Littlest Helper
  • 29,240 posts
  • Location#NOToTaterBalance #BadBalanceOverlordIsBad

Posted 20 March 2014 - 09:56 PM

Why does faction play sound like what we already have in the MM + "faction queue restriction"?

My answer to Russ's answers on most things: A sigh of disappointment.

This game is not deserving of any e-sport attention... especially with so many terrible weapons/balance issues involved.

#8 StandingCow

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 3,069 posts
  • LocationUSA

Posted 21 March 2014 - 12:46 AM

That you very much for doing the summary.. I cannot bring myself to listen to these guys anymore. :)

#9 BLOOD WOLF

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Jaws
  • The Jaws
  • 6,368 posts
  • Locationnowhere

Posted 21 March 2014 - 01:03 AM

its a summary, of his interpretation of what he heard, i listened to the podcast and didn't come to the same conclusion. I cant believe some people would take a summary and not even listen themselves

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 21 March 2014 - 01:31 AM.


#10 Rounin

    Member

  • PipPip
  • 25 posts

Posted 21 March 2014 - 01:32 AM

View PostBLOOD WOLF, on 21 March 2014 - 01:03 AM, said:

i listened to the podcast and didn't come to the same conclusion.


I'd be surprised if you did.
:^)

#11 BLOOD WOLF

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Jaws
  • The Jaws
  • 6,368 posts
  • Locationnowhere

Posted 21 March 2014 - 01:35 AM

View PostRoland, on 20 March 2014 - 09:22 PM, said:

Lol... am I reading this right?
He's asking if they can defer CW for another two months, in order to fix other broken stuff in the game?

Does anyone really believe that CW is ever coming? I mean, honestly, I really don't at this point. It was promised to us as being right around the corner... BACK IN 2012. Seriously two thousand TWELVE.

It's just vaporware. They're just seeing how much money they can milk from folks before folding.

We can't even play in groups of 5-11 people, and we're supposed to expect that some kind of grand CW is going to come around? Despite them not having ANYTHING to show for what apparently is now YEARS of work?

your reading it right but you didn't hear it with your own ears, that's what private matches are for. PRIVATE MATCHES the players sets all the limitations, in relation to the 5-11, if somebody wants they can make it 1v1,i should say premium private matches. had nothing to do with how CW is going to work i dont see how you came to that.

As for deferring CW another 2 months, why would you scoff at that>? they release it and its buggy we complain but if they ask to work out the bugs we sneer at them. I would prefer they release it then they iron it out with feedback.(you go ahead with your 2012 promise, and when it comes out feel free not to participate as we can see how much it discomforts you)

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 21 March 2014 - 01:49 AM.


#12 Tekadept

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Knight Errant
  • 1,290 posts
  • LocationPerth, Australia

Posted 21 March 2014 - 01:48 AM

View PostBLOOD WOLF, on 21 March 2014 - 01:03 AM, said:

I cant believe some people would take a summary and not even listen themselves

Because I can't stand listening to NGNG, id rather listen to an AM radio station for my music needs.

#13 BLOOD WOLF

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Jaws
  • The Jaws
  • 6,368 posts
  • Locationnowhere

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:02 AM

View PostTekadept, on 21 March 2014 - 01:48 AM, said:

Because I can't stand listening to NGNG, id rather listen to an AM radio station for my music needs.

i guess the music isn't always to ones liking, i don't mind tho, but i don't see how these things get misinterpreted. Pipers summary is well sounded although i cant agree with all of it but that's what it is a summary. The worst part is people draw conclusions from Pipers summary of which he listened to and jotted notes. First you read piers summary, then you listen to the podcast, summarize yourself and in your own words+Quotes then you can come to a conclusion.

Take i hear you but if something permits you not to listen to the podcast than it isn't fair to draw conclusions from 2nd hand source when you have a 1st person account available.

Correct me if i'm wrong but pieper didn't quote directly at times but rather gave a summary based off of what he heard and i'm not going to say he's not trustworthy but id rather hear it or read from the original source. Once again Piper was sound in his reasoning.

#14 Thorqemada

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,766 posts

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:17 AM

I am for a "polished" game - CW is years overdue, some more months do not matter...

Edited by Thorqemada, 21 March 2014 - 02:17 AM.


#15 StandingCow

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 3,069 posts
  • LocationUSA

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:22 AM

View PostBLOOD WOLF, on 21 March 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:

your reading it right but you didn't hear it with your own ears, that's what private matches are for. PRIVATE MATCHES the players sets all the limitations, in relation to the 5-11, if somebody wants they can make it 1v1,i should say premium private matches. had nothing to do with how CW is going to work i dont see how you came to that.

