778 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

TB Xiomburg, on 15 January 2016 - 04:10 PM, said:

I thought it was group queue and solo queue. If it tag queue and no tag queue, that is horrible.

Yep - even better:

Units are able to get MC from tagging worlds but you have to pay money to recruit members and you get reduced rewards for being a bigger unit so all the big casual units (Aces Wild and HHoD in Davion as just examples) are *hugely* punished because most their members don't play, and will never play, CW. So.... what, they just kick a ton of their friends?

I get that there's issues with MS and other big, good units dominating the map in CW. To a degree that's inevitable and, to a degree, appropriate. If I was the best player in MW:O I'd expect to dominate. That's the result of getting good - you win more. That's not unreasonable.

However all this does is create *more* reason for units to avoid each other; you want to tag worlds because it gets you rewards. You'll tag more worlds with easier matches so it promotes the big units avoiding each other and splitting the map up like a pie for who gets what tags. The smaller units will have *no* chance as the big units will chase those tags. 22AL is a small unit, we rarely drop 12 people. We will *never* tag a world for Davion. Never. I will never, ever, EVER see a benefit to taking a world in this model. Do I drop and go tagless and at least farm cbills in pug queue? Do I just stop being friends with all my friends and go join a group of strangers in a big unit?

It's a terrible system that will do nothing to fix the concerns and will just piss everyone off because PGI doesn't understand why people join units, what most units are or anything about the topic. MS, 228, KCom and the like are not all units in the game.

[Sandpit]

TB Xiomburg, on 15 January 2016 - 04:10 PM, said:

I thought it was group queue and solo queue. If it tag queue and no tag queue, that is horrible.

This is what we've been saying lol

Has nothing to do with premades, PUGs, etc. It's imply units

[Mystere]

TB Xiomburg, on 15 January 2016 - 03:14 PM, said:

Make the game easy to access for new players, don't make it so hard that they will just uninstall the game. This is the main issue that people have been having when going into CW.

And I have been saying all this time that the solution is innovative game modes that soften the blow on new players, not forced player segregation. The latter is just a knee-jerk and thus unimaginative solution that will and is pissing people off.

Edited by Mystere, 15 January 2016 - 04:49 PM.

[MischiefSC]

Mystere, on 15 January 2016 - 04:34 PM, said:

And I have been saying all this time that the solution is innovative game modes that soften the blow on new players, not forced player segregation. The latter is just a knee-jerk and this unimaginative solution that will and is pissing people off.

Think of it like a training queue. Tagless, goes to loyalty level 6, then they can self-tag. Hell, just make it a one-way 'opt in' flag. You're in the deep end of the pool then.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 15 January 2016 - 04:22 PM, said:

. MS, 228, KCom and the like are not all units in the game.

Exactly
PGI seems to think, as do some players, that this is the end all be all of "units". Sorry, but most units operate under 50 players in them, with a large chunk of those operating under 20.

And no, the whole "well then this won't affect your unit" argument doesn't apply to what I'm saying because if we're all being honest here, this sep will do very little to the status quo in the unit queue.

The one that is going to be damaged by this is the non-unit queue and that is BAD for PGI, MWO, CW, and the entire community as a whole, especially when you look at it from a long-term perspective.

[Johnny Z]

MischiefSC, on 15 January 2016 - 04:22 PM, said:

Yep - even better:

Units are able to get MC from tagging worlds but you have to pay money to recruit members and you get reduced rewards for being a bigger unit so all the big casual units (Aces Wild and HHoD in Davion as just examples) are *hugely* punished because most their members don't play, and will never play, CW. So.... what, they just kick a ton of their friends?

I get that there's issues with MS and other big, good units dominating the map in CW. To a degree that's inevitable and, to a degree, appropriate. If I was the best player in MW:O I'd expect to dominate. That's the result of getting good - you win more. That's not unreasonable.

