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Be Respectful Of Drop Commanders And Other Players.


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#1 mikerso

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 12:30 PM

Did a few drops with the best unit on the planet today ( Sons of Odin). Due to bugs and such they weren't my best drops ever, but still they were fun. There was however a certain (Austrian not German, not Son of Odin) player that was less than helpful. He was insulting other players, and talking over our drop commander. Our drop commander (IMO one of the best FRR has to offer) had to raise his voice to be heard over said player. The player also kept demanding that the drop commander kick people or switch planets. To me that is as rude as insulting players, which as mentioned above he did as well.

I may be old fashioned, but to me kicking players and the planet we attack is the responsibility of the drop commander or the one who started the group. There can be a little discussion, but in the end the decision is theirs. If you are going to insult someone, go look in the mirror. Also at least make sure it is someone who can understand the tounge you are insulting him in (in this case the recipient could not, and made sure we knew he did not understand).

Just had to rant for a sec thanks for the ears.

#2 -Vompo-

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 08:40 PM

When you encounter people like that just mute them. Much easier than trying to talk to them.

#3 KinLuu

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 09:03 PM

Why did you not simply kick said player?

#4 mikerso

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 10:59 PM

View PostKinLuu, on 25 April 2016 - 09:03 PM, said:

Why did you not simply kick said player?


I would agree with this, but as I said above I leave that decision to the drop commander/group lead.

#5 Tarogato

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 03:30 AM

I'm not sure who you're talking about, but I'm thinking of a few people it possibly could be. The FRR Hub management is capable of warning and banning players for toxic behaviour if need be. Hopefully it doesn't have to come to that, but if this is a reoccurring problem with anybody I would suggest maybe getting a couple people together to talk to Dane about it. If you don't want to go that far and I don't blame you, I would just leave the group if this person joins and starts shenanigans. If he is really that problematic, he'd soon have nobody to drop with but himself.

#6 nehebkau

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 06:59 AM

@op,

Kinda sucks when that happens -- usually you wait a drop or so to see if the person settles down before you remove them. Next time, if it is really bothering you, use the private chat feature in TS on the hub to advise your drop commander.

If nothing happens, simply state that you are leaving the group after the drop because you are finding the atmosphere of the group isn't good for your enjoyment of the game. I've had to do that myself -- though in my case it was because most were not listening/following the DC's orders.

IMHO it takes courage to Drop Command, and that courage should be respected by attempting to follow their orders to the best of your ability -- even when you don't agree. After the match is the time for civil discussion of tactics and results.

Edited by nehebkau, 26 April 2016 - 07:03 AM.


#7 crustydog

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 08:41 AM

Part of the job of Drop Commander is also ongoing training of the troops.

Moral is a very real factor in team operations, and it has a huge impact on the performance of the team in the field.

Some players have yet to learn that their panicking or otherwise freaking out under fire, argumentative, combative or disruptive voice communications, or in general constant negative feedback is harmful to the group as a whole, and it impacts upon the units performance in a very real negative way.

The Drop Commander has to walk a fine line, and in a sense has two battles to fight, one in commanding the troops against the enemy, but the other is keeping the troops together performing as a single cohesive unit, while maintaining an overall state of high unit moral. You need your troops to be working together, covering each others backs, confident, assertive, aggressive and dominating on the field.

Each member of the unit has his or her role to play in this process - they must contribute to the group with more than just their combat ability. This is not a simple thing to learn, nor is it easy to teach. Yet this concept needs to be communicated by the Drop Commander to all of the warriors in the group.

In this sense, simply kicking a player from the group is also kind of an admission of failure on the part of the Drop Commander. The preferred approach is to find a way to get this concept across and modify the behavior, hopefully without offending everybody in the process. The is a shortage of warriors after all, it is not wise to lose any of them, better to train them and raise their skills to the required levels.

#8 SteamCharts Kerensky

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 09:37 AM

Step 1. Tuffen up.

Step 2. Stop and ask yourself if what he's saying is correct.

#9 Lord Creston

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 10:30 AM

Thankfully the occurance of this is pretty low for games I drop in and lead or games I'm in and others lead. I recommend during match just repeat 'battle comms' or 'we will recap after the match' or 'X has lead'. If 2 Or 3 people in the drop consistently do that 90% of the time that team mate will calm down and quietly continue. Then give them a safe chance to criticize after the match for a moment. If things turn to a drama zone I just bow out and reform another group. Its faster and easier to just reform than deal with a drama filled extended discussion. He may have a point and let him say it but don't let him bog the team down in overanalysis or insults. If you are not leading or in a leadership position, just let the leader know that you appreciated the group and them leading but your going to avoid player X for a little while because he's causing drama. Give them a moment to fix it, and if they choose not to, move on to the next group. There are plenty of other people to play with.

