59 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Butterbee just posted, and she is pretty.


Quirks:

Don't seem much of a downgrade, if any from current CPLTs:

OK can be more accurate now with new quirks

That said, the last time any of the Dev's were queried, they were supposedly not adding hardpoints to the other CPLT Models, meaning all other CPLTs will be set at 6 hardpoints vs the Buttebee's 8. One would have imagined that Quirks might be used to offset that, but looking at the rather hefty quirks the BB has, that seems dubious.


So, am wondering, did they reverse course and add those 2 extra hardpoints to the other CPLTs?


also:
• Catapult (all variants): Movement Archetype changed from Large (25°) to Medium (30°).


Should they?
What do you think?

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 17 June 2016 - 05:29 PM.

[Yosharian]

They already have all the tools they need to avoid variants getting obsoleted.

1) Match strengths using different quirk levels (i.e. more hardpoints = less quirks)

2) Create role warfare (e.g. variant with 3 or less energy hardpoints more suited for bringing heavier energy weapons so give range quirks, variant with 4 or more energy more suited for boating smaller energy weapons so give laser duration quirks/heat gen quirks)

[Damien Tokala]

I think it is to balance out the meta brawlers. The more common ones involve srm6 in 4 or more and an array of medium lasers.

Currently not many innersphere mechs can do this, but plenty of clan mechs can.

I think "butterball" here will be bringing some much needed reinforcement to the innersphere brawler class.

[Juodas Varnas]

I'm really hoping they do add the 2 hardpoints to the other Catapults. They REALLY need them.

Give the A1 and C4 2 extra missile hps, C1 2 extra energy hps in the STs.

[Barantor]

I'm also wondering if this new Butterbee will have all those little missile tubes inside it like that? Is this the end of the VCR add ons? (we can only hope).

If all the other models of Catapult got 2 extra missile hardpoints (1 in each arm/ear) then it would all around be a better mech and more in line with what it is a premiere LRM and missile mech.

[WarHippy]

That being said we will probably have to wait and see, but it does look like it might the far better mech among the ones you listed.

[Alan Davion]

I just counted the tubes shown in the pictures... 35 tubes in each arm? A 20 and a 15 in each arm? Yet the mechlab boxes show 2 SRM6s.

Is it even possible for a CPLT to carry a 20 and a 15 in each arm?

It doesn't seem like it would have a whole lot of room for ammo unless the engine were dropped to the lowest possible. with endo steel chassis and you stripped all the armor off in order to fit the weapons and ammo before putting the armor back on.

[Cy Mitchell]

Damien Tokala, on 10 June 2016 - 12:11 PM, said:

I think it is to balance out the meta brawlers. The more common ones involve srm6 in 4 or more and an array of medium lasers.

Currently not many innersphere mechs can do this, but plenty of clan mechs can.

I think "butterball" here will be bringing some much needed reinforcement to the innersphere brawler class.

I do not know about that. Sure it has the 8 hardpoints but in that default loadout it is carrying the armor of a Medium class Mech. I would not want to go Brawling in that. It is going to have to drop weapons or go with a smaller engine and sacrifice mobility and speed to be able to max out its armor to go brawling.

[Barantor]

Alan Davion, on 10 June 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

Is it even possible for a CPLT to carry a 20 and a 15 in each arm?

Yes, though it doesn't leave much weight left over unless you make it really slow.

[Damien Tokala]

Rampage, on 10 June 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

I do not know about that. Sure it has the 8 hardpoints but in that default loadout it is carrying the armor of a Medium class Mech. I would not want to go Brawling in that. It is going to have to drop weapons or go with a smaller engine and sacrifice mobility and speed to be able to max out its armor to go brawling.

Ferro and endo, remove the Jets, you have a little more wiggle room.

[FrontGuard]

like i said in the other Cat post...
As all Cat players know, the Pitch (look up look down) has been the biggest drawback to these Mechs.
Its only 16%... so on maps with lots of hills you often find yourself in a situation where your enemy can shoot at you but you cant shoot back.

Would be great if there was something you could do about it, like new Modules or something.

[Barantor]

Damien Tokala, on 10 June 2016 - 12:25 PM, said:

Ferro and endo, remove the Jets, you have a little more wiggle room.

Give it an XL and keep the JJs, Catapults are one of the few mechs I keep them on because they don't feel as terrible and sometimes they need the extra mobility.

Use the weight gained by the xl and endo to give it artemis and armor.

FrontGuard, on 10 June 2016 - 12:26 PM, said:

like i said in the other Cat post...
As all Cat players know, the Pitch (look up look down) has been the biggest drawback to these Mechs.
Its only 16%... so on maps with lots of hills you often find yourself in a situation where your enemy can shoot at you but you cant shoot back.