However all this does is create *more* reason for units to avoid each other; you want to tag worlds because it gets you rewards. You'll tag more worlds with easier matches so it promotes the big units avoiding each other and splitting the map up like a pie for who gets what tags. The smaller units will have *no* chance as the big units will chase those tags. 22AL is a small unit, we rarely drop 12 people. We will *never* tag a world for Davion. Never. I will never, ever, EVER see a benefit to taking a world in this model. Do I drop and go tagless and at least farm cbills in pug queue? Do I just stop being friends with all my friends and go join a group of strangers in a big unit?

It's a terrible system that will do nothing to fix the concerns and will just piss everyone off because PGI doesn't understand why people join units, what most units are or anything about the topic. MS, 228, KCom and the like are not all units in the game.

I disagree with the sentiment. I think smaller units will be effective.

The idea that larger units could potentially not engage each other in the faction vrs faction is possible. But it seems that the entire faction votes on attack lanes so that's out to.

Contrary to the many complaints this whole phase 3 looks really solid with the exception of the split queues, which is still all guess work on players part without knowing the details.

I am seriously impressed with the phase 3 design actually. I would say so if that wasn't the case to.

[Sandpit]

MischiefSC, on 15 January 2016 - 04:36 PM, said:

Think of it like a training queue. Tagless, goes to loyalty level 6, then they can self-tag. Hell, just make it a one-way 'opt in' flag. You're in the deep end of the pool then.

My suggestion in regards to new players has always been, extend cadet bonus period, no CW until both cadet period AND training grounds are complete.

Upon "graduating", you get a FREE mech of your choice, 25 million cbills, and an extra mech bay. The immediately puts a new player on a faster track to having more success overall than anything this silly queue split will do.

Then, as Mischief I think, suggested, have new player in the "unitless" queue until they reach Rank (whatever)

By the time a new player reaches rank 5-9 they've spent enough time in CW to figure out if
1.) It's even a mode they'll enjoy
2.) Have a better understanding of how it works
3.) Have a drop deck full of custom mechs

That's how you improve a new player's experience. Not by forcing them to not be allowed to play with more experienced players trying their damndest to spread information and help them.

Johnny Z, on 15 January 2016 - 04:41 PM, said:

But it seems that the entire faction votes on attack lanes so that's out to.

Do you think organized large units aren't going to dominate those decisions for their faction?
Bad idea is bad idea

[pwnface]

The Gas Guzzler vs Sandpit Timeline Megapost
(logic vs idiocy)

I was bored at work so I put this together for you reading pleasure.

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 12:41 PM, said:

Its not group queue, its unit queue. If you have a unit tag and drop solo in CW, you get put in the unit queue. If you do not have a unit tag, you go into the solo queue. "Seal clubbers" like me, the rest of NS, MS, 228th, etc, will keep doing what we are doing... either dropping solo against other players in units, or dropping in a group, the only difference is, if you aren't in a unit, you won't go up against people in units. So.. we aren't going to be blasting new players UNLESS they make their own unit, which would be very foolish of them.

You should be more informed dude.

I'm in a unit. After this change, I drop solo in CW, I will be put in the UNIT QUEUE, not the solo queue, so no seal clubbing.

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

No
it's a group queue per Russ.
It's solo and group queue split
Has NOTHING to do with being in a unit. I can drop solo any time I want regardless of what unit I belong to.
The only thing it "shelters" new players from is getting help from other faction members in units that tend to be more active, more coordinated, more willing to help them because guess where their new members come from?

YOU should be more informed
Solo and group queue split

Go read it on twitter for yourself, but don't accuse others of needing "more information" when they've just directly been in a conversation with the head of PGI about it

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 12:50 PM, said:

Oh yeah? You sure?

https://twitter.com/...737553189863425

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 01:26 PM, said:

Units have been saying from the beginning that split queues would increase wait times. The seals all said they would rather wait than get seal clubbed.

Get over it.

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 01:36 PM, said:

Know what's funny? No matter what your opinion,or anyone else's for that matter, my responses never equate to dismissing them when having a serious discussion and not just trolling.

