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Is It The End For Mechwarrior: Online, Or Finally A Much Needed Fresh Start?


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#1 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:03 AM

There is much discussion, with the announcement of the New Game, Niko's Community Post, the recent spate of communication by Russ, etc. Some are angry. Some are happy, a lot are justifiably confused, and or, concerned. I'm probably a little bit of all the above.

While reading some comments and replies by other long term community forum members and contributors, it got me really thinking. Especially about focus on cleaning up the toxicity on the Forums. Some find it offensive. Some "silly". Others a great thing. But the more I think it through, I can't say I find the intent to be silliness. Or wrong. All I have to do is think of the number of innocuous threads (even things like Art posts) derailed and led into unsubstantiated, circular arguments to the point the thread was effectively derailed.

Simple truth is, there was a subset of people who posted for no reason other than to undermine the Devs, and this Community. One could argue that some have justified reasons, others have this fever dream that they can get PGI stripped of the License, and some other studio will ride in and save MechWarrior (despite no one touching it with a 10 ft pole for a decade), do these "contributions", in the future in any way benefit the Community?

In the real world, there are repercussions to undermining the order of a community. Fact is, on a Online Forum, there is ZERO "right" to free speech. These can at times, be amongst the most toxic forums. Individuals do not always provide constructive criticism, but look to tear the community down, be it because the game didn't unfold the way they thought it should, or because they think they are being a BD(i)H, or because certain individuals and groups simply like to watch things burn.

That is known as being a cancer. Cancer left alone, festers, and eventually kills a community and a game as surely as anything. To prevent that from happening to our community we need to try to support the efforts of Niko and the Mods, not fight them. If we try to minimize the unfounded negativity, and focus on constructive input, of both the good and the bad (as we perceive it), the general attitudes of the Forums, the Game and Community can change very rapidly, to a positive and welcoming experience for players, new and old. MWO has a good community, for the most part. With a few angry bad apples. But by and large, even those critical of the direction, or some decisions, are mostly positive contributions to the health of the Community.

Now.

That doesn't let PGI off the hook. In my mind, it now put the burden even more squarely on them. PGI has one less excuse for issues, for not communicating with us. The millstone of certain people rampantly attacking their every word, should be reduced or removed. So now they need to step up in a big way. Communicate. Deliver. LISTEN. And when things go sideways, as will ALWAYS happen, communicate some more. The same standards we the community are held to, the Mods, volunteer or otherwise, and Devs, need to be held to, ALSO.

Our role?

CONSTRUCTIVE Criticism. When and where there are legit issues, that can realistically expect to be balanced, fixed, etc? We need to, in concise and civil manners, bring it to PGI's attention. I have actually found considerable success just tagging Russ on Twitter, and instead of being confrontational, saying "hey, discovered this issue", or "hey, had this idea". Doesn't mean everything is handled the way I want, and doesn't mean I like having to go to twitter to get it done. Perhaps now though, Russ can actually get a word in edgewise on PGI's own forums, he might use it more regularly.

There are certainly things to complain about. Some of the Clan Balance ideas were just poorly handled. Invisible walls on 2 year old mps, etc. Yet I get the feeling that half the people doing the complaining, have never bothered to submit detailed support tickets about these things, either. And other things, we just have to accept are NOT going to change, like the Heat System. Sized Hardpoints, etc. Would they make it better? Almost certainly. And nearly 3 yrs down the rabbit hole, such a core tear down is almost certainly NOT going to happen. So stop cluttering every post opining about these things, and then decrying PGI as idiots. It just makes getting the things we can realistically expect to see fixed, harder to dig out and find.

And if that is not acceptable to folk? There's the door. Get off PGI's Boat. Go, live long, prosper. FInd a game that DOES make you happy, and go enjoy the rainbows and sunshine there. (Though I have a feeling many of the usual suspects, will be just as miserable and complaining on other forums too, as some folks are only happy when they are making things miserable for everyone, themselves included). But there is no reason to be HERE, making themselves, and everyone else miserable, and stirring up trouble.

