387 replies to this topic

[Adamski]

oldradagast, on 02 February 2016 - 07:54 PM, said:

Big team toolbags always trot out the "hating teamwork" argument against anyone who speaks out against the unbalanced matches in CW and the idiocy of pitting a practiced 12-man against a handful of PUG's and casuals. This is because their argument in favor of such lopsided matches is completely indefensible, so they have to basically attack strawmen to protect their epeens and K/D ratios. It also gives them something stupid to repeat over and over again on the forums to avoid actual conversations about how to salvage what is left of CW.

What I want to know is how big does a team have to be to get special treatment? Also, if we get rewards for making a format "boring," what do I have to do to get free stuff in the solo queue?

CW is the only place big teams can play together without being penalized. If they drop as 12 in group queue, they face a 35% tonnage penalty against 2 6man teams.

CW has always been advertised as the battleground for units.

[Mystere]

oldradagast, on 02 February 2016 - 07:33 PM, said:

Yeah, and so's greed, like begging for freebies when you're the largest and richest team out there that's basically won CW and killed it as a viable format or source of profit for PGI.

Shall we sum up again: Let's give handouts to people who don't need them because the game format that they emptied is now boring. The poor babies.

If you can't see the stupidity to that, well...

You see a freebie, I see a trade.

And why do you seem to be butthurt over this? I had this impression you did not give a damn about CW.

Edited by Mystere, 02 February 2016 - 08:02 PM.

[oldradagast]

Adamski, on 02 February 2016 - 08:00 PM, said:

CW is the only place big teams can play together without being penalized. If they drop as 12 in group queue, they face a 35% tonnage penalty against 2 6man teams.

CW has always been advertised as the battleground for units.

So what? How does ANY of that justify giving out handouts to players that don't need the freebies?

And that doesn't even begin to touch upon the idiocy of giving such a handout to people as basically a reward for driving everyone else out of the format? Or is CW now a "battleground for units, providing that's not remotely inconvenient for said units, and there aren't some seals to club nearby that would be easier targets?"

This is also a Battletech game about big, killer robots? Does that mean I can have a few free mechs?

[Mead]

I'm just trying to figure out how many people I need to add so I can magically not be a vile dbag any more. I had no idea.

[oldradagast]

Mystere, on 02 February 2016 - 08:01 PM, said:

You see a freebie, I see a trade.

And why do you seem to be butthurt over this? I had this impression you did not give a damn about CW.

See my post earlier, or to sum up:

• CW has been turned into a ghost town thanks to endless seal clubbing and other poor decisions; big teams have been long-time supporters of the current screwed up format and have prevented any changes from being made that would make CW anything but a money pit for PGI and a basically dead game mode.
  
• This means money PGI has put into CW is basically wasted; what hurts part of PGI hurts all of MWO as a whole, even for people who don't play CW.
  
• Let's reward people who helped achieve point 1 on this list with freebies that they don't need and then act surprised that some people think rewarding bad behavior - and just plain begging for freebies to alleviate "boredom" - is a dumb idea.

That should be simple enough for everyone to understand.

Edited by oldradagast, 02 February 2016 - 08:09 PM.

[Zoid]

I dunno, it almost seems appropriate for a game based on mercs to have a big enough merc unit to not pay the contract canceling fee. You wouldn't expect a bunch of mercs to honor the rules unless they have to, especially if it costs them money.

[Vickinator]

Zoid, on 02 February 2016 - 08:05 PM, said:

I dunno, it almost seems appropriate for a game based on mercs to have a big enough merc unit to not pay the contract canceling fee. You wouldn't expect a bunch of mercs to honor the rules unless they have to, especially if it costs them money.

Yeah and unless your the Wolf Dragoons you wouldn't see lore based mercs as big as some of these units, as well as influencing the Inner Sphere as much as they do. Most mercs in BT lore are roughly 1 Union dropship big, thats 12 mechs.

And mercs in BT that don't honor their contracts would quickly find that no one would employ them, why hire someone when they might just up and leave halfway through their contract leaving you high and dry

Edited by Vickinator, 02 February 2016 - 08:10 PM.

[WolfishEU]

I know I'm late to the bandwagon but...

MS was 3 days away from ending its contract with FRR.

Russ was asked, if he would be willing to change MS over to clan Smoke Jaguar, so that the stomping of the clans would end and there could be some progress made on the clan side. As you can see, MS has made some ground over the last few days. Some other units are also switching over to clans, while some are fighting against them still.

MS doesn't make a concerted effort to 'avoid' other units. The contract is decided by popular vote at the end of each week, with the contract changing on Tuesdays (though it may be out of sync now thanks to Russ moving them across on a Saturday). If there's any avoidance of other units, it's entirely coincidental as 90% of those voting just choose based on where they haven't unlocked their mechbays yet.

It's also worth mentioning that the cancellation cost, even if cancellation was possible (it wasn't, as there were less than 3 days left on the contract), is negligible. MS has hundreds of millions, if not billions in its coffers all of the time. I'm not sure how much cancellation costs but it's not really a factor in any decision about cancelling contracts.


As for MS enjoying 'seal clubbing', though it is nice being able to get CBills fairly easily by doing so, it is rather boring. It's why a lot of MS members have been enjoying quick play recently; it's a lot more interesting at the moment. I for one think separating units from non-unit players in CW will be a positive thing... if the population can take it. Honestly though, I'm not sure that it can, as now, during NA prime time, there are a little more than 200 people playing CW. And I would wager at least 50% of those are not in units. Maybe the population will increase when solo players are not facing units that stomp them on such a regular basis, but I'm not holding my breath on that front...