Get over it?
No
I'll not "get over it"

I'll continue using these forums to express MY opinion just like you are. The difference between you and I? I'm not telling others not to give their feedback. Maybe YOu need to get over it and understand that this isn't your personal forum

It's funny, you were all "ooooh I like Sandpit's posts! Oh I agree with that one!"
the minute an opinion expressed differs from yours though?
"Get over it"

Notice how numerous players here don't agree but we respect one another enough not to try and be a dismissive ***** when their ideas don't mesh with our own?

Get over it yourself sir

Actually get involved in your community before you start b*tching and moaning about others using the forums to help spread the information.

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 01:45 PM, said:

I don't remember liking that many of your posts.

I didn't ignore them, but when you have factually incorrect information, you are going to get called out on it. I made it very clear that I understood that the solo queue would have longer wait times and the UNIT queue would be fine. That's fine, seals already said they would rather wait than get seal clubbed.

And your "examples" are made up by YOU because you think the majority of players are as toxic and trolly as the people who have said things like "I play badly to stay in Tier 4". Anyone serious about CW, is more into the planetary conquest aspect of it than farming solos. Farming solos isn't fun. No one actively looks around to do that, except bad players/teams because they can't win anywhere else.

I tried to be civil at first, but you haven't been the Mr. Respectful you are making yourself out to be, so I don't know where all this moral stuff is coming from. Especially since you have been going all rage monster mode and manufacturing a bunch of issues that likely won't exist, and then telling me that I'm wrong about things like it being the "unit" queue not the group queue (which I was right about btw), and it always seems like you are so angry your points aren't even a direct response to mine, like you are not understanding what I'm saying. Do you really think MS/228/NS or other units are going to drop their tags so they can get less rewards, no planets, etc? No, they won't. Some toxic troll players might, so just ban those d-bags, no one will miss them.

And personal insults, really? I thought you were on the moral high horse.

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

The only one not using factual information is the one not participating in the direct conversation with Russ regarding this on twitter.
Odd, I don't remember seeing you participate.

Care to let the rest of us know the "factual" responses then?
Since, apparently, my direct quotes relating factual information posted today within the past couple of hours is incorrect but your "factual" statements regarding vague generalities of "they said"

Usually, if you're going to call someone out for "incorrect facts" you provide the evidence to dispute as opposed to "but they said"

I'm not using "they said", I'm giving you DIRECT AND CURRENT information within the past few hours relayed DIRECTLY from the president of the company.

I can cite my sources
can you?

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 01:55 PM, said:

Go ahead, cite them, so I know exactly what points of contention you are even talking about.

Unit vs group queue? Already cited my source there, 1 or 2 pages back. That is what I was referring to about factually incorrect information.

The other thing was I don't recall seeing any evidence of people deliberately seeking out seals to club.

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 12:50 PM, said:

Oh yeah? You sure?

https://twitter.com/...737553189863425

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 02:22 PM, said:

I specifically told you where to find the info. Twitter
Today
within the past couple of hours
from Russ
directly

No solo players will be allowed to drop with anyone in a group having a unit tag
period
exactly as he stated to another solo players who specifically asked him about it

Dont' be so dense bud, you've participated in more than one of those threads. Next time before you call someone out for "misinformation' I'd suggest doing your homework though

Gas Guzzler, on 14 January 2016 - 12:50 PM, said:

Oh yeah? You sure?

https://twitter.com/...737553189863425

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 02:28 PM, said:

You cannot drop with groups as a solo player. You can drop with other units as a solo player but you cannot drop in the group queue unless you belong to a unit.

Solo players without any "unit" affiliation will not be allowed to drop with any players that have unit tags.
period

That's specifically what was stated.

pwnface, on 14 January 2016 - 06:24 PM, said:

Gas Guzzler: 1
Sandpit: 0

How are you still even trying to argue this point? I feel like the question and answer are both pretty clear and can't reasonably be interpreted in any other way.

Can't fix stupid I guess.

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 06:27 PM, said:

Is he still going? lol
What is he digging at this time? Wanting to argue for 10 more pagers about a word definition?
no thanks
I'm talking to the rest of the adults now

pwnface, on 14 January 2016 - 06:29 PM, said:

Is it that hard to admit you are wrong?