So me? Yeah, there are issues. And I plan to keep calling PGI out when I see them. But it is past high time this town had a Sheriff, and the riff-raff got the heck out of Dodge.


As for the continued life cycle and viability of this game? Can't say my name is Nostradamus. But it would be silly for them, at this point to abandon it, now that the "hard part" is mostly over (finally, and yes, well behind schedule). PGI is a Dev Studio on the other hand, not a Mechwarrior Studio. If you expected them to spend every cent, every waking moment, from now til eternity on MWO, then you really need a reality check. They need to develop games to grow and have a chance at being stable and healthy, as a business. But as CW get's implemented, the actual staff demand for MWO will go down, freeing up programmers for other games, which are known as Revenue Streams, which keep the lights on, and all the titles running.

So if you are secretly hoping this new game fails, or that PGI loses the MWO franchise, you are really sabotaging yourself. BEcause if this new venture fails, MWO will almost certainly go dark. And since no one BUT Smith and Tinker/PGI were willing to actually pay for the license in the last decade of MWO, don't expect some major "good" studio to run in, scoop it up, and save the day. PGI fails, MechWarrior is probably dead, for a very very long time, if not permanently.

I am all for discussion here, for disagreement. But to hope and expect, as Niko apparently does, that it be productive, constructive, intelligent and CIVIL, is not in unreasonable.

I hope the Devs and Mods weigh in on this also, and speak their peace, correct misassumptions of mine, etc. THAT is part of healthy dialogue.





oh..TL;DR? Too bad. I'm not looking to give sound bites and CliffsNotes. Read and contribute, or do not.





Cheers, fellow mechwarriors. Let's see how CW unfolds, and I hope to see ALL of you, dirtside.



(this started as a reply, in a different thread, so you will likely see an edited version, elsewhere in the forums)

With the news on this post, looks like a new beginning, to me.
http://mwomercs.com/...s-igp-feedback/

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 September 2014 - 02:13 PM.


#2 Illegal Username

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:05 AM

"Daddy, what happened to MWO"

"It went to a farm out in the country, son. It lives with all the other mechwarrior games now. It's a happy place with plenty ofspace and sunshine."

Edited by Illegal Username, 08 September 2014 - 08:05 AM.


#3 DONTOR

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:15 AM

I haven't seen any of the threads about any of this stuff people are talking about. Where are they?

Also, what is the new game?

Edited by DONTOR, 08 September 2014 - 08:15 AM.


#4 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:17 AM

View PostIllegal Username, on 08 September 2014 - 08:05 AM, said:

"Daddy, what happened to MWO"

"It went to a farm out in the country, son. It lives with all the other mechwarrior games now. It's a happy place with plenty ofspace and sunshine."

still love your siggy, dude.

#5 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:18 AM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 08 September 2014 - 08:03 AM, said:

There is much discussion, with the announcement of the New Game, the Moderation post by Niko, the recent spate of communication by Russ, etc. Some are angry. Some are happy, a lot are justifiably confused, and or, concerned. I'm probably a little bit of all the above.
Do you know he actually was is #1 poster for today... or he was at 6 am! I think he had more posts here than on Twitter today!

#6 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:19 AM

View PostDONTOR, on 08 September 2014 - 08:15 AM, said:

I haven't seen any of the threads about any of this stuff people are talking about. Where are they?

Also, what is the new game?

Most are in off topic discussions. Won't be surprised if this ends up there, though it does also qualify as GenDis. Some are actually in the Announcement section.

As for the new game, I guess we all find out more tomorrow.

View PostJoseph Mallan, on 08 September 2014 - 08:18 AM, said:

Do you know he actually was is #1 poster for today... or he was at 6 am! I think he had more posts here than on Twitter today!

And probably more than in the last year, on the forums, lol.

#7 TamCoan

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:21 AM

I don't so much mind the forum bans. Honestly there were a certain group of high posters that you literally couldn't have a conversation with because it would always devolve into "I'm right because". I tended to stay away from the majority of the threads when I saw certain names attached or taking over the post because it always turned into the same thing.

