74 replies to this topic

[MrZakalwe]

I'm referring to Artillery and Airstrikes- I've been out of play and returned recently to find the game covered in orange smoke.

Most games I play at the moment victory isn't decided by who pilots a mech better but by who lands their consumables better or as often just by who has more of them.

If your team has none or one/two and the enemy has 5 (or 10+ as my last match) your team loses- very rarely does anything else seem to effect the outcome as much as this.

Anybody else finding this or is it just me? The Doubly annoying thing to me is that because of the c-bill cost people like me who still don't have a big stable of mechs can simply not afford to spam 2 per game while also saving for new gear.

Am I being stupid and missing something?

The reason I ask for Mechwarrior back is it's become'call in an airstrike and destroy the enemy team' online in the games I've been in today.

Edited by Egomane, 10 May 2014 - 09:12 AM.

[Throbbinwood]

While I do find them annoying I usually do a good job of avoiding them and don't find them game breaking. This is coming from someone who has never used one.

[DonGardenio]

Well all those Founders who own all the mechs and have nothing to use their C-Bills for have to spend on something I guess.

[Joseph Mallan]

Throbbinwood, on 10 May 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

While I do find them annoying I usually do a good job of avoiding them and don't find them game breaking. This is coming from someone who has never used one.

I own one... Then again I own a few Cool shots as well. I o however need to dust them so they still look "New In Package"

[Voivode]

I have to disagree. This game suffers badly from the "sitzkrieg" effect and artillery / airstrikes are essentially useless against mobile targets. Artillery and airstrikes only punish those who are immobile. This game needs more mobility, not less.

[Iqfish]

Airstrikes and Artillery Strikes are a very important game mechanic.

They offer a great tactical opportunity.

This is MechWarrior, if you want, you can go back to MW4

[MrZakalwe]

To be honest I wouldn't mind them if everybody had access to them but somebody who actually needs c-bills can't afford them if they want to unlock new mechs as well.

Certainly not in the numbers some of the overlord premades drop them in.

Assaulting the crater in Terra Therma has never been so little fun as when artystrike/airstrike after artystrike/airstrike hits your team with no possible retaliation.

Voivode, on 10 May 2014 - 08:46 AM, said:

I have to disagree. This game suffers badly from the "sitzkrieg" effect and artillery / airstrikes are essentially useless against mobile targets. Artillery and airstrikes only punish those who are immobile. This game needs more mobility, not less.

I agree completely that mobility needs to be incentivised but I'd do that by slowing projectile speeds rather than having the game decided by who blew more c-bills on offmap artillery.

[Screech]

Sweet this thread again. How can you not avoid these? Are you not watching the screen? Do you not like moving your mech once you find a nice little nest to hunker down in? Are you tailgating the mech in front of you while you conga line around for 10 minutes?

Interested minds want to know.

Edited by Screech, 10 May 2014 - 09:02 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

MrZakalwe, on 10 May 2014 - 08:51 AM, said:

To be honest I wouldn't mind them if everybody had access to them but somebody who actually needs c-bills can't afford them if they want to unlock new mechs as well.

Certainly not in the numbers some of the overlord premades drop them in.

Assaulting the crater in Terra Therma has never been so little fun as when artystrike/airstrike after artystrike/airstrike hits your team with no possible retaliation.

See I don't see it in that light. To me that is part and parcel of thinking mans gaming. o I buy some arty or do I buy a new Mech? Decisions are good things to have.

[MrZakalwe]

Joseph Mallan, on 10 May 2014 - 09:09 AM, said:

See I don't see it in that light. To me that is part and parcel of thinking mans gaming. o I buy some arty or do I buy a new Mech? Decisions are good things to have.

In game decisions I agree with. Decision between pay or compete? Not so much.

Screech, on 10 May 2014 - 09:01 AM, said:

Sweet this thread again. How can you not avoid these? Are you not watching the screen? Do you not like moving your mech once you find a nice little nest to hunker down in? Are you tailgating the mech in front of you while you conga line around for 10 minutes?

Interested minds want to know.

If they were easy to avoid and not a game breaking tool there wouldn't be so many of them in every match in high level play.