Gas Guzzler cited direct evidence from Twitter and your response to him was go look at Twitter.

How can you be this stupid?

Finally, some 20 pages later after insulting both Gas Guzzler and myself after being pointed out he was flat out wrong.
Sandpit realizes the truth... he is the idiot that was wrong after all.

Sandpit, on 15 January 2016 - 04:01 PM, said:

That's exactly what it is
It isn't group vs. solo queues
it tag or no tag queues

Absolutely nothing to stop 12mans without tags rolling through jsut like they do now. Just makes it easier for them to find "victims" now

Game Over. You've been out forum-warriored again. Next time just say "oops I was wrong" and move on.

Gas Guzzler: 1
Pwnface: 1
Sandpit: 0

[Mystere]

TB Xiomburg, on 15 January 2016 - 03:48 PM, said:

3. PGI tested Laser changes, and saw the effect of them...and did not implement them.

Lol! They were not implemented because of loud whining, in the same way we got ghost heat, gauss charge, and separate queues in CW. Whining works. Whining produces results. It's a lesson the player base has learned after three years.

Edited by Mystere, 15 January 2016 - 05:04 PM.

[Johnny Z]

Sandpit, on 15 January 2016 - 04:42 PM, said:

My suggestion in regards to new players has always been, extend cadet bonus period, no CW until both cadet period AND training grounds are complete.

Upon "graduating", you get a FREE mech of your choice, 25 million cbills, and an extra mech bay. The immediately puts a new player on a faster track to having more success overall than anything this silly queue split will do.

Then, as Mischief I think, suggested, have new player in the "unitless" queue until they reach Rank (whatever)

By the time a new player reaches rank 5-9 they've spent enough time in CW to figure out if
1.) It's even a mode they'll enjoy
2.) Have a better understanding of how it works
3.) Have a drop deck full of custom mechs

That's how you improve a new player's experience. Not by forcing them to not be allowed to play with more experienced players trying their damndest to spread information and help them.


Do you think organized large units aren't going to dominate those decisions for their faction?
Bad idea is bad idea

I think that its likely that units that put a lot of effort into being a top unit for their faction will have the most say. Yes. Also I think that's a good thing.

Underhanded behavior trying to greif competitor units in the same faction into quitting etc is not a problem design can address to strongly. That's for entirely different people running the game I guess.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 January 2016 - 04:51 PM.

[Khobai]

MischiefSC, on 15 January 2016 - 02:15 AM, said:

It's really simple. If you get to take a world from the other faction without having to actually fight anyone/everyone in that faction who can fight to defend it, there is no point to CW other than new maps/modes. You have a matchmaker that's little different from PSR tiers and just having a leaderboard in pug/group queues. You didn't win against a faction, you just played PSR protected, staged matches against curated opponents carefully selected to make sure you never had to fight anyone better than yourself.

If you take a world than you need to do it from anyone/everyone who wants to defend it.

what are you talking about? youre making no sense. Even in a split queue the attackers still have to defeat the defenders in order to win a slot on the planet. defenders still get to defend the planets.

the game will just try to match pug vs pug and premade vs premade. If its unable to do in a certain amount of time, it should open a release valve and allow a pug vs premade match to take place. That way no matter what the defenders still get to defend.

Edited by Khobai, 15 January 2016 - 04:53 PM.

[spectralthundr]

Sandpit, on 14 January 2016 - 11:51 AM, said:

Well that's that.

PGI is splitting queues per Russ on twitter.

Guess that puts to rest all the debate and ideas and suggestions regarding it.

Well put a nail in CW. The whiners wanting to "pug it up" in the actual team mode cried loudly enough.

[MischiefSC]

Khobai, on 15 January 2016 - 04:50 PM, said:

what are you talking about? youre making no sense. Even in a split queue the attackers still have to defeat the defenders in order to win a slot on the planet. defenders still get to defend the planets.

the game will just try to match pug vs pug and premade vs premade. If its unable to do in a certain amount of time, it should open a release valve and allow a pug vs premade match to take place. That way no matter what the defenders still get to defend.