As it stands now, I'm hopeful that they are moving in the right direction. The recent challenges show that they are at least trying different things in an effort to bolster the player base. At the core I really do think they care about the franchise, I just hope they can fulfill their promises and do not all jump ship for their new project.

#8 AlmightyAeng

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:22 AM

Bishop, links? I have no idea what 'new game' conversation/posts you're referencing.

#9 Theron Branson

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:23 AM

I am all for PGI to grow with new games but the community is upset because they create a new game when the current game is so far behind even just the main pillars of the game, and feel that PGI should've used those new assets to help complete a game far from what was sold to us. After getting "Caught up" then focus on a new title and fix issues with thecurrent game. Get the main pillars in there and then add content and fix bugs and so on.

#10 D04S02B04

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:25 AM

To the OP, why bother with constructive criticism when they aren't taken in and people are reminded that they are on an island?

So much discussion has been in the forums for years over weapons balancing, maps, group queues, matchmaking etc. The cancer that has been festering, is a result of the resent that they have caused themselves and permitted to fester with the lack of communication.

I'm more than happy to continually add to negative rating and reviews on metacritic and any outlet available on any game PGI or IGP develops/publish because a leopard never change its spots as they have clearly demonstrated for years.

#11 Egomane

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 08:26 AM

A lot of the OP belongs here.
Please do not discuss moderation elsewhere. It is still a CoC violation.

Also please let the new game be a new game and ignore that topic until we get the promised informations and answers from the QnA thread.

I'm closing this thread for now.

Edit: Thread will be re-opened later, with an edit from Bishops OP.

Re-opened! Bishop will make some adjustements to the opening post.

Edited by Egomane, 08 September 2014 - 12:03 PM.


#12 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:36 PM

and, we are open again for business. Thx for the input, Egomane!

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 September 2014 - 12:36 PM.


#13 shad0w4life

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:48 PM

I literally just bought ArcheAge to escape a lot of the negativity from people on here and allow me to play with a bunch of people I've played previous games with....who act like adults, and I'm excited about that last part.

Then this can work on CW and it's a big refresh and exciting for me.

If they have a new investor for the new game and hire a new team, not sure what the big deal is, I wonder how many people here would appreciate being told they weren't allowed to grow their own business because I didn't like how they did something earlier in the week/ignored my opinion.

#14 TKSax

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:48 PM

Bishop I hear what you are saying but most forums generally take on their own personality, and the personality is usually dictated by the actions or inaction's of the people in charge. I agree the onus is on them if they decide to go the route discussed here. The problem has been that customers feel like they have to create a firestorm to get any action or comment from PGI.

#15 SgtMagor

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:52 PM

guess there must be a reason PGI wanted to wait till Tuesday for the Big Show! :)

#16 Torgun

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:53 PM

The only fresh restart I could see with this change is if "that guy" is moved to the new game and never ever touch MWO ever again.

You know who I mean, just don't spell it out for the mods to frown upon

Edited by Torgun, 08 September 2014 - 01:02 PM.


#17 Mcgral18

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:58 PM

View PostTorgun, on 08 September 2014 - 12:53 PM, said:

The only fresh restart I could see with this change is if the Nerfinator is moved to the new game and never ever touch MWO ever again.


I was moderated when I asked that...

I think that's a touchy subject.

#18 990Dreams

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 12:59 PM

Being honest, I think the moderators let some people get off too easy. I don't always know how the justice is distributed, but people won't stop until you give them heavy obligation to. Until then this community will be full of haters, trolls, and spiteful people.

I'm not criticizing the mods for the record. This is just an observation about the dynamics of the community.

Edited by DavidHurricane, 08 September 2014 - 01:00 PM.


#19 Mcgral18

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 01:02 PM

View PostDavidHurricane, on 08 September 2014 - 12:59 PM, said:

Until then this community will be full of haters, trolls, and spiteful people.

I'm not criticizing the mods for the record. This is just an observation about the dynamics of the community.


Don't you want to know why that came to be?

#20 Torgun

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 01:03 PM

View PostMcgral18, on 08 September 2014 - 12:58 PM, said:


I was moderated when I asked that...

I think that's a touchy subject.


Then there might be hope





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