[LuxAstrum]

NO SPECIAL TREATMENT!
NO SPECIAL TREATMENT!
NO SPECIAL TREATMENT!
You Switch because of QUIRKS?!

YOU SHOWED LOYALTY TO THE FREEBIRTH FOR QUIRKS?!?!?!!!

NO SPECIAL TREATMENT
NO SPECIAL TREATMENT
NO SPECIAL TREATMENT

[Havyek]

oldradagast, on 02 February 2016 - 07:01 PM, said:

Blah blah blah I'm bad and don't want to play nice with the blue team so CW should be made easier for me to play with myself

Fixed.

[Thell]

Wait. Am I a trash man scrublord because I'm not in a unit but I like teamwork and that sort of thing? Oh nooooooooooo.

[Aresye]

Mead, on 02 February 2016 - 07:46 PM, said:

Whoa. Only large groups are cool these days?

Okay, so how large does a unit have to be before you don't consider them filth or teamwork-haters? Just curious.

There are 2 kinds of players that belong in CW:
1. Competent solo players/small groups who know how to work as a team.
2. Large groups.

I've solo dropped countless times in CW. I don't have a problem with large groups, because even against tougher teams like MS and KCom I can still put out 2500+ damage, which is more than twice the amount of damage required to, "pull your weight." My team loses because I have a ton of solo IDIOTS, who completely ignore calls over VOIP, don't focus fire, do things that would be considered stupid even in a T5 game, and sometimes even just straight up intentionally quit the match at the very start.

The problem isn't Solo vs. Groups. Give me some solo players that are a grand mixture of players from various comp units and we'll beat nearly every single 12man team in the game.

The problem is players are bad, and those bad players are asking to have PGI cater to them being bad.

[xX PUG Xx]

Hmmmm....funny I managed to find and play 2 CW matches within roughly an hour and a quarter. The first had an 11 man from GCGB and the other had a large premade from a Smoke Jaguar unit (sorry, don't remember which), both IS defence teams were skittles but put up a good fight; so the Clans are still there and fighting.

However when I checked the map it was all -MS- KCom -SO- etc. tags encircling the Clan homeworlds, so either you're getting fights (or at least WERE) getting fights or you have done one hell of a lot of ghost drops. Due to the size of ACTICE CW population -MS- represents, I predict Smoke Jaguar will now expand it's territory and we will see a repeat of the last Phase where the Clans will encircle Terra and many will cry foul on balance etc.

I like that -MS- and Russ Bullock publicly say they want to promote battles in CW but worry that the "free" swap sets a precedent that is simply unfair, unless -MS- still had to pay to break the contract and the cooldown was simply waved.

I have my views on the "other" posts and love how players that haven't played in the mode for X weeks/months still believe they have valid, current arguements. It gets frustrating reading them when part of what they say is true but most is opinionated, self entitled trash that is cleverly worded to make the poster appear reasonable and the champion for the masses. I would ask "what about me?" I enjoy CW, it has it's flaws and ATM is fairly shallow but it has potential IF the forum warriors would actually let PGI develop their vision and stop baying like a demented mob because every mode in the game doesn't suit them.

I actually like the challenge of playing against groups, I believe it helps me to improve and learn new skills/try new things but I was never one for turning down the difficulty level on my PVE games either. I guess i'm just of a generation/mentality that believes it is fun to have to make an effort and the rewards for that effort are worth it.

But what fo I know? I'm just PUG.

[New Breed]

CW is so bad I don't even bother renewing my ghost bear allegiance anymore haha

[YakkSlapper]

I think its good, letem do it, wtf is it going to hurt anyone at all??

[Felbombling]

If they really wanted to help out the situation, I think they'd split up into a few different units for the sake of this testing, to keep things interesting over a larger front.

[Brollocks]

Aresye, on 02 February 2016 - 06:58 PM, said:

Well, to be quite honest, MS is more about playing for fun than they are about super tryhard comp play.

I'm not so sure about that for all their members. Some individuals in MS make it clear in-match (CW) that stomping all over pugs is why they are there, and they seemingly enjoy and fuel the bitterness from opposing players in chat.

Might only be a portion of the unit, but it is there. Seen it playing with and against them.

[Kaisha]

xX PUG Xx, on 02 February 2016 - 08:18 PM, said:

I actually like the challenge of playing against groups, I believe it helps me to improve and learn new skills/try new things but I was never one for turning down the difficulty level on my PVE games either. I guess i'm just of a generation/mentality that believes it is fun to have to make an effort and the rewards for that effort are worth it.

I have world firsts under my belt in other games. I was ranked top 16th and 23rd on the West ladder in WC3 TFT (not good enough to go pro, but certainly good enough to play against them on a regular basis). Some of my favorite games as a child were Ninja Gaiden and Battletoads for the NES. I'm sorry but they whole 'anyone who doesn't agree is a bad player' is complete BS. If someone at my skill level can't cut it, then you have a problem. I have tested myself against some of the best players in the world (not just the best players of a small game no one plays), I know where I stand (ie. I have no delusions of grandeur, I have played against true pros, I know what they are actually capable of), what you have in CW is not a 'challenge', its just a mess.

[Vapor NINE]

I like pie.

[Clownwarlord]

Helsbane, on 02 February 2016 - 05:44 PM, said:

I don't see anything wrong with this personally. Right now the Clan units are getting absolutely massacred, so if Mercstar wants to go lend a hand for one simple favor in return, what's the harm exactly?

I believe the issue is breaking their contract and they don't want to pay the CBills to do so like everyone else would. Hence why they are asking PGI to do it for them.