No. Let's make this clear -

There will be 2 queues. A queue for players with tags and a queue for players without tags. They will not play against each other. So if you have a tag, if you're in a unit of even 1 person, you play in a queue against other units. You will not play against tagless players. If you can take a planet without ever having to play against units then you didn't actually beat that faction - just some pugs from that faction. You can just not have your units drop on that front, feed their units eat ghost drops while you keep their pugs busy, letting you keep a vastly superior enemy from taking your world.

A lot of ways to skew the system because it's not really faction vs faction warfare, it's just pugs vs pugs and units vs units.

There's no release valve for it. It's split queues.

[Sandpit]

Mystere, on 15 January 2016 - 04:47 PM, said:

Lol! They were not implement because of loud whining, in the same way we got ghost heat, gauss charge, and separate queues in CW. Whining works. Whining produces results. It's a lesson the player base has learned after three years.

It's a lesson PGI keeps TEACHING us year after year

[Bonger Bob]

Sandpit, on 15 January 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

I'm also willing to tweet a list of players who don't want to use Twitter to Russ that don't think this latest is a good idea as well. This community can do amazing things when motivated and organized enough. This is one of those things that I honestly, truly feel has the potential to just completely ruin CW for new and solo players.

Units are going to be laregly unaffected because, well we're units, we already have players to drop with if we want. The PUGs, solos, and new players we actively try to pick up aren't being "recruited" by any particular units or faction, we're simply trying to pick them up out of faction chat and doing PGI's job for them in explaining how the complicated mess that CW is works.

but wait a sec, according to a few of your many other tantrum posts, the que split was all about hurting and penalizing groups and units ?!?!

Sandpit, on 15 January 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

Now, they're going to be tossed to the wolves. They aren't even kept from 12mans, just 12mans with tags. Yea, your griefer groups aren't going to figure that one out and continue stomping players in the "non-unit" queue. I mean who would be able to think of a way around THAT roadblock.

Certainly not players who's entire goal is to sit around and come up with new ways to grief the community. I mean it's not like I came up with a work around to be able to slaughter seals with no real effort or thought put into it in under 5 minutes...

oh wait...

no one is championing the split as removing 12mans for scrub pugs to come against, YES it will mean a full unit / group of 3rd party voip coordinated players will not be able to continue dropping against a side composed of scrub solo's.

agreed, the griefer players can still choose to exploit the mechanics, but you wont have the griefers AND group / unit players feeding at the same time, unless your implying that the groups / units are only intent on griefing ?? The end result will be less bad behavior being inflicted on a section of the player base than is happening currently. There will be less wasted times for groups and units dropping against a side they can auto roflstomp.

This also crosses into the ques having the same rewards, which i don't agree with. If you made the rewards greater for groups / units than in the solo que, it would be a disincentive to the grups / units to exploit and grief, and an incentive for solo's to engage in the next stage of play with groups / units. But this is a separate problem to address, and goes far deeper than just rewards.

You keep going on about the que split as though its going to penalize solo's, pug and new players all in one hit.

The solo team player is still able to engage in solo play. Whats that ???, you want to be in a group with others all communicating in 3rd party voip and all dropping at the same time ??, thats what group / unit is for.

The pug player is still going to be able to engage in pug play. More so now than ever before, you won't be mingled with units at select moments, a pug ( you know, a PICK UP GROUP ) will still be able to attempt to communicate with team mates during the round with the players that they have ended up with, and BOTH sides of the battle are more likely to be comprised of these random players. Not one side having dropped pug, against the other side who all jumped into a 3rd party voip channel and then dropped together.

New players now have an option where they are less likely to go against a side comprised entirely or in large part of bitter vets who want to use a gun barrel as a recruitment and training method. There are other options of training and recruitment for new players that is less predatory and more likely not to sour a players initial experience in CW. The players that want training will seek it out. The players that want to join a unit will seek them out.