Some feedback out of match is good. Drama sucks. Don't bother with it. It won't take long for those people who can't be respectful to lose their place in groups.

#10 nehebkau

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 12:04 PM

View PostSteamCharts Kerensky, on 26 April 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

Step 1. Tuffen up.

Step 2. Stop and ask yourself if what he's saying is correct.


Begun the troll wars have. Posted Image

PGI help us. NKVA is being mean again!

Edited by nehebkau, 26 April 2016 - 01:39 PM.


#11 Tarogato

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 02:30 PM

View Postnehebkau, on 26 April 2016 - 12:04 PM, said:

Begun the troll wars have. Posted Image

PGI help us. NKVA is being mean again!




Well, he does have a point. A lot of times these people have something to say that is worth listening to, even if they are arrogant or belligerent about it. For instance, I had an individual straight up shoot me in the face in the middle of a drop because he thought I was jumpjetting around too much. I had a good long discussion with him later, and he was right - I do have the tendency to jumpjet around a lot to get out of my teammates ways and shoot over them or get new angles but at the expense of sometimes landing in other people's way and blocking them in turn. Was he right in shooting me in the face about it or going on a tirade on comms and in chat about it? Heck no. But was he right, period? Yes. He was right.

#12 Jarl Dane

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 02:33 PM

View PostTarogato, on 26 April 2016 - 03:30 AM, said:

I'm not sure who you're talking about, but I'm thinking of a few people it possibly could be. The FRR Hub management is capable of warning and banning players for toxic behaviour if need be. Hopefully it doesn't have to come to that, but if this is a reoccurring problem with anybody I would suggest maybe getting a couple people together to talk to Dane about it. If you don't want to go that far and I don't blame you, I would just leave the group if this person joins and starts shenanigans. If he is really that problematic, he'd soon have nobody to drop with but himself.


The Majors of the RKA can ban and kick people from the Hub. I would prefer if such a decision was made it was made by the Major(aka LEADER) of the Unit the person belonged. So if it was an -SO- player, it would be best if Theaus made that call.

When leaders start to interfere with players from different units.. things can get sticky.

#13 nehebkau

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 05:59 PM

View PostMech The Dane, on 26 April 2016 - 02:33 PM, said:

When leaders start to interfere with players from different units.. things can get sticky.


True that.

At least I am not going to have to show PGI, using the forum-doll, where NKVA touched me. :)

#14 RustySpork

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Posted 27 April 2016 - 08:13 AM

OP said this guy wasn't -SO-, so I'm gonna go ahead and guess that it was Idealsuspect. He's an ******* in this particular way. Also, his unit went over to Kurita yesterday, so he's their problem now.

#15 MovinTarget

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Posted 27 April 2016 - 08:32 AM

View PostRustySpork, on 27 April 2016 - 08:13 AM, said:

OP said this guy wasn't -SO-, so I'm gonna go ahead and guess that it was Idealsuspect. He's an ******* in this particular way. Also, his unit went over to Kurita yesterday, so he's their problem now.


This statement smacks of profiling!

Just because IdealSuspect is an... ideal suspect... doesn't mean you can name drop him w/o evidence...

Now if it was K3v1nS@c3y i guess you could say it was one of the usual suspects...

Okay seriously, this is where ts hubs can be iffy... the great thing is everyone can get in there. Unfortunately this includes people that may not jive with the rest of the group...

#16 Starbomber109

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Posted 29 April 2016 - 12:27 AM

Isn't ideal Russian?

I'm not gonna throw names around because I wasn't there, I will tell you one thing, I always try to keep comms when I'm under someone else. Having multiple people try to take command leaves the group confused and lost.

#17 crustydog

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Posted 29 April 2016 - 11:29 AM

Forming, Norming, Storming, and Performing: Four natural stages of group dynamics evolution. Interesting stuff if you ever want to read about it (Google.) It's not for everybody (Behavioral Psychology - Group Dynamics.).

In a nutshell, whenever you change the members of a group, it changes the group dynamics, and in the beginning that often leads to a lot of infighting and general disruption, for a while. It's completely normal.