Would be great if there was something you could do about it, like new Modules or something.

Exactly why I keep JJs on mine...

[Damien Tokala]

Barantor, on 10 June 2016 - 12:28 PM, said:

Give it an XL and keep the JJs, Catapults are one of the few mechs I keep them on because they don't feel as terrible and sometimes they need the extra mobility.

Use the weight gained by the xl and endo to give it artemis and armor.



Exactly why I keep JJs on mine...

I never bothered with Artemis. My brawler style is to hug you and slam all those missiles into your face.

The lasers are to poke at you.

But I firmly believe that this mech will be one of the top brawlers again.

[totgeboren]

I hope the hitboxes stay the way they are now. I like that the CPLT is sort of XL friendly. And maaan, the new 'pults are tiny! This will be like getting a new mech!

[FrontGuard]

Barantor, on 10 June 2016 - 12:28 PM, said:

Exactly why I keep JJs on mine...

Yes... I get that. But I like removing the JJs and adding extra heat sinks or a larger engine.
anyway, I will have one.

[MookieDog]

Archer-5S anyone? Better hit boxes, lower profile, doesn't cost as much, extra missile launcher, higher laser points- center torso/head (awesome for TAG), MUCH better range of motion..

While the quirks are nice for the "Butter Ball", the only one I would consider buying/driving would the the -C4 because of the missile cool down and heat quirks. But a mech called the catapult with no missile range quirks, riiiight.

I just do not see any reason why someone in this mech would get anywhere near close to most types of clan mechs in the "Butter Ball". Ok so the "Butter Ball" has, 4 SRM6 w A, 4MPLs and has jump jets, I just do not see this mech as a brawler for the IS. If its loaded with LRM 10's and some LL's maybe "medium range" support. In the end, it will most likely end up as most other IS mechs: "Wub Ball", "Vomit Ball", "Splat Ball", or "Lurm Ball".

Edited by MookieDog, 10 June 2016 - 12:52 PM.

[Damien Tokala]

Oh dear... My nickname for it is catching on...

[LordNothing]

i think the butterbee suffers from 'doesn't do anything new' syndrome. doa.

[Bishop Steiner]

Yosharian, on 10 June 2016 - 12:10 PM, said:

They already have all the tools they need to avoid variants getting obsoleted.

1) Match strengths using different quirk levels (i.e. more hardpoints = less quirks)

2) Create role warfare (e.g. variant with 3 or less energy hardpoints more suited for bringing heavier energy weapons so give range quirks, variant with 4 or more energy more suited for boating smaller energy weapons so give laser duration quirks/heat gen quirks)

having the tools, and actually using them.... not happening in Vancouver since 2012.

Damien Tokala, on 10 June 2016 - 12:11 PM, said:

I think it is to balance out the meta brawlers. The more common ones involve srm6 in 4 or more and an array of medium lasers.

Currently not many innersphere mechs can do this, but plenty of clan mechs can.

I think "butterball" here will be bringing some much needed reinforcement to the innersphere brawler class.

Agreed. But how will it balance against other CPLTs. That, is equally important.

WarHippy, on 10 June 2016 - 12:16 PM, said:

That being said we will probably have to wait and see, but it does look like it might the far better mech among the ones you listed.

Indeed. Those mods WILL make all CPLTs more effective, I imagine. I'll likely be too busy running my K2 to care too much, TBH. I don't see this as being a run out day 1 Hero for me, personally, though. Good chance I will get it when it goes on sale, but I got too many dusty heroes in my mechbay as it is.

Alan Davion, on 10 June 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

I just counted the tubes shown in the pictures... 35 tubes in each arm? A 20 and a 15 in each arm? Yet the mechlab boxes show 2 SRM6s.

Is it even possible for a CPLT to carry a 20 and a 15 in each arm?

It doesn't seem like it would have a whole lot of room for ammo unless the engine were dropped to the lowest possible. with endo steel chassis and you stripped all the armor off in order to fit the weapons and ammo before putting the armor back on.

more importantly.... thats a lot of tons for two very substandard weapon systems. Be better with like 4x LRM5, and large pulse lasers backed by CT Mediums, or such.

[Bishop Steiner]

ghetto LRMBee
LRM10s represent 2x LRM5 with a ton of ammo, plus the extra ton. Add in LRM5 cooldown, and you would have apretty rapid fire (not as good as the MDD mind you) LRMs with hard lasers support.

Not 100% how sustainable it'll be as a splat mech, but I do expect that to be the primary use, still, though I'd probably go with 4xMPL and 4xaSRM4.
CPLT-C1
has tonnage and crits for the 2x aSRM4 I can't equip in Smurfy yet
CPLT-C1

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 10 June 2016 - 01:40 PM.