I do agree with concerns voiced over these players having access to the same rewards as what a player in a group / unit gets, but that is a separate problem that can be very easily addressed without scaremongering or falsely claiming that solo / pug / new players are now going to be worse off.

[Sandpit]

Johnny Z, on 15 January 2016 - 04:47 PM, said:

Underhanded behavior trying to greif competitor units in the same faction into quitting etc is not a problem design can address to strongly. That's for entirely different people running the game I guess.

It's a problem design is TRYING to address and I agree with you, it's not something PGI can handle regardless of what they try. People are people.
The only thing this accomplishes is a lot of headache for everyone including PGI. Bad design purpose is bad design purpose.

Their entire premise for this split and how they're doing it and capping off large units and such I think I summed up in another thread fairly well:

Sandpit, on 15 January 2016 - 04:59 PM, said:

I never said there was.
You're missing the point.

The entire point of PGI making a separate queue for players without tags is so they won't get rolled over.
The entire point of PGI making a unit cap is so that large units can't dominate at will.

I just flat out and factually showed how it does neither of those things.

This isn't about my opinion regarding a queue separation, this is a factual discussion of how that queue sep doesn't fix the very reason it's being implemented according to PGI itself.

It's not going to stop that from happening. I just showed you exactly how and why it won't stop that from happening. I laid out a very simple way it circumvents the system to do that without ANY real effort other than creating a few alts. Do you really think the big units that are as coordinated as they are now can't think of these kinds of ways around it or will find it nothing more than a minor inconvenience to them?

Groups like MS did what they did to the IS map to point out and show PGI, "Hey, you're not listening to us, you're not listening to your community. Your sh*t is broken. There are many ways to fix this. Please look into it as now you have statistical and factual proof that it IS broken"
Then PGI looks at that, gets pissy and starts looking for ways to punish that group of players instead of actually trying to fix something that's broken.
Just like narc
Just like ecm
Just like collisions
Collisions is still the best example in my opinion. MONTHS players posted juggernaut threads regarding the broken nature and exploitation of knockdowns. MONTHS PGI ignored, downplayed, and dismissed the issue.
Then Paul gets caught live in front of the audience getting destroyed by it on purpose.
Guess what?
Collisions were taken out that day.
Not a week later
Not a month later
That day.

Then guess what?
They were never heard from again. Regardless of the FACT that just about every online game out there with combat has figured out how to manage physical collisions in their games, but we're to believe that somehow, in the magical world of "coding and netserver and hitreg", MWO is technologically incapable of implementing it.

SO moral of the story?
PGI has deaf ears until they're publicly embarrassed, which usually comes under the coordination of a big unit, then PGI overreacts and punishes that group of players for it. Then we spend the next 6 months trying to repair the damage it caused the community.

PGI doesn't look for solutions, it continues to look for punishments to groups like MS, 228, LOWTAX, LORDS, etc. because those groups use their coordination and community to do nothing BUT show the exploits many times. SOmetimes it's a minor thing and the uproar is small, sometimes
every once in a while
if you stop and listen
There's a HUGE uproar that's about to hit because some of the player base gets tired of being this whipping boy and scapegoat for the community and it's much larger than many seem to think or PGI remembers.

That's not any kind of "threat" or any other such foolishness so you trolling neckbeards don't even go there. It's a compressed history of PGI, MWO, and groups in general.

It's not made up.
It's simply a reflection of how this game gets changed. In lieu of the latest developments my prior stance of "Yea, but it's still dbaggy and you guys shouldn't do it" in regards to big units doing that kind of stuff..

I sadly admit that maybe you guys were right, maybe that is the only time PGI stops to listen and remember that even though MWO might be theirs legally, it's nothing without the community to support it, so that vision has to be tempered through the community's glasses.

Right now the perception is more smoky and hazy than it needs to be. Start a discussion about this with us before it comes to stupid nonconstructive things like community meltdowns.

[wanderer]

Quote

the game will just try to match pug vs pug and premade vs premade

Just to keep stomping this:

It's the "I have a unit tag" queue and the "I don't have a unit tag" queue.