As for deferring CW another 2 months, why would you scoff at that>? they release it and its buggy we complain but if they ask to work out the bugs we sneer at them. I would prefer they release it then they iron it out with feedback.(you go ahead with your 2012 promise, and when it comes out feel free not to participate as we can see how much it discomforts you)


Probably because it was promised multiple times now as "just around the corner". Same thing with UI 2.0. There is no excuse for the condition that was released (into a now non-beta game). I say all of this because of how many times they were delayed... you would expect something heavily delayed to not finally come around and look as if it was quickly thrown together.

There is a reason I can't bring myself to listen directly to it and look for a summary. Don't like the summary and that we are basing our assumptions on it? Write another one!

Do this, compare MWO to Hawken, I am not talking gameplay here, I am talking UI and how the game is made, and how the devs communicate with the community. I do not like the Hawken gameplay personally, but it still seems to be a professionally made game.

Edited by StandingCow, 21 March 2014 - 02:25 AM.


#16 AlexEss

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Bolt
  • The Bolt
  • 2,491 posts
  • Locationthe ol north

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:27 AM

View PostTekadept, on 21 March 2014 - 01:48 AM, said:

Because I can't stand listening to NGNG, id rather listen to an AM radio station for my music needs.


you do know that NGNG is a podcast right... not a radio-station?

Any way as always i say thank you to Pieper for the work done but as always i feel it would be better without the "editorial notes" These could be posted afterwards because in all honesty they do not interest me all that much.

As for the clan invasion... I am not sure what people had envisioned (actually that is a lie... i can very well imagine what some people belived it would be... and they will be disappointed no matter what.) but what i heard go very much along the lines of what we have heard about CW. (and i said it early that we would not be able to play through the invasion.. Just take a look at Titanfalls MP-Campagin to see how lackluster it is to play a mission when the story is set no matter if you win or loose) It makes perfect sense that a game without a SP/AI component have a very limited in-game narrative and thus any storytelling that is done through the game will e very bare bones. It is and will be up to us to shape that story through the private lobby system.

To be honest CW is more for the masses, with rpivate lobbies "we" as in the active forum community have everything we need to make a war for the inner sphere on as epic a scale as we like... All it takes is some old fashion hard work, and if any of the previous tournaments and campaigns is anything to go by that is not a issue.

It would be good if we could have a new community manager or at least a coordinator.

#17 StandingCow

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 3,069 posts
  • LocationUSA

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:33 AM

View PostAlexEss, on 21 March 2014 - 02:27 AM, said:


you do know that NGNG is a podcast right... not a radio-station?



I don't think he is talking quality... let me explain..

I stopped listening to NGNG because it went from a fun mechwarrior based podcast to just an MWO advertisement.

I used to buy their (NGNG's) merchandise, donate to them, listen religiously... even got to watch some of their twitch streams... but as I started to grow unhappy with some of the decisions PGI made I started noticing some things about the podcast... they would defend everything and wouldn't speak out against PGI, they wouldn't ask tough questions of the devs, it started to feel as I mentioned above... like one big advertisement. I understand that maybe if they asked tough questions, then perhaps they wouldn't get the devs on anymore... who knows.

That is all my opinion though... that's why, much like MWO.. I went from being a happy supportive listener/customer, to not being able to stand it anymore. It no longer (at least to me) felt honest.

Sorry I sorta went off subject here.

Edited by StandingCow, 21 March 2014 - 02:40 AM.


#18 MisterPlanetarian

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 910 posts
  • LocationStockholm

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:37 AM

Good summary, glad they will allow for Clan and IS mechs mixing on the same team with restrictions on puretech only when it comes to mech configuration.

#19 BLOOD WOLF

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Jaws
  • The Jaws
  • 6,368 posts
  • Locationnowhere

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:45 AM

View PostMisterPlanetarian, on 21 March 2014 - 02:37 AM, said:

Good summary, glad they will allow for Clan and IS mechs mixing on the same team with restrictions on puretech only when it comes to mech configuration.

i was little happy to learn mixing of mechs, they will also make its so the Clan mechs are 10 tons more on the matchmaker which is fair enough

#20 AlexEss

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Bolt
  • The Bolt
  • 2,491 posts
  • Locationthe ol north

Posted 21 March 2014 - 02:54 AM

@standingCow

I guess you coudl be right, the way it was worded made me think it was more about the format then the content.

As for NGNG, it is the price you pay i guess. You are either independent with a capital I like that other show was/is and then have the freedom to take digs and play rough with the object of your desire or you do like NGNG and choose after and more compliant route and get the support of the object of desire. That is how it works... Radio-station slam a artist or publisher, new music comes late (or if you are small enough.. not at all) Gaming-site/Magazine rips a publisher to shreds... No more beta/press-invites or exclusive info.

If you want to both have and eat that cake you need to be so big that they loosed more on not to be seen in your outlet then any negative publicity you will put out.

NGNG do not have enough weight to throw around to be able to ask all the "hard questions" (very often they are not questions at all but just angry demands and snide remarks... )

Edited by AlexEss, 21 March 2014 - 02:55 AM.






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users