31 replies to this topic

[Ovion]

Lexx, on 20 June 2015 - 06:02 AM, said:

Machine guns are kinda like reaching out with a feather and tickling your enemy. Unless their armor is gone and you get a crit, they really don't do much damage.

Still better than flamers though.

They do 0.8DPS per base, with bonus crit damage once the armour is gone.
1 is kinda pointless (though ocassionally... sorta useful just for assist bonuses), ideally you need 2+, preferably 4+, if not 6+.

2 = 1.6DPS base (IS 2T, 3S / Clan 1.5T, 3S)
4 = 3.2DPS base (IS 4T, 6S / Clan 3T, 6S)
6 = 4.8DPS base (IS 6T, 9S / Clan 4.5T, 7S)
All with 0 heat, and bonuses vs internals.

[FupDup]

stjobe, on 20 June 2015 - 04:50 AM, said:

Heh, yeah. The curse of the no-heat weapon in the minds of the clueless

I mean, they even think heat-neutral 'mechs would break the game, even though most BT 'mechs were heat-neutral by design. I guess it's just bad luck for us to get stuck with designers that don't have the first clue about BT.

Paul, in ATD #43 said:

Playing with a higher rate of cooling makes a lot more builds become heat neutral. A lot of heat neutral builds results in mid-range damage applied at a constant rate over time. This mechanism would be highly exploited by those with knowledge of building efficient heat neutral Mechs.

/sadness

[stjobe]

FupDup, on 20 June 2015 - 09:30 AM, said:

/sadness

That man is such a clueless tool. Sadly he's not the only one clueless:

Garth Erlam said:

I'm not a designer, but I will say that DHS at 2.0 heat allowed me to core a fully armoured Atlas from behind in roughly 3 seconds. In my Jenner.

Bryan Ekman said:

Bumping MG damage will turn it into a laser that can be kept on with no heat penalty until it runs out of ammo. Now imagine the devastating effect that a 6 MG spider could do to the back of an Atlas!

It's like the perfect storm of cluelessness.

All the while, assaults are throwing around 50-point alphas like it's going out of style.

/sadness indeed.

[Questia]

Garth, Bryan... seriously, what the hell are you smoking. Heat efficiency doesn't automatically win you fights - just ask the alpha-heavy metagame, or hell, just watch replays of high-level comp teams on Youtube/Twitch/whatever. If you can't wrap your head around that... man, you really need to be tossed into your own game and play it.

As for me, yeah I really want to see MGs and Flamers buffed to usefulness... like say, MGs boosted to its previous level (IIRC it's the one right around the Ember release?) and Flamers causing the same sort of things that the lava in Terra Therma does. Y'know, mix things up a little - make something a little more viable than usual, give these weapons a reason to exist.

[KaffeeKup]

They can be useful for the fear factor when shooting at enemies.

The fear that your being shot at with weapons that crit you is pretty effective and can lead to mistakes

[Mystere]

Bishop Steiner, on 20 June 2015 - 04:42 AM, said:

but NO HEAT!!!!!

Remember to Russ and Paul that's like FREE firepower, even if you still had to spend tonnage on it, and of course have other drawbacks you just mentioned!


but...NO HEAT!!!!!

I blame the forum idiots who complained loudly about them when they were much better.

[Mystere]

Alistair Winter, on 20 June 2015 - 05:46 AM, said:

MGs are underpowered, for sure. But they're also widely underappreciated. I've been running my Ember a little this weekend and I've lost count of all my MG kills. Granted, 6 medium lasers is better than 4ML+2MG, but the Ember is still pretty powerful.

Not to mention that most people lose control of their bowels when 4MGs are pinging off their mech. Even though they don't do that much damage, people still get really stressed.

Stressed? Huh?

When I encounter someone burping MGs and there are no other baddies around, I'll intentionally stop to aim a big alpha on their face.

[Greenjulius]

MGs are in a bad place. They aren't 100% worthless, but they aren't far off.

It pains me to think that putting a 3rd LPL on my Arrow over the 6 MGs is actually a sound decision.

[Eyepop]

Greenjulius, on 20 June 2015 - 10:29 AM, said:

MGs are in a bad place. They aren't 100% worthless, but they aren't far off.

It pains me to think that putting a 3rd LPL on my Arrow over the 6 MGs is actually a sound decision.

As a BJ-A main, I have done this for the event.

My damage average has gone up about 25% per game. It has made me super sad.

[Bishop Steiner]

Eyepop, on 20 June 2015 - 10:32 AM, said:

As a BJ-A main, I have done this for the event.

My damage average has gone up about 25% per game. It has made me super sad.

I ran 5mg, 3 MLasers and an LB-X. Worked pretty good, TBH. Barring that I'll go back to my 6mg, 2mpl, 1lpl. Just cn't stomach the minmax stuff.

[Mcgral18]

Lexx, on 20 June 2015 - 06:02 AM, said:

Machine guns are kinda like reaching out with a feather and tickling your enemy. Unless their armor is gone and you get a crit, they really don't do much damage.

Still better than flamers though.

MGs are better Flamers; half weight, more damage, no heat.
Worse in that they have a CoF, while Flamers don't.


As for Crits, you have a 52% chance to deal the old damage, before the 20% nerf, at 0.108 (VS 0.1).

Kinda lacklustre...seeing as you used to be able to do 0.1 damage against armour before the giga nerf. And if you got a crit with that old damage, you actually got more damage.