I can cheerfully go tagless (as I am now), get a 12-man together with fellow tagless players and go stompity all over the "safe" queue.

Likewise, even a single player will be in the "unit tag" queue as long as he's in a unit. Even a unit of 1.

[Khobai]

MischiefSC, on 15 January 2016 - 05:00 PM, said:

There's no release valve for it. It's split queues.

Well there should be a release valve. So I would bring that suggestion upto Russ.

I personally see no problem with split queues as long as theres no ghost drops.

Theres going to be MORE than enough pugs to ensure that the pug queue is always full. However units shouldnt be able to capture slots on planets just because there isnt another unit to oppose them.

Edited by Khobai, 15 January 2016 - 05:09 PM.

[Sandpit]

Bonger Bob, on 15 January 2016 - 05:01 PM, said:

New players now have an option where they are less likely to go against a side comprised entirely or in large part of bitter vets who want to use a gun barrel as a recruitment and training method. There are other options of training and recruitment for new players that is less predatory and more likely not to sour a players initial experience in CW.

rofl
Again, should I quote your post regarding the players you're "defending" here as "scrubs" I can if you like. You seem to forget about that kind of stuff.

As for this quoted portion? Yea, everyone else. This is exactly the kind of propaganda I'm talking about. This is exactly what I'm talking about when I say some of us are tired of being your scapegoat and pariah. We're tired of getting blamed every time you have a bad game. This is exactly the kind of crap I'm referring to if any of you ever wonder where these "crazy" rants come from.

I wonder where players like me might get the idea that they're constantly berated

Quote

New players now have an option where they are less likely to go against a side comprised entirely or in large part of bitter vets who want to use a gun barrel as a recruitment and training method.

I wonder why players in groups feel like that?
Hmmm... yet this is the same guy that refers to new players and those solos and PUGs as "scrubs"

Know what's truly funny? In 20 some odd pages I've never once seen those of us mainly participating in this discussion refer to anyone, much less new players, as scrubs.

Yet we're those "angry bitter vets" (I guess since you can't use the "premade or 12man boogeyman" anymore you got a new soundbyte) who have had over 20 pages of discussion without having anything negative to say about any players, whether we agree with them or not.

So again, and for the last time from me since you're no longer worth the time or energy and have rightly and finally been trounced as and outed as the troll you are, take your propaganda elsewhere.

Take your fear mongering and stereotyping to some other thread. Your trolling is weak and your bitterness is strong. I'll tell you like I tell everyone else. If you can't keep it off a personal level, leave your snarky attacks and such at home and have an adult conversation, then go elsewhere.

Trust me sir, you're a bit out of your depth in that category looking through the names in this thread. You're just going to wind up with hurt feelings, and wonderment at how your pathetic attempt to troll were rebuked and otherwise laughed at.

[Johnny Z]

wanderer, on 15 January 2016 - 05:07 PM, said:

Just to keep stomping this:

It's the "I have a unit tag" queue and the "I don't have a unit tag" queue.

I can cheerfully go tagless (as I am now), get a 12-man together with fellow tagless players and go stompity all over the "safe" queue.

Likewise, even a single player will be in the "unit tag" queue as long as he's in a unit. Even a unit of 1.

Alts can be a problem in every online game. Nothing wrong with it per say just that they can create all sorts of trouble in all sorts of ways.

Anyway with the addition of Mercenary Company resource management sim/meta game it will be counter productive for players to be on alts instead of their mains. The merc company sim will more than likely have many other facets to it also not just resource management. Obviously pilot skill will play a role just to name one.

The return of repair and rearm cannot be ignored when alts are mentioned either. A resource management mini game for players is a must to, not just units.

In fact its my personal opinion that single players meta game is far more important and that to much effort going into unit only content can easily be a waste contrary to my many replies on the subject.

I say wasting to much content on units is a mistake is hard to explain properly. Its not a waste if regular players are included.

Edited by Johnny Z, 15 January 2016 - 05:19 PM.