People dont use them at all levels because they like the special effects, they like them because they give you a significant advantage over people without them.

It's not just scrubs that use them on other scrubs so please get over yourself.

[Creovex]

I have to admit, I find them fine... I don't personally use them, but at the same time you get smoke so you have plenty of warning to move. Overall, it's more realistic to the genre... even the battle for turk had air support.

[Taffer]

No warning when the smoke is behind you.

Just sayin'

[Faith McCarron]

Honestly, you don't see them doing much actual damage in high level play, at least comparatively. More often than not in high level play you see them being used to dictate the enemy position either via herding the enemy into a given area or using them as an area denial weapon.

Where you see them racking up huge amounts of damage is in PUG matches where you are more likely to be able to hit a giant enemy immobile blob.

[MrZakalwe]

Faith McCarron, on 10 May 2014 - 09:39 AM, said:

Honestly, you don't see them doing much actual damage in high level play, at least comparatively. More often than not in high level play you see them being used to dictate the enemy position either via herding the enemy into a given area or using them as an area denial weapon.

Where you see them racking up huge amounts of damage is in PUG matches where you are more likely to be able to hit a giant enemy immobile blob.

If one team is spamming them and the other isn't the team that is spamming them wins.

Edit: this seems to be true at every level- it doesn't matter if they do the damage directly or if they just flush people out of cover to be endlessly jumpsniped like in high level play the end results is arty/airstrike = win.

Edited by MrZakalwe, 10 May 2014 - 09:47 AM.

[Faith McCarron]

MrZakalwe, on 10 May 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

If one team is spamming them and the other isn't the team that is spamming them wins.

The problem is that's true of all consumables. If one team is packing cool shots and the other has no coolshots, the coolshotting team is going to put out more damage and win. If one team packs multiple UAVs and the other team brought no UAVs, the UAV team is going to win.

Arty needs to be adjusted, especially have its ability to headshot removed. But it doesnt make the game "not mechwarrior"

[Wolfways]

MrZakalwe, on 10 May 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

If one team is spamming them and the other isn't the team that is spamming them wins.

Edit: this seems to be true at every level- it doesn't matter if they do the damage directly or if they just flush people out of cover to be endlessly jumpsniped like in high level play the end results is arty/airstrike = win.

Don't forget, if one team has LRM's they always win too.
Oh, and the team that has ECM wins too....

[Joseph Mallan]

MrZakalwe, on 10 May 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

If one team is spamming them and the other isn't the team that is spamming them wins.

Edit: this seems to be true at every level- it doesn't matter if they do the damage directly or if they just flush people out of cover to be endlessly jumpsniped like in high level play the end results is arty/airstrike = win.

Wolfways, on 10 May 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

Don't forget, if one team has LRM's they always win too.
Oh, and the team that has ECM wins too....

And Pop Tarting PPC/AC always wins.

[MrZakalwe]

Faith McCarron, on 10 May 2014 - 09:47 AM, said:

The problem is that's true of all consumables. If one team is packing cool shots and the other has no coolshots, the coolshotting team is going to put out more damage and win. If one team packs multiple UAVs and the other team brought no UAVs, the UAV team is going to win.

Arty needs to be adjusted, especially have its ability to headshot removed. But it doesnt make the game "not mechwarrior"

Yeah that was hyperbole- that it's not mech warrior but if you are seeing 20+ consumables like this in some games it's a balance problem- people dont use stuff like this so frequently unless it's really broken.

[MrZakalwe]

Joseph Mallan, on 10 May 2014 - 09:54 AM, said:

And Pop Tarting PPC/AC always wins.

Watched a high level clan game stream lately? 24 poptarts packed with arty and airstrikes.

That not tell you there is a problem?

[maniacos]

Voivode, on 10 May 2014 - 08:46 AM, said:

I have to disagree. This game suffers badly from the "sitzkrieg" effect and artillery / airstrikes are essentially useless against mobile targets. Artillery and airstrikes only punish those who are immobile. This game needs more mobility, not less.

How are you playing conquest?
Take out (damage them up to crit or even leggig) some capturing lights using skillless airstikespam, your team will most likely just win by collected resources.

Edited by Jherek C, 10 May 2014 - 10:06 AM.