236 replies to this topic

[Evan20k]

I'm late to the party on this one. I just purchased my very first timberwolf this morning and I really want to know how people justify to themselves that this thing is at all remotely fair? I feel like I have the agility of a medium and the firepower of a 90ton assault in this thing. Maybe I'm just **** with every other mech I've played in comparison, but this thing feels like it has absolutely no drawbacks in a game where each mech has its own strengths and weaknesses. Do you guys think it will be getting some sort of balance adjustments in the coming months?

[FupDup]

It's been known as one of the top mechs if not the top mech for a while now. Whether or not it'll get nerfed is anybody's guess. And if it does, it's also anybody's guess if they'd nerf it in the right way or just repeat the Victor/Highlander nerfs from a long time ago...

[LordNothing]

timbers are overrated. especially with the 4 alpha racking tactic. most of my builds have an alpha which can take out a timber's side torso in 2 or fewer shots. shoot out both sides and it dies. if the timby mounts missiles of any kind, then those racks stand out and give you a nice target to hit. you might be able to take out the ct in the same way, but if you rack, half of the battle the timberwolf has half the guns.

[Deathlike]

FupDup, on 10 March 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

It's been known as one of the top mechs if not the top mech for a while now. Whether or not it'll get nerfed is anybody's guess. And if it does, it's also anybody's guess if they'd nerf it in the right way or just repeat the Victor/Highlander nerfs from a long time ago...

It's just a matter of time.

Sometime near 2016, we will not talk about the Timberwolf in the same way.... because we know the man who shall not be named will be involved.

Edited by Deathlike, 10 March 2015 - 11:48 AM.

[Kain Demos]

LordNothing, on 10 March 2015 - 11:41 AM, said:

timbers are overrated. especially with the 4 alpha racking tactic. most of my builds have an alpha which can take out a timber's side torso in 2 or fewer shots. shoot out both sides and it dies. if the timby mounts missiles of any kind, then those racks stand out and give you a nice target to hit. you might be able to take out the ct in the same way, but if you rack, half of the battle the timberwolf has half the guns.

Mounting LRMs makes the Timberwolf incredibly easy to ST. Another reason not to waste one on boating LRMs.

[Malcolm Vordermark]

The Timber Wolf is a fantastic mech. Outside of attempting to break it, there is not much you can do to it. There is always going to be a mech like this, too. Before it was the Victor enjoying a similar level of dominance.

The problem, in my opinion, is that IS lacks a really solid heavy. The 7 MPL Thunderbolt can challenge it at close range but otherwise there is not much competition. I think they need to reevaluate the CTF-3D. It recieved quirks based on its position as king of poptarts in the heavy weight class, but since that tactic has fallen from favor it could do with some love. Of all the IS heavies, I think it has the best chance of being elevated to a position to challenge the clan heavies. Redoing the quirks on the Grasshopper would also be a good way to go. I don't think it got anything that will make it an interesting choice.

IS mediums have a similar issue, I think. Sparky would be my first choice, but elevating a hero mech would not be popular. SHD-2K or HBK-4P would be good bets. I don't believe the 2K got much. I'm not sure what the 4P got, but I haven't seen an over abundance of them.

Edited by Rouken, 10 March 2015 - 11:57 AM.

[Gyrok]

Evan20k, on 10 March 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

I'm late to the party on this one. I just purchased my very first timberwolf this morning and I really want to know how people justify to themselves that this thing is at all remotely fair? I feel like I have the agility of a medium and the firepower of a 90ton assault in this thing. Maybe I'm just **** with every other mech I've played in comparison, but this thing feels like it has absolutely no drawbacks in a game where each mech has its own strengths and weaknesses. Do you guys think it will be getting some sort of balance adjustments in the coming months?

Play it more, and after the shine wears off you begin to see the faults. The ST are huge for starters, almost every build where you have big firepower has to be run as an alpha mech, because you cannot effectively play clan energy as DPS.

Play clans long enough and you reach the point where IS feels like easy mode compared to driving clans. You can take significantly less damage trading with IS weapons and the burn time on IS energy feels like PP FLD. Not t o mention superior ACs.

Honestly, I love the TW for many reasons, but, if I want to feel OP I take a quirked to hell IS mech with a STD engine in pub queue.

[Metus regem]

Deathlike, on 10 March 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

It's just a matter of time.

Sometime near 2016, we will not talk about the Timberwolf in the same way.... because we know the man who shall not be named will be involved.

Sadly this is very true, or something will take the Timber Wolf's place as the source of much QQ... I for one am looking forward to this:



http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Night_Gyr

Basically she is a Timber with out the oversize engine...

Gyrok, on 10 March 2015 - 11:52 AM, said:

Play it more, and after the shine wears off you begin to see the faults. The ST are huge for starters, almost every build where you have big firepower has to be run as an alpha mech, because you cannot effectively play clan energy as DPS.

Play clans long enough and you reach the point where IS feels like easy mode compared to driving clans. You can take significantly less damage trading with IS weapons and the burn time on IS energy feels like PP FLD. Not t o mention superior ACs.

Honestly, I love the TW for many reasons, but, if I want to feel OP I take a quirked to hell IS mech with a STD engine in pub queue.

Part of the reason why I swapped to IS... and my performance on the clan front lines for IS have proved it... helps knowing what clan mechs can and can't do, and knowing how the hit them where they are weakest, CQB.

[Kain Demos]

Metus regem, on 10 March 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

Sadly this is very true, or something will take the Timber Wolf's place as the source of much QQ... I for one am looking forward to this:



http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Night_Gyr

Basically she is a Timber with out the oversize engine...

The Rivers of QQ that would flow forth on these forums from all the cry-hard teddies that make posts like the OP would break the site if we got the Night Gyr.

As it is I think the Ebon Jaguar will do the same when it comes out and people start running 3 of them in their CW drop decks.

[MeiSooHaityu]

It will see some negative quirks eventually.

Maybe slow down it's acceleration, deceleration, and torso twist speed a tiny bit. Just make it feel a bit more like a heavy and less like a medium.

I wouldn't reduce the speed or torso twist range at all. I would also leave negative weapon quirks out too.

Really just make it feel a bit "heavier" and I think that would go a long way without hurting it too much.

[Gyrok]

The night gyr would literally break these forums in half with QQ.

LOL! I, for one, welcome our new heavy mech overlords.

[Metus regem]

MeiSooHaityu, on 10 March 2015 - 11:58 AM, said:

It will see some negative quirks eventually.

Maybe slow down it's acceleration, deceleration, and torso twist speed a tiny bit. Just make it feel a bit more like a heavy and less like a medium.

I wouldn't reduce the speed or torso twist range at all. I would also leave negative weapon quirks out too.

Really just make it feel a bit "heavier" and I think that would go a long way without hurting it too much.

More or less what I feel she needs too, I would also slow down the turning speed a bit, she can corner a little too well... mind you this is how I see it after having them at elite.

[Brody319]

I'd prefer if they just buff other mechs and not nerf the timberwolf.

[Kain Demos]

MeiSooHaityu, on 10 March 2015 - 11:58 AM, said:

It will see some negative quirks eventually.

Maybe slow down it's acceleration, deceleration, and torso twist speed a tiny bit. Just make it feel a bit more like a heavy and less like a medium.

I wouldn't reduce the speed or torso twist range at all. I would also leave negative weapon quirks out too.

Really just make it feel a bit "heavier" and I think that would go a long way without hurting it too much.

That's garbage just like what they did to the Victor and took ages to reverse.

All of those things that you mentioned are determined in this game by a combination of engine size and movement archetype--you want to arbitrarily punish a 'mech because you don't like it because it has a nice combo of both?

**** that--it opens the door for a lot of other heavy handed **** that isn't needed.

[DivideByZer0]

Evan20k, on 10 March 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

I'm late to the party on this one. I just purchased my very first timberwolf this morning and I really want to know how people justify to themselves that this thing is at all remotely fair? I feel like I have the agility of a medium and the firepower of a 90ton assault in this thing. Maybe I'm just **** with every other mech I've played in comparison, but this thing feels like it has absolutely no drawbacks in a game where each mech has its own strengths and weaknesses. Do you guys think it will be getting some sort of balance adjustments in the coming months?

You forgot it has the silhouette of most IS assaults, and a center torso that can be hit from almost any angle..
I love mine though.

[Bishop Steiner]

Brody319, on 10 March 2015 - 12:02 PM, said:

I'd prefer if they just buff other mechs and not nerf the timberwolf.

that stops working when you have to ridiculously buff almost every other mech to try to make it work and tends to introduce NEW balance issues in the process. So, NO:

[MeiSooHaityu]

Metus regem, on 10 March 2015 - 12:00 PM, said:

More or less what I feel she needs too, I would also slow down the turning speed a bit, she can corner a little too well... mind you this is how I see it after having them at elite.

I currently have a pure Timber Wolf Prime (no omnipods), and the basics completed. Even without 2 times basics I was surprised how quick and agile it was for a 75ton mech.

I know the chassis is renowned for that capability, but I honestly expected it to handle more like the 10 ton lighter Catapult, and less like a 55ton medium.

In any case, the weaponry seemed adequate for the chassis (although I am just limited to a PRIME right now), but the way it moves just seems amazing for its size. It just needs a little toning down.

[Bishop Steiner]

Kain Thul, on 10 March 2015 - 12:03 PM, said:

That's garbage just like what they did to the Victor and took ages to reverse.

All of those things that you mentioned are determined in this game by a combination of engine size and movement archetype--you want to arbitrarily punish a 'mech because you don't like it because it has a nice combo of both?

**** that--it opens the door for a lot of other heavy handed **** that isn't needed.

Not really. The issue with the VTR is they nerfed it to fix a Global Issue, poptarting, and then they overnerfed everything.

Stop using that as a strawman to make it sound like any nerf is a horrible thing. Yes, stats are based off a known formula, for the most part. And when the formula has been broken the whole time, well, sometimes you got to fix it.

The knowns of the TBR: Max armor for class, Firepower of an assault, speed of a Medium.
None of those means it has to have the agility of a Medium too.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Kain Thul, on 10 March 2015 - 12:03 PM, said:

That's garbage just like what they did to the Victor and took ages to reverse.

All of those things that you mentioned are determined in this game by a combination of engine size and movement archetype--you want to arbitrarily punish a 'mech because you don't like it because it has a nice combo of both?

**** that--it opens the door for a lot of other heavy handed **** that isn't needed.

Says you. I disagree.

Plus the Victor was never quite the juggernaught the Timber Wolf was.

Lastly, who says it has to be a huge hit to performance. The Victor took a massive hit to it's agility, this adjustment could be much smaller.

[RedDevil]

Kain Thul, on 10 March 2015 - 11:58 AM, said:

The Rivers of QQ that would flow forth on these forums from all the cry-hard teddies that make posts like the OP would break the site if we got the Night Gyr.

As it is I think the Ebon Jaguar will do the same when it comes out and people start running 3 of them in their CW drop decks.

It wasn't the best in TT, what would make it better than a Timber Wolf? It still has the 4x fixed JJ's that annoy us Clanners so much.