One of the things you see in the elite teams is their membership tends to stay fairly static. New members are not easily admitted. These players tend to function in the "performing " stage of the group, where they know their own roll, and that of every other member of the group. They work well together as a team. Infighting is extremely rare.

Using the hub concept, groups tend to frequently change players, and the groups are usually stuck in the pre-performing stages of the group dynamic. Experienced players tend to know the all of the general tactics, etc... but the new people are just nearly lost, most of the time. So you end up with teams that can be above average, but even a full group of very talented individuals cannot easily reach the full final stage of teamwork. That takes time.

Yet, the real advantage of the Hub approach is the ability to quickly form groups and improve their effectiveness as a group by following a few general common guidelines. It's a numbers game, you can form new groups faster and in larger numbers than any elite team can integrate new members into their elite group. You don't have to beat KCOM if you can conduct five times as many attacks as they can.

General guidelines + rapid group formation = FW victory.

#18 Jack Booted Thug

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Posted 30 April 2016 - 01:11 AM

View PostRustySpork, on 27 April 2016 - 08:13 AM, said:

OP said this guy wasn't -SO-, so I'm gonna go ahead and guess that it was Idealsuspect. He's an ******* in this particular way. Also, his unit went ov8er to Kurita yesterday, so he's their problem now.


We cringe whenever he is on our side. A complete *** in chat, on comms, and will never share armor, runs back to dropzone or back out to dropship to save his mech.

He will happily lose every match as long as his Kdr is preserved. Him and unknownhero are the last people you want on your team.

They stay in the rear always.


#19 Mister Bob Dobalina

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Posted 30 April 2016 - 02:16 AM

View PostSteamCharts Kerensky, on 26 April 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

Step 1. Tuffen up.

Step 2. Stop and ask yourself if what he's saying is correct.



I just had a terrible drop that way the other day, where one player was misbehaving verbaly and even started shooting at teammates to get them in line. Of course he was too shy to take real command, he was just constantly yelling at others. To rely to point 2 of your list: There is nothing correct in calling teammates p***y, c**t, m****rf****r, f**k, stupid a*****e, dumb f**k, and about every iteration of the f-word. He ended up being muted within minutes by the others just to rant on over chat. It was probably his compulsive behaviour to have audience for his superior ranting about everybody being bad and so much worse than him that his awesome was the first to go. That being cheered and thanked upon on chat to all by our team. So glad I have it on screen recording.

The ego of certain players is ever so often way bigger than their actual capabilities. And usually that goes with an insatiable thirst to make that superiority known to anyone. Forcefully if needs be. True chamions in comparison are humble in their capabilities, guiding and enforcing their teams. They are mentoring lesser players instead of wearing them down.

I am lucky to have a "mentor" that kept me in the game, encouraging me when I was on the brink of leaving beghind MWO when I was on a losing streak. Raubwurst (max Kudos, man!) He guides calmly and clearly and does not waste words on judgement or interpretation and he doesn't waste time for VOIP or chat that is not informative for the job at hand: coordinating a team and winning the match.

And yes, I can still have fun not having to use colorfull language and yes, I do it as well. At that point I give you that: point 2 can be valid. But there are boundries. The ones that can’t thoughen up are leaving MWO pretty fast anyway because it can be pretty hard on a nuub to begin with.

Rest assured that some of us are pretty hard on themselves already and you don’t want to hear the names I am calling myself making stupid errors, dying early, doing like no damage or even f**k up my team by give away an ambush by mistake ore anything similar. So I rather like constructive critique than someone dishing out rude remarks without any trace of actual information about whatever truth. A **** is a **** and I can search forever I won’t find any gold in it.

Sorry for the long post, here’s a german potato: Kartoffel

Edited by Thomster, 30 April 2016 - 02:20 AM.


#20 Seal Farmer

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 01:04 AM

View PostRustySpork, on 27 April 2016 - 08:13 AM, said:

OP said this guy wasn't -SO-, so I'm gonna go ahead and guess that it was Idealsuspect. He's an ******* in this particular way. Also, his unit went over to Kurita yesterday, so he's their problem now.

Thought Ideal was French though


View PostJack Booted Thug, on 30 April 2016 - 01:11 AM, said:

We cringe whenever he is on our side. A complete *** in chat, on comms, and will never share armor, runs back to dropzone or back out to dropship to save his mech.

He will happily lose every match as long as his Kdr is preserved. Him and unknownhero are the last people you want on your team.

They stay in the rear always.

So much truth in these words

Edited by Seal Farmer, 07 May 2016 - 01:04